balancing the good AI?

[wupwup]

as rohan i find it realy easy. yet as any other good faction i find it impossible to help rohan. by turn 20 they are beyond help and it is rare you can build a good army / have the economy to suport it / have a safe starting position. i dont think making rohan stronger is the answer, as they are easy anyway to play. i think the problem is once gondor looses minas tirith its only a matter of time before mordor declares war due to an invasion or whatever. after that they dont stand a chance. same in the north east. rhun always seems to take out dale realy easily. is there some way to make allies work together more? as the only benidfit having an ally is is that you know that border is safe. in history i think alliances where formed allong the lines of we will provide X amount of troops if you go to war. is there any way you could make that in-game implimentable? so dale gets a half stack of erabor axemen if war is declared whith rhun?

[Lordinquisitor]

Well, without the aid of the player the evil guys should actually win. So everything is right, i think.

And no, you can`t make allies work together. Hardcoded.

[eregost]

The evil guys should be the stronger team.

[wupwup]

but not so strong that they wipe out the map imediatly. i agree they should be powerful. but you should have a little longer to rush to the aid of your alies.

[Russian Gondor]

Well. Technically, shouldn't evil have large armies that good kills easily? Rohan's cavalry should be killing everything.

[son of romans]

Move your feet faster and you will be bad guy wich will kill Rohan !!!

[Russian Gondor]

What do you mean by move your feet? I almost defeated Rohan for Isengard but they kept on kicking Mordor and taking over Mordor and Elven settlements.

[Beregond]

I'm even upset that now Gondor is holding pretty well.

Evil factions should be stronger. much stronger than good ones

[Russian Gondor]

Evil gets epic bodyguard and later units such as Balrog, Mumakil, Trolls, etc.

And it would defy lore that evil units are walking meat sacks that just overwhelm the enemy.

[Phier]

The only problem I have with playing evil, especially Mordor is the economy. Lore wise Mordor should be very rich getting tribute from the south but in the game, its rather lethargic.

Playing the RCRR submod helps out a bit with this, evil has hordes of meat sacks.

[Hermes Trismegistos]

as rohan i find it realy easy. yet as any other good faction i find it impossible to help rohan. by turn 20 they are beyond help and it is rare you can build a good army / have the economy to suport it / have a safe starting position. i dont think making rohan stronger is the answer, as they are easy anyway to play. i think the problem is once gondor looses minas tirith its only a matter of time before mordor declares war due to an invasion or whatever. after that they dont stand a chance. same in the north east. rhun always seems to take out dale realy easily. is there some way to make allies work together more? as the only benidfit having an ally is is that you know that border is safe. in history i think alliances where formed allong the lines of we will provide X amount of troops if you go to war. is there any way you could make that in-game implimentable? so dale gets a half stack of erabor axemen if war is declared whith rhun?

Are you really playing with the newest version? I experienced all these problems (if they even can be considered problems, as others pointed out, evil should be stronger) only with earlier versions, not with 1.4.1.

[jinjo]

as rohan i find it realy easy. yet as any other good faction i find it impossible to help rohan. by turn 20 they are beyond help and it is rare you can build a good army / have the economy to suport it / have a safe starting position. i dont think making rohan stronger is the answer, as they are easy anyway to play. i think the problem is once gondor looses minas tirith its only a matter of time before mordor declares war due to an invasion or whatever. after that they dont stand a chance. same in the north east. rhun always seems to take out dale realy easily. is there some way to make allies work together more? as the only benidfit having an ally is is that you know that border is safe. in history i think alliances where formed allong the lines of we will provide X amount of troops if you go to war. is there any way you could make that in-game implimentable? so dale gets a half stack of erabor axemen if war is declared whith rhun?

i partially agree with u, dale is mostly crused by rhun
but in new version, gondor is strong enough to resist mordor and harad
i played 7-8 campaigns (1.4.1 version) and mordor and harad cant destroy gondor
though, SE are hard to play because mordor cant destroy gondor and then it punishes SE

[Baywatch]

Yet the OotMM get crushed every single campaign by the northern good factions, particularly the Dwarves. Not to mention there are two more good factions than evil factions. So, you have powerhouse good factions up north, and powerhouse evil factions down south. All seems pretty fair and balanced to me.

[JorisofHolland]

i partially agree with u, dale is mostly crused by rhun

How long do you play? In all my (RR/RC) campaigns, Dale conquers nearly all of Rhûn in about 50-70 turns, often with a few settlements going to the Dwarves (who, BTW, loose territory to the OotMM).

[jinjo]

How long do you play? In all my (RR/RC) campaigns, Dale conquers nearly all of Rhûn in about 50-70 turns, often with a few settlements going to the Dwarves (who, BTW, loose territory to the OotMM).

i don't play RR/RC. i play just 1.4.1 (no sub-mods)

[Baywatch]

often with a few settlements going to the Dwarves (who, BTW, loose territory to the OotMM).

Interesting, I play RC/RR and I've never once seen the Dwarves not crush OotMM. Although, I do always see the Dwarves and Dale double team Rhun and beat them fairly early. The Dwarves always just seem to be unstoppable for the ai factions in all of my campaigns.

[Arágion]

In my campaings OotMM always take East side of the Misty Mountains pretty easily... they get beated by HE but they totally destroy SE and the Dwarves....?

it only takes about 20 turns when they manage to take Caras Galadhon from SE. After that they advance into Mirkwood, taking every town in their way to there

In my latest campaing OotMM have destroyed SE and nearly the Dwarves, and they own everything from the Misty Mountains to the town of Dale (except Dol Guldur). And as the SE always get destroyed, Mordor is free to launch assaults from Dol Guldur into the lands of the Rohirrim. And as Rohan is already getting hammered by Isengard, Mordor is too much for them.

And I, playing as Gondor have send couple of stacks to help them, to reclaim their territories, but Goblins, Mordor and Isengard are too much for even me. There has been no invasions from Mordor itself into my lands, and now I understand why.... And Harad offered me an alliance....?? something is messed up, and badly and for some reason Mordor didn't attack me before turn 100 or so, so I had plenty of time to build everything up. My river towns and castles have full garrison of Gondor's best soldiers (infantry, spearmen, archers) -> easy to defend, as I can recruit them everywhere.

Gondor is an economy powerhouse, so I won't get destroyed so easily but still, a hard game is waiting for me.

oh and, dwarves only have the Blue mountains, HE have only their coastal cities left and Eriador is being hammered by Isengard

Who said that OotMM always get destroyed by the good factions?

[Chabneruk]

As far as I know, Rohan has two big disadvantages:

1. The first Invasion (AI) is always sent against Edoras (at least in my "good" games), which weakens them. The second one goes mostly for the Hornburg and only rarely against Osgiliath.

2. Isengard is a Citadel from the beginning. As soon as they have the armored Uruk-Hai (not those raiders) they destroy the Cavalry easy enough.

I played with dwarfs and sent a diplomat to Rohan. They controlled land up to the western shore. I thought: Okay, time enough to take Moria first. About 15 turns later I had Moria and all Rohan had left were the two towns at the Anduin River - even without invasion.

I retook their lands and defended their last cities (and gave them back most of their territory as gifts, although that never changed relations above the very good level...). And then I saw what happened: Isengard somehow had aquired a superior general and he won heroic battles at almost every Rohan city. The markers were still there.

This general in combination with their troops was obviously far to powerful. Maybe it was somehow scripted that if one evil faction is destroyed, another one grows stronger. Anyway, as I said: He crushed Rohan in 15 turns...

[Baywatch]

Who said that OotMM always get destroyed by the good factions?

Here I thought steamrolling Dwarves was a universal thing with TATW. I guess you learn something new everyday. Perhaps it has something to do with me playing an older RC/RR version. Jan. 18th just because I'm too lazy to update before 2.0 is released.