On Economics Libertarian > Conservative > Liberal > Progressive

[Phier]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...930932412.html

Who is better informed about the policy choices facing the country—liberals, conservatives or libertarians? According to a Zogby International survey that I write about in the May issue of Econ Journal Watch, the answer is unequivocal: The left flunks Econ 101.
Zogby researcher Zeljka Buturovic and I considered the 4,835 respondents' (all American adults) answers to eight survey questions about basic economics. We also asked the respondents about their political leanings: progressive/very liberal; liberal; moderate; conservative; very conservative; and libertarian.
Rather than focusing on whether respondents answered a question correctly, we instead looked at whether they answered incorrectly. A response was counted as incorrect only if it was flatly unenlightened.
Consider one of the economic propositions in the December 2008 poll: "Restrictions on housing development make housing less affordable." People were asked if they: 1) strongly agree; 2) somewhat agree; 3) somewhat disagree; 4) strongly disagree; 5) are not sure.
Basic economics acknowledges that whatever redeeming features a restriction may have, it increases the cost of production and exchange, making goods and services less affordable. There may be exceptions to the general case, but they would be atypical.



Therefore, we counted as incorrect responses of "somewhat disagree" and "strongly disagree." This treatment gives leeway for those who think the question is ambiguous or half right and half wrong. They would likely answer "not sure," which we do not count as incorrect.
In this case, percentage of conservatives answering incorrectly was 22.3%, very conservatives 17.6% and libertarians 15.7%. But the percentage of progressive/very liberals answering incorrectly was 67.6% and liberals 60.1%. The pattern was not an anomaly.
The other questions were: 1) Mandatory licensing of professional services increases the prices of those services (unenlightened answer: disagree). 2) Overall, the standard of living is higher today than it was 30 years ago (unenlightened answer: disagree). 3) Rent control leads to housing shortages (unenlightened answer: disagree). 4) A company with the largest market share is a monopoly (unenlightened answer: agree). 5) Third World workers working for American companies overseas are being exploited (unenlightened answer: agree). 6) Free trade leads to unemployment (unenlightened answer: agree). 7) Minimum wage laws raise unemployment (unenlightened answer: disagree).


How did the six ideological groups do overall? Here they are, best to worst, with an average number of incorrect responses from 0 to 8: Very conservative, 1.30; Libertarian, 1.38; Conservative, 1.67; Moderate, 3.67; Liberal, 4.69; Progressive/very liberal, 5.26.
Americans in the first three categories do reasonably well. But the left has trouble squaring economic thinking with their political psychology, morals and aesthetics.
To be sure, none of the eight questions specifically challenge the political sensibilities of conservatives and libertarians. Still, not all of the eight questions are tied directly to left-wing concerns about inequality and redistribution. In particular, the questions about mandatory licensing, the standard of living, the definition of monopoly, and free trade do not specifically challenge leftist sensibilities.
Yet on every question the left did much worse. On the monopoly question, the portion of progressive/very liberals answering incorrectly (31%) was more than twice that of conservatives (13%) and more than four times that of libertarians (7%). On the question about living standards, the portion of progressive/very liberals answering incorrectly (61%) was more than four times that of conservatives (13%) and almost three times that of libertarians (21%).
The survey also asked about party affiliation. Those responding Democratic averaged 4.59 incorrect answers. Republicans averaged 1.61 incorrect, and Libertarians 1.26 incorrect.
Adam Smith described political economy as "a branch of the science of a statesman or legislator." Governmental power joined with wrongheadedness is something terrible, but all too common. Realizing that many of our leaders and their constituents are economically unenlightened sheds light on the troubles that surround us.
Mr. Klein is a professor of economics at George Mason University. This op-ed is based on an article published in the May 2010 issue of the journal he edits, Econ Journal Watch, a project sponsored by the American Institute for Economic Research. The article is at: http://econjwatch.org/articles/econo...y-of-americans

The left is always trying to paint conservatives as dumb, afraid of progress, etc. Most of those use biased samples etc but the move is there to show those of us on the right as somehow stupid. So I have to enjoy this one, showing what has been so blatantly obvious, the left has NO understanding of simple economics.

Raising taxes, cutting supply, raising overhead, all seem lost on the left when it comes to show how government policy can negatively effect the economy. I've heard some wacky stuff over the years, and apparently the problem is they simply fail to grasp what the realities are.

We really didn't need a study to know this, but I have to wonder if this is a learned attitude, is it simply a product of how their minds function, or is it sort of a faith based idea where they warp the realities to fit their 'faith'?

This is a serious question to consider because properly educating these people is crucial to long term economic prosperity. My personal feeling is that closer to a faith, which means education will be difficult as their own ideologies will prevent them from accepting the change in thinking.

[Jabberwock]

That survey should be renamed: "Are you a self-proclaimed conservative/libertarian? You are if you get these right."

Moderates, liberals, progressives got them wrong because they're obviously not a self-proclaimed conservative/libertarian.

Here I got one: Should the Civil Rights Act extend into private business? If you answer yes, you're a dumb ass... and a leftist.

[Phier]

That survey should be renamed: "Are you a self-proclaimed conservative/libertarian? You are if you get these right."

Moderates, liberals, progressives got them wrong because they're obviously not a self-proclaimed conservative/libertarian.

Here I got one: Should the Civil Rights Act extend into private business? If you answer yes, you're a dumb ass... and a leftist.

"Restrictions on housing development make housing less affordable." I fail to see how this would be anything but obvious as an answer and really should have nothing to do with ones political ideology. A liberal might think that housing development should be restricted, knowing full well it raises the price. The two are really not connected. Its not a value judgement question.

[Jabberwock]

"Restrictions on housing development make housing less affordable." I fail to see how this would be anything but obvious as an answer and really should have nothing to do with ones political ideology. A liberal might think that housing development should be restricted, knowing full well it raises the price. The two are really not connected. Its not a value judgement question.

Well, maybe that's one of the questions the "leftists" got right.

But questions like these expect predictable answers from a certain group of people:
5) Third World workers working for American companies overseas are being exploited (unenlightened answer: agree). A libertarian/conservative will most obviously disagree.
6) Free trade leads to unemployment (unenlightened answer: agree). Same thing here.
7) Minimum wage laws raise unemployment (unenlightened answer: disagree). If a libertarian/conservative doesn't strongly agree...

This survey is geared towards libertarians/conservatives. I could create a survey geared towards those are more left leaning and say "Haha, look. Libertarians/conservatives don't know economics."

[magickyleo101]

I'm with Jabberwock here. Some of these questions have absolutely nothing to do with economics (the third world exploitation question) while others are misleadingly worded (the house "affordability" question).

What's more, the answers here are graded as "correct" or incorrect" based on their degree of fit with neoclassical economic theory, and many liberals reject neoclassical economics (e.g. Keynes). Doing so doesn't make you some kind of economics dullard. It makes you not a libertarian.

And as for questions like the monopoly question - I wonder how much of a split between liberals and conservatives there was there.

[Phier]

Well, maybe that's one of the questions the "leftists" got right.

Ummm no, read the article, then come talk about it.

I'm with Jabberwock here. Some of these questions have absolutely nothing to do with economics (the third world exploitation question) while others are misleadingly worded (the house "affordability" question).

What's more, the answers here are graded as "correct" or incorrect" based on their degree of fit with neoclassical economic theory, and many liberals reject neoclassical economics (e.g. Keynes). Doing so doesn't make you some kind of economics dullard. It makes you not a libertarian.

And as for questions like the monopoly question - I wonder how much of a split between liberals and conservatives there was there.

Come now Macky, you wouldn't have done so poorly on it, you are looking for excuses for those that did.

[chilon]

These are not really questions from basic Micro-economics or Macro-economics. Whoever came up with those questions does not deserve to be an economics professor.

At least questions like these:

"2) Overall, the standard of living is higher today than it was 30 years ago"
"5) Third World workers working for American companies overseas are being exploited "


are pure rubbish and have nothing to do with Economics knowledge.

[Sphere]

It would have been a much more informative study if the questions were more straight forward micro-economic questions that simplified things down to supply, demand, cost of production etc. as that tends to get rid of the obscuring nature of reality.

I mean for the minimum wage question, my economics professor said that most markets set a minimum wage of some sort, and that government policy usually doesn't have a great effect on unemployment unless it sets minimum wage far above the market minimum wage. Likewise with rent control, that the general problem is not a shortage of quantity but a lack of satisfying the demand for quality. Besides the monopoly question, there seems to be an intentional attempt to get as far from strict academics so as to obscure the fundamental economic understanding, which is unfortunate.

All that being said, I do think there is a case to be made of a lack of economic education on the left, more so in the electorate rather than the leadership. I think the most most effective case for progressive economic policy is "Clintonomics" which has pretty much carried on into Obama's current rhetoric. That is leave markets alone, use the tax proceeds to help those left behind.

This was branded as "redistribution" by the right which it essentially is, but in reality it is far more economically efficient than trying to provide a safety net through intrusive methods like minimum wages, rent/housing control, employment regulation etc. as has been done in Europe. Taxes do cause inefficiency, but it is a simple an predictable inefficiency that in practice is a small price to pay for a stable and fair society.

[chamaeleo]

At least half of the questions do appear to lean towards a Conservative stance. It'd be interesting to repeat the survey with reversed questions, ie:

"6) Free trade leads to employment."

How many "enlightened" Conservatives would answer True?

Wording is everything. The questions appear to direct Liberals towards their gut feeling, whereas Conservative heartstrings are unhampered and they are allowed to follow their official doctrine.

[Kiljan Arslan]

Hey phier thanks for giving us an absolutely loaded little piece. Good to see that we can count on people giving out . It ws so enlightening. How about you "enlighten" us more Phier.

[Rolling Thunder]

Huzzah for creating amusingly biased surveys. I do wonder who commissioned this one...

[Zadig]

I don't understand why people are debating Phier on this, he's obviously the smartest person here!

Tell us great one, Keynes is indeed a dumb is he not?

(I'm not particularly a "leftist" as you would say, however I find your blatant partisanship completely disgusting).

[Каие]

Newsflash: Bias survey produces bias results.

Analysis: Almost all of them were loaded questions, carefully worded, and the parameter for ''dumb answers exhibiting ignorance in economics'' is coincidentally whatever disagrees with neo-liberal economic theories or perceptions.

Conclusion: Lies, damn lies and statistics. Nothing proven right or wrong.

Resultant contribution of the survey to American politics: Political, intellectual and academic debate is further dumbed down and made a mockery of to satisfy partisan fetishes.



I'm not going to comment much about the theories and evidence behind these questions because as we all know American economics and society and policy differs greatly from it's British counter part, as does the actual political spectrum and definition of political terms. But really now Phier, are you that insecure of your political beliefs that you must find and exploit every opportunity possible to show that the ''Left'' is dumb while constantly making sure everyone knows you are part of the ''Right''? Both sides have their idiots and their dumb faction, but you do yourself and right wing politics no favours at all by creating a political debate on that platform. Nor does the other side which engages in precisely what you are doing. Take, JP, an economist, who although vehemently disagreeing with his Marxist and the like economic colleagues and professors, does not think them stupid or somehow inferior to him.

One thing I've learnt from reading a ton of books on economics and globalisation and all related boring crap, is that for every argument there is a counter argument, for every statistic there is a counter statistic, for every counter statistic there are excuses and cop outs ready. I've worked out there are few areas where there are genuine rights and wrongs in economics, with the vast majority of it being nothing short of opinion and perception as to what it preferable for what aim. The fact of the matter is economic beliefs reflect what one wants. Few people read economics extensively and decide on what works. Some want social justice of varying descriptions and hence justify everything according to that, others want low taxes and thus justify everything according to that. Regardless, the pretence that politics is one sided is precisely the opposite of what everyone needs.

[Phier]

I realize the easiest excuse is 'biased source, I ignore it, lalalalalala I can't hear you', and we all know Zogby is a conservative think tank (sarcasm), but lets take the least most academic question, one where absolutely nothing political can be drawn, and if you get it wrong you just have absolutely no clue at all.

The easiest question, a question that just asks, 'Is your brain turned on?'.

A company
with the largest
market share is
a monopoly.

Agree (wrong answer)- (30.8% Progressive) (27.9% Liberal) (26.0% Moderate) (12.5% Conservative) (13.5% Very conservative) (6.8% Libertarian)

Show me the bias here, HOW is this question loaded against the left? Its like saying 2+2 = 4 is a loaded question.

So forget the questions which require real thinking like about minimum wage laws, explain this one to me, how is this a biased question? Why does the left do so badly on it?

[Каие]

One question.

But if you're asking me how ideological orientation factors into answering a question like that, it's quite simple. Technically, obviously a monopoly is not a company with the largest market share. But in the eyes of many who take an anti-Business and Market-sceptic approach would say a dominant market share is an effective monopoly. Now that's wrong... but is that evidence of stupidity and idiocy or of ideological cultivation affecting perception? I say the latter.

[Claudius Gothicus]

Your particular usage of the word 'Left' describes a wide and cloudy bunch of ideologies and individuals that Marx himself would be disgusted to be associated with.

But let's be realistic, centralized economies which seems like your main enemy here are dumb, ever since capitalism developed out of traveling merchants in antiquity and again in medieval times centralized and planned economies were doomed to fail, the individuality of enterprise is what made our society develop so fast in the last 200 years.

The real question however should be Has the state the right to become an important player in the "Market of individuals(Private owners)"?

In my opinion it does, but only in certain fields: Education, Health and Defense.

-Social security should be re-administered since it only creates demagogy and parasitic classes.

-State funded companies should be privatized leaving the state only a 'overseeing' role.

Economy should be administered by legal means: Creating laws that stop predatory and destructive uses of the Market Economy(such as the Cause of our latest crisis, yes I'm looking at you dumbs and the Bush Administration), nothing else.

Oh and by the way: WE ALWAYS NEED A STUDY. The day we take things for granted is the day we stop being scientific and start being metaphysic or pseudo scientific.

[chamaeleo]

I realize the easiest excuse is 'biased source, I ignore it, lalalalalala I can't hear you', and we all know Zogby is a conservative think tank (sarcasm), but lets take the least most academic question, one where absolutely nothing political can be drawn, and if you get it wrong you just have absolutely no clue at all.

The easiest question, a question that just asks, 'Is your brain turned on?'.

A company
with the largest
market share is
a monopoly.

Agree (wrong answer)- (30.8% Progressive) (27.9% Liberal) (26.0% Moderate) (12.5% Conservative) (13.5% Very conservative) (6.8% Libertarian)

Show me the bias here, HOW is this question loaded against the left? Its like saying 2+2 = 4 is a loaded question.

So forget the questions which require real thinking like about minimum wage laws, explain this one to me, how is this a biased question? Why does the left do so badly on it?

Cherrypicker! That is indeed unbiased, or at best it's very subtle. I like it better when phrased in haiku format:

A company with
the largest market share is
a monopoly

At any rate, I don't disagree with your basic message, that liberals are less savvy with economic terminology. It is rooted mostly in a fundemental difference in perspective, relating to how each individual weighs negative vs positive connotations in a scenario. For instance when your typical liberal hears of an impending housing development, he reacts to the news as would a tenant: focusing on evictions, destruction of historical structures, increased population density, cheaper construction quality, more difficult parking and higher rents...regardless of the fact that 20 mediocre 2 BR units are being replaced with 40 upscale lofts, increasing the OVERALL availability of housing for the area. The typical conservative takes the landlord's view: focusing instead on a better return on investment property and higher class renters.

[Kiljan Arslan]

Phier your source was a political hachet job. Nice job trying to cover up your rather horrible source.

[The spartan]

After reading this thread all I can think about is "No Sherlock". Economics is right up a Libertarians alley. Try giving them the same test on comparative politics and see how they compare with "leftists".

Whats more, is that while Libertarians know how economics works, they seem to (at least from my experience) run away with the idea. They tend to start making normative claims rather than positive claims, which is ironically a large hypocrisy for a Libertarian.

[Ältester der Motten]

After reading this thread all I can think about is "No Sherlock". Economics is right up a Libertarians alley.

Erm, how so? As far as I am aware the "left" economical tradition is far more pronounced.

Also, this survey is complete rubbish.

Some of these questions revolved around political themata rather than economical ones. Such as if exploitation occured, since the definition of exploitation is a political one.

Funnily enough, you will also see that different economic schools offer different answers, because each approaches economy differently, so even the questions of truly economical nature are not necessarily so straightforward in their answer as it might seem like.

Also what BWB said.