Page 1 of 19 1234567891011 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 445

Thread: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    Hilarion's Avatar Vicarius
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    2,727

    Default Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/id..._by_the_crown/

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Saved by the crown

    What monarchs offer modern democracy

    By Joshua Kurlantzick
    May 23, 2010

    The tumultuous past two months in world politics have brought a surprise with them: Suddenly, monarchy seems relevant again.

    In Belgium, where the fragile government constantly is on the verge of collapse, King Albert II has been essential in trying to prevent its dissolution, mediating between leading politicians and pushing them back to the bargaining table. After Britain’s recent election, as politicians from the Labor, Conservative, and Liberal Democrat parties struggled to negotiate a ruling coalition, Queen Elizabeth’s presence reminded Britons that the country retained institutions that would prevent it from really melting down.

    And most notably, in Thailand, the chaos that has ruled the streets of Bangkok stems partly from fear over the country’s future after the eventual death of increasingly frail 82-year-old King Bhumibol Adulyadej, who has helped resolve past political crises by forcing the leaders of the army and the demonstrators to meet and reconcile. Without him, notes James Ockey of the University of Canterbury in New Zealand, “Thailand may not be able to resolve future crises without major conflict.”


    The idea of a monarch may seem like an anachronism in a 21st-century democracy, a relic of an earlier era in which a small elite intermarried and ruled much of the world, while most average people had no say. And to be sure, in states where kings and sultans still actually rule, like Brunei, Jordan, and Morocco, monarchs can be every bit as oppressive and opaque as any other dictatorship. Morocco’s King Mohamed VI, for example, presides over “repressive legislation to punish and imprison peaceful opponents,” according to Human Rights Watch. In Brunei, Jefri, the brother of the ruling sultan, allegedly embezzled billions in state funds, which he spent on some 2,000 cars and a lasciviously named royal yacht, among other items.


    But in Europe and parts of Asia, many politicians, political scientists, and citizens have lately developed greater respect for the positive role a constitutional monarch can play in democracy. As in Belgium, monarchs can be arbiters of last resort when elected politicians cannot resolve deep divisions. They can offer their nations a unifying figure to prevent political crises from spiraling into something worse. And in an era of partisanship and diminished individual rights, monarchs can serve as a means of stability in a democracy that might otherwise tear itself apart. A.W. Purdue, author of the book “Long to Reign?”, argues that a king or queen “enables change to take place within a frame of continuity.”


    Some political scientists have even argued for reviving defunct monarchies in the interest of democracy, especially in developing nations where monarchs could serve as figures of national unity to prevent ethnic and tribal bloodletting. Cambodia did so in the early 1990s following its civil wars, and the king helped inspire average Cambodians and heal wounds after the Khmer Rouge era. After the toppling of the Taliban in 2001, Afghanistan welcomed back former king Zahir Shah to launch the Loya Jirga and serve as a figure of unity as political parties bargained to build Afghan democracy. In Iraq, Sharif Ali bin Hussein, a descendant of the last monarch, has begun publicly arguing that a constitutional monarchy could help reduce the vicious ethnic and sectarian divides roiling the country. In Laos, where people can see the Thai monarchy on Thai television broadcasts, the exiled royal family has become a rallying point for some opponents of the authoritarian government. Southeast Asia academic Michael Vatikiotis argues, in an essay pushing for a return of the crown in neighboring Burma, that monarchy provided a unifying factor in that diverse society — a unifier ripped away during British colonial rule and never effectively replaced.


    “The forlorn hope of progressive political change in Burma using all modern means,” he writes, “suggests that reaching back in time and resurrecting the long-dismantled monarchy could provide a prescription.”


    Although the House of Windsor dominates global media coverage of monarchy, in reality 12 European countries still have monarchs, as do Cambodia, Japan, Thailand, Malaysia, Bhutan, and other nations. Despite occasional republican movements that attempt to end the monarchy, polls show strong support for the crown in nearly every nation that has one. In the Netherlands, 70 percent of respondents in one poll wanted to retain the monarchy; in Spain, 65 percent of respondents supported it; in Japan, the number was 82 percent. In many of these countries, poll respondents have more respect for the monarchy than any other public institution.


    Many modernizing countries have found that a monarch provides a source of authority and national identity that stands apart from political squabbles. He or she can serve simply as a figurehead, or more substantively as a kind of independent power center that can check the worst impulses of elected politicians, in the way that a Supreme Court or House of Lords might.


    Although a ceremonial president can fill this role, as in Israel or Germany, the monarch has a unique claim on the public imagination. Neil Blain, an expert on modern monarchies at the University of Stirling in Britain, says the monarch’s symbols, like the scepter and crown, can’t be replicated by a ceremonial president. The queen, he says, “attests, however mythically, to the country’s political stability and enduring historical foundations.”

    “The English do not wish to see the queen on a bicycle,” he says, “because from where people stand here she looks just right in a Rolls-Royce Phantom or better still, a horse-drawn carriage.”


    In developing nations, modern monarchs can do more than provide links to the past — they can help usher in democracy. In Bhutan, King Jigme Singye Wangchuck pushed his once-isolated country toward its first truly democratic elections. In Spain, King Juan Carlos midwifed a new Spanish democracy after dictator Francisco Franco’s death. In Cambodia, King Norodom Sihanouk returned to the country after the wars of the 1970s and 1980s and helped oversee a transition to democracy in the 1990s that brought the country a vibrant, if sometimes rough and bloody, democracy.


    Some of these monarchs also helped bring economic and cultural modernization. The royals of Bhutan have prodded their citizens to embrace the Internet, satellite television, international trade, and other modern changes. Saudi Arabia’s King Abdullah, though not a constitutional monarch, has been credited with pushing for social and economic reforms that have diluted the power of the conservative religious establishment and pushed the kingdom to invest in science and technology education.



    European monarchy experts also now see a growing role for kings and queens at a time when countries are becoming more diverse. As democracies take in more and more immigrants, and countries give up some of their national identities to superstructures like the European Union, these changes can make national unity more difficult, and a monarch can serve to welcome newcomers and help them feel like citizens.


    Sweden’s king, Carl XVI Gustaf, for example, has used the monarchy to integrate immigrants. In one famous speech, he said that “new Swedish citizens...have come here from countries all over the world...under these circumstances it is precisely the strength of the monarchy that the king can be an impartial and uniting symbol.” The Netherlands’ queen, Beatrix, has used royal speeches to call for tolerance at a time when right-wing anti-Islamic politicians have made headway among the Dutch public.


    Scholars of monarchy also suggest that, in an era of tightening internal security and control, when elected politicians are amassing previously unheard-of powers and courts are loath to challenge them, a monarch can safeguard public freedom. Eamonn Butler, director of the Adam Smith Institute, a think tank in London, recently argued in the Financial Times that Queen Elizabeth has stood aside too often while the prime minister has become too powerful, but that she remains a figure, under the British constitution, who could check the executive’s power. “The only solution is to make our current constitution work,” Butler wrote. “It certainly means having a monarch who is prepared to intervene on behalf of the people.” In fact, Britain’s unelected House of Lords — often criticized as a relic of a vanished feudal aristocracy — has played a similar function, trying to limit the British government’s surveillance efforts and other new powers.


    Similarly, in Cambodia former King Sihanouk (who has since stepped aside because of health reasons and now holds the title of King Father), frequently clashed with Prime Minister Hun Sen, who is elected but has amassed near-dictatorial powers in his office. Sihanouk frequently criticized Hun Sen’s strongman tactics, and invoked the royal institution as the protector of average people abused by the prime minister.


    Monarchs, however, must walk a very fine line. Because today’s constitutional monarchs’ power is so nebulous, to use it effectively they must be extremely careful in wielding it.

    In Thailand, King Bhumibol Adulyadej frequently has used public speeches to criticize what he sees as politicians who are too venal or power-hungry — which sometimes has veered into a political alignment with Bangkok-oriented elite parties and against parties aligned with rural people, who came to Bangkok and eventually led the demonstrations that resulted in violence. “The palace is thus very much in politics, although the general myth is that the king is above politics,” says Irene Stengs, an expert on the Thai monarchy at the Meertens Institute in the Netherlands.



    In fact, the king sanctioned the 2006 coup, after it happened, that deposed populist former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra. With these actions, Bhumibol — who is protected from public criticism by strict lese majeste laws — has chipped away some of the respect he earned over decades. Among the “red shirts” battling the government, one has begun to hear anti-monarchical sentiments, though they are careful not to disdain the current monarch. In contrast to many previous rallies in Bangkok, the red shirts did not hold up noticeable photos of the king this time — interpreted as a sign of distrust of the palace.


    Nepal’s royal family recently learned of the devastating consequences when a king overtly takes sides. After a Maoist insurgency rooted in the rural regions challenged Nepal’s parliamentary government in the late 1990s and early 2000s, then-King Gyanendra in 2005 took control of the government himself and attempted to dominate the security forces and to wipe out the Maoist movement. The suppression failed, even parliament turned against the crown, and the Maoists eventually took power in Kathmandu as part of a power-sharing agreement. In 2008, with Gyanendra’s reputation in tatters, Nepal created a republic and abolished the monarch, and Gyanendra moved out of his palace like a delinquent tenant.

    For now, most of the other constitutional monarchies seem to have absorbed the lessons of places like Nepal. In Spain, Juan Carlos, though given an extremely conservative education and hailing from a conservative background, has worked with politicians from across the ideological spectrum. In Britain, even as the Labor, Conservative, and Liberal Democrat parties haggled with one another about forming a new government, Queen Elizabeth did not appear in public to bless any of their leaders — although she personally, according to Britain’s Daily Telegraph, disdained the Labor policies of Tony Blair. And according to British tradition, when the new Parliament convenes for the first time and the government formally announces its agenda for the year, the person who reads the speech — as she always does, no matter who is setting the policies — will be the Queen.


    Is there hope for the world after all, if an American journalist can look past the Western ultra-democracy bias and recognise the tangible benefits of monarchy?
    Last edited by Hilarion; May 26, 2010 at 09:01 PM.

  2. #2
    s.rwitt's Avatar Shamb Conspiracy Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Lubbock, Tx
    Posts
    21,514

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Well hell, if a journalist said it....

  3. #3
    Manco's Avatar Dux Limitis
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Curtrycke
    Posts
    15,076

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    He cuts corners a bit. For example in Belgium a king has also been the cause of one of the biggest crises ever, when there was strong opposition to Leopold III after WWII. Leopold was seen as having collaborated with the Nazi's.
    And right now, while Albert II himself is a stabilizing factor, the monarchy isn't. Flemings and Walloons are pretty divided on what happens after Albert II dies, the heir Philip being seen as rather dumb, incompetent, being too clerical and obsessed with keeping onto the king's powers.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Quote Originally Posted by Viscount Bolingbroke View Post
    http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/id..._by_the_crown/



    Is there hope for the world after all, if an American journalist can look past the Western ultra-democracy bias and recognise the tangible benefits of monarchy?
    yeah, there could be hope for the world only if we see the joys of monarchy.
    Optio, Legio I Latina

  5. #5

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Romania, Bulgaria, Greece, Albania, Serbia could surely benefit form a return to monarchy.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Quote Originally Posted by CiviC View Post
    Romania, Bulgaria, Greece, Albania, Serbia could surely benefit form a return to monarchy.
    sure they could...
    Optio, Legio I Latina

  7. #7

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonius View Post
    sure they could...
    I'm glad you agree

  8. #8
    Adrian's Avatar Campidoctor
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Dacia
    Posts
    1,846

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Quote Originally Posted by CiviC View Post
    Romania, Bulgaria, Greece, Albania, Serbia could surely benefit form a return to monarchy.

    I hope that was sarcasm on the "net" its hard to tell.



    As for monarchy nope thanks some incompetent as king unelected, I prefer our system.
    .........


  9. #9

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Quote Originally Posted by Adrian View Post
    I hope that was sarcasm on the "net" its hard to tell.
    It's not sarcasm.



    Quote Originally Posted by Adrian View Post
    As for monarchy nope thanks some incompetent as king unelected, I prefer our system.
    Yeah, the system works so fineee ... (this is sarcasm).

    In Romania we have such a competent president he brought the country on the brink of disaster by abusing his powers, perverting the constitution, subordinating the governement, falsifying the elections and installing a corrupt clique in power.

  10. #10
    Adrian's Avatar Campidoctor
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Dacia
    Posts
    1,846

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Quote Originally Posted by CiviC View Post
    In Romania we have such a competent president he brought the country on the brink of disaster by abusing his powers, perverting the constitution, subordinating the governement, falsifying the elections and installing a corrupt clique in power.

    We still are a ing democracy in the EU, and I can't abide someone who rules by blood, Base is a a but hes better than some unelected , and the elections were stolen ? thats a new one PSD transported s with the buses and had a monopoly on the small villages, so don't start about that , they all stole as Ponta said, but PDL had a more efficient system lol.


    You want a return of the king like in LOTR? the same ones who allied us to nazi germany? look how great that turned out, the russians ed us over that little war.
    Last edited by Adrian; June 09, 2010 at 10:49 PM.
    .........


  11. #11

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Quote Originally Posted by Adrian View Post
    We still are a ing democracy in the EU, and I can't abide someone who rules by blood, Base is a a but hes better than some unelected , and the elections were stolen ? thats a new one PSD transported s with the buses and had a monopoly on the small villages, so don't start about that , they all stole as Ponta said, but PDL had a more efficient system lol.
    Yeah, only that the king don't rules, while Basescu rules not by blood but by alcohol. And the falsifying the elections means not only the ppresidential elections but by also falsfying the will of electorate at parliamentary elections by bribing traitors from Social-Democrat Party and National-Liberal Party to join his presidential party.

    P.S. I'm not a PSD sympathiser.

    Quote Originally Posted by Adrian View Post
    You want a return of the king like in LOTR? the same ones who allied us to nazi germany? look how great that turned out, the russians ed us over that little war.
    I sugest you to study constitutional monarchy from serious sources not from fantastic movies or video games ... I see Comunists made a good job at brainwashing people minds and this perpetrates to younger generations too.

    And you know that not King Michael allied with Nazis, the King ended that alliance saving the country from becoming a war theatre and possibly being being made a part of Soviet Union and he was also the last bastion against Comunists and Soviets.

  12. #12
    Tiberios's Avatar Le Paysan Soleil
    Patrician Moderator Emeritus

    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Cimbria
    Posts
    12,702

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Quote Originally Posted by Adrian View Post
    As for monarchy nope thanks some incompetent as king unelected, I prefer our system.
    Except these "imcompetent" systems (West European monarchies) works just perfect.
    Last edited by Tiberios; June 09, 2010 at 04:57 PM.

  13. #13
    Deadly Virus's Avatar Civis
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    London, England, UK
    Posts
    180

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Quote Originally Posted by Kralle18 View Post
    Except these "imcompetent" systems (West European monarchies) works just perfect.
    I don't see taking away people's basic right to become to elect their head of state as "perfect". Just because a system isn't causing any major problems doesn't mean it should be kept as it is. It's just ridiculous. Constitutional Monarchy is a pathetic and desperate attempt to keep the wealthiest families of Britain at the top of the country. You can argue all you want about how the Queen has no power and can't make any serious changes to the country, she is still in the highest possible position of power there is in Britain. I really do find it disgusting that Monarchism still lingers in modern European society, and that countries such as Britain actually have the nerve to call themself democratic. We will never be democratic until we throw away this terrible remnant from our medieval past and toss it into the dustbin of history, just as we did with the British Empire and all the other ancient relics that have kept our society held back for so long. There is simply no need for Monarchism to exist in the modern world, when Democracy (TRUE democracy, not this twisted fusion of democracy and monarchism you all seem to be in favour of) works just as well, and in some cases, even BETTER.

    I'd like you to give me one good reason why the current Monarchs of each of the modern European kingdoms has ANY more right to rule their country than any other man or woman in their nation.










  14. #14
    Tiberios's Avatar Le Paysan Soleil
    Patrician Moderator Emeritus

    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Cimbria
    Posts
    12,702

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadly Virus View Post
    I don't see taking away people's basic right to become to elect their head of state as "perfect".
    How is it a right to be head of state. The use of the word right is used to much these days. It's misuse of the damn word.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadly Virus View Post
    Just because a system isn't causing any major problems doesn't mean it should be kept as it is. It's just ridiculous. Constitutional Monarchy is a pathetic and desperate attempt to keep the wealthiest families of Britain at the top of the country. You can argue all you want about how the Queen has no power and can't make any serious changes to the country, she is still in the highest possible position of power there is in Britain. I really do find it disgusting that Monarchism still lingers in modern European society, and that countries such as Britain actually have the nerve to call themself democratic. We will never be democratic until we throw away this terrible remnant from our medieval past and toss it into the dustbin of history, just as we did with the British Empire and all the other ancient relics that have kept our society held back for so long. There is simply no need for Monarchism to exist in the modern world, when Democracy (TRUE democracy, not this twisted fusion of democracy and monarchism you all seem to be in favour of) works just as well, and in some cases, even BETTER.
    It works. I'm not gonna repeat the points that has been said over a hundred times. In short, the Queen, because she is not involved in party politics, provide a fine neutral head of state.

    Besides all that you mentions would never be rectified by introducing a republic. Western European constitutional monarchies have proven that they are just as free and democratic than European republics. Calling a Britain an undemocratic nation is just ridicoulus. If an unelected head of state is the meassure ondemocracy, then Germany and Israel aren't democracies either.

    Besides a monarchy can be a unifying institution in a way a republic's head of state never can be.

    Western European monarchies are just as up to date as the republics. All abolishment of these would just be change for the sake of change and accomplish nothing.


    Quote Originally Posted by Deadly Virus View Post
    I'd like you to give me one good reason why the current Monarchs of each of the modern European kingdoms has ANY more right to rule their country than any other man or woman in their nation.
    Firstly, because their populations overwhelmingly suppports them.

    Secondly, because they happen to be hereditary monarchies and the current monarchs happened to be the one chosen to rule by line of succession.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadly Virus View Post
    I just love how you monarchists seem to think that every elected leader is incompetent and unfit to rule.
    and I just love how you think a president is automatically better than a monarch.


    Quote Originally Posted by Stavroforos View Post
    Indeed, which is why people brought back the monarchy at the end of communism.
    Yes because that can't have anything to due with communist propaganda alienating the monarchy or the new political elite and their apparent corruption and hunger for power.
    Last edited by Tiberios; June 10, 2010 at 02:25 AM.

  15. #15
    .......................
    Civitate

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    33,982

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Good article. It's rare we see the political argument for a Monarch, it always revolves around the red herrings of ''privilege'' and ''money'' which dominate arguments about the Monarch in the UK. I personally welcome Prince Charles, or King George VII as he is likely to be crowned. Having read leaked material on him behind the scenes, I feel he will be a modernising and reforming Monarch, albeit one who needs to be checked a little bit. For instance in recognising the downfall of Anglicanism in the UK, he aims to readjust his role from being defender of the faith, to defender of faith. A positive thing where I'm standing from.

    When people became naturalised citizens in this city they had to put hand on hearts in front of a portrait of the Queen in the Civic Hall and swear the oath. A baptism into becoming British. A direct continuation of the historical and most crucial element of British citizenship, loyalty to the Crown, which itself has symbolised this country for as long as anyone can remember. Even when it was a Commonwealth. It just wouldn't be the same without one. Any replacement of the Monarchy will only give the illusion of some kind of progress and principle, when in reality all it will do is allow the ruling political classes, and the damned Parties, to claim another Office as a prize.

    The good thing is the Crown is the Constitution, so it actually can't be done.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Quote Originally Posted by Яome kb8 View Post
    Good article. It's rare we see the political argument for a Monarch, it always revolves around the red herrings of ''privilege'' and ''money'' which dominate arguments about the Monarch in the UK. I personally welcome Prince Charles, or King George VII as he is likely to be crowned. Having read leaked material on him behind the scenes, I feel he will be a modernising and reforming Monarch, albeit one who needs to be checked a little bit. For instance in recognising the downfall of Anglicanism in the UK, he aims to readjust his role from being defender of the faith, to defender of faith. A positive thing where I'm standing from.
    An adaption to the large population of british immigrants, who of many are religious but not christian I see?
    Another step in the islamization UK! Allah Akbritannia!

  17. #17
    Tiberios's Avatar Le Paysan Soleil
    Patrician Moderator Emeritus

    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Cimbria
    Posts
    12,702

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Very good article.

  18. #18
    .......................
    Civitate

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    33,982

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    Quote Originally Posted by DividerOfZero View Post
    An adaption to the large population of british immigrants, who of many are religious but not christian I see?
    Another step in the islamization UK! Allah Akbritannia!
    Erm, actually it is because Prince Charles is said to be a closet Orthodox Christian, and the largest practising Christian denomination in the British Isles is no longer Anglicanism, but Catholicism. 85% of immigrants to Britain are White Catholics from Eastern Europe, you see. Finally, it's because Anglicans no longer have a monopoly on the Monarchy, the law was changed (or in the process of being changed) I believe to allow a Catholic to ascend to the throne, hence it would be a constitutional contradiction if a Catholic was Defender of the Anglican faith.

    Then again, you are a foreigner and hence forgiven for not knowing these intrinsic facts of public knowledge, so I will not chastise you for this. Heads up for next time though.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    A "closet Orthodox Christian" ? How does that work? And since I'm an Orthodox Christian, could you tell me about any differences in rites or beliefs of Anglicans as compared to
    the Eastern Church?
    Screw multiculturalism and the horse it rode in on



  20. #20
    .......................
    Civitate

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    33,982

    Default Re: Journalist admits "Monarchy seems relevant again"

    i would presume that Charles is more spiritually in-line with some Orthodox teachings... but cannot legally convert, as the King or Queen must be an Anglican, and you must be an Anglican to stay in the line of succession. His dad was Greek Orthodox. I don't know if he really is, but he is interested in it, definitely.

Page 1 of 19 1234567891011 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •