Gauls.. too easy too beat ?

[TTRouble]

After defeating Rome in my Macedon campaign, I've ended up have the Gauls go all kind of crazy - and theyve posted a 11-12 full stacks against my 5 right at the border in Caspain Gaul. Whats surprised me after 4 battles and defeating all four Gallic armies that they've sent, is how easy they are to beat, esp after the really hard battle's against Rome. Against Rome, the hammer and Anvil tactics with Cavalry never really worked as the legions would hardly ever route and usually the Trairii would counter the cavalry charge but with the Gauls, as soon as I take out the General or my spartans/hoplites/swordmen crush a unit or two attacking the flanks of the phalanx, the Gauls just route, including all of their heavy swordmen units. Its even more annoying as the Getae and Dacian's like to stick it out for a lot longer as well !

My Macedonian armies after campaiging against Rome are pretty battle hardened and all are either silver/gold armour and weapons but should the Gauls just crumble that easily ???


TTRouble

[Titus Maximius Thongus]

gauls have very finicky morale, and their standard infantry is nothing to scream about. it's only their elites that pose a real threat, but usually there are so few of them that they dont make a huge impact on big battles or they rout when the rest of the levied troops mass rout.

My 2nd Augusta legion fresh out of Italy managed to rout a 10,000 strong army of gauls in an open pitched battle (no corner camping, no ambush, just a epic epic clash of two titanic armies on an open field)

Was quite an interesting battle. I didnt matter where i told my archers to fire, they killed something wherever they fired. and it was impossible for me to launch hammer and anvil strikes due to the sheer volume of gauls across the plains. they covered like a quarter of the map

but i just ground them down with my legions, and at a critical point in the battle i pushed my first cohort up my center and killed their general, causing a mass rout. then my surviving cav and light auxilla charged out and slaughtered the frightened goats. goats make good eating yes?

[RJA]

What I noticed with them is that after their initial conquests they tend to consolidate. Certainly Gaul. Almost all of their cities are huge by now probably. The problem is that they have a lot of levy troops from the beginning of your campaign, but as you kill those in the first years of war, they won't train those guys anymore. From now on they will train armoured warriors, belgae milnacht (sp?) swordsmen, heavy spearmen and where they can elite celt warriors. Facing full stacks of those is a lot more challenging then facing their levy armies consisting of slingers, light spearmen, gallic swordsmen, some noble cavalry (they always give you a frontal charge, and having phalanxes makes that fun to watch) and a few elites.
Give them a chance to build up, and they will give you trouble. For some reason they are always one of the strongest and richest factions in all my campaigns. The can field a huge amount of armies with only a few regions.

RJA

[TTRouble]

What I noticed with them is that after their initial conquests they tend to consolidate. Certainly Gaul. Almost all of their cities are huge by now probably. The problem is that they have a lot of levy troops from the beginning of your campaign, but as you kill those in the first years of war, they won't train those guys anymore. From now on they will train armoured warriors, belgae milnacht (sp?) swordsmen, heavy spearmen and where they can elite celt warriors. Facing full stacks of those is a lot more challenging then facing their levy armies consisting of slingers, light spearmen, gallic swordsmen, some noble cavalry (they always give you a frontal charge, and having phalanxes makes that fun to watch) and a few elites.
Give them a chance to build up, and they will give you trouble. For some reason they are always one of the strongest and richest factions in all my campaigns. The can field a huge amount of armies with only a few regions.

RJA

I've sent a number of spies over to take a look and your spot on about their cities their huge .. everything is maxed out. So i was expecting them to be really hard to deal with.

I've met and defeated an army that was basically 60% "armoured warriors, belgae milnacht (sp?) swordsmen, heavy spearmen and where they can elite celt warriors" but they didn;t hold out for too long either and thats what got me thinking were they too easy. The first 2-3 armies were mainly light spear men, with a sprinkling of the real heavy units but the last one definitely wasn't, so hopefully it crumbling the way they did was a one off (although some of units might not like that!)

TTRouble

[TTRouble]

Ok.. I've just played out a couple of battles against the Gauls.. and well on (H/VH) theyre just too easy to beat. even with their best troops.

Battle 1 - Gallic Army consisting 70 % heavy infantry - armoured warriors, belgae milnacht swordsmen, heavy spearmen + 1 heavy cavlary and general (5 star) total : 4317 men

End of the battle:

Macedon - men 3238; Kills 3938, men left - 2865
Gaul - men 4317; kills 541, men left 376.

I had my Spartans, Greek sword and Corinthian Hoplites on the right flank of the phalanx and on the left 2 x Athenian Hoplites and Celtic Swordmen. I had the Spartans charge the first unit of armoured warriors and Belgae warriors, and then sending in the hoplite and sword units routing those 2-3 units, causing most of the other near units to flee and as soon as the General was killed their centre completely collapsed. My Athenian's and celtic swordmen on the left were in a bit of sticky situation but sending my Heavy cavalry in with the Spartan's finally broke the last 3 gallic units there.

The second battle was even easier...although the second army was mainly spearmen (60%) so either theres something up when playing against the Gauls at H/VH or theyre just too easy .

Mac -men 2865; kills - 4295 men left - 2654

Gaul: men 4576; kills 256; men left - 277


TTrouble

[samurai89]

Are you mad boy? Gaul with her billion strong armies marching on your gates is not "too easy to beat"....

[C-Rob]

I find it difficult to hold onto my possessions for long in Gaul land though.

Unrest is painfully high.

[Lord Lancelot]

You are kiding? Gauls are very strong after some 30 turns, i always watt for some time and only then start expand, their Elite wariors and Belgae Swordsmens are threat for my legions.

[Sharpe]

TBH the game is a wee bit unbalanced. Cimmerinian Swordsmen can take on 4000 gallic tribesmen and win alone. RS2 however, will be more realistic.

[Arlin]

Those Cimmerian Swordsman mercs are so amazing. I bought two groups once and watched them rip apart barbarian units like no other. Totally got my money's worth from them.

[Sharpe]

Im currently playing as Bosporan (Fave faction) and use them as front line shock troops, coupled with the killing power of Bastarnae and Falxmen its unstoppable.

[Arlin]

Interesting. I'll be sure to keep that in mind. Once I finish or grow tired of my current Pergamum campaign I plan to start a Bosporan one. What's your take on how they should expand? The Sarmatians are there obvious first enemy although the settlements up in the steppes aren't worth much. Is it best to build a small navy and jump the sea to hit Pontus and take Asia Minor?

[Sharpe]

Interesting. I'll be sure to keep that in mind. Once I finish or grow tired of my current Pergamum campaign I plan to start a Bosporan one. What's your take on how they should expand? The Sarmatians are there obvious first enemy although the settlements up in the steppes aren't worth much. Is it best to build a small navy and jump the sea to hit Pontus and take Asia Minor?

Take out Sarmatia, then advance south into Armenia through modern day Georgia (Be sure to take Sinope first to launch incursions from the west) and you'll likely get to the stage I am now. A horrendous multi stack war with a pumped a up selecuid Empire.

[Drowsy]

Rule 1, art of rtw -- always take out Macedon first.

[Themis]

Rule 1, art of rtw -- always take out Macedon first.

or rome, whomever is closer...

[Drowsy]

or rome, whomever is closer...

That doesn't make sense since u'll of course be playing Rome.

Rule 2 would be to send your diplomats to Gaul and bribe away your redundant gold to stay below the 50k while keeping your cities qued up. With some luck this will result in German and Iberian expansion giving you some time to civilize your new Macedonian provinces.

[jus2121]

Rule 1, art of rtw -- always take out Macedon first.

In my campaign i'm allied with macedon(playing as rome of course) but macedon is losing hard, they cannot stand against the mighty greek allied with pergamum,, maybe i need to help macedon because if they are destroyed the greek will be to powerfull!!... hmmmmy campaign can become interesting,, not?

[Drowsy]

In my campaign i'm allied with macedon(playing as rome of course) but macedon is losing hard, they cannot stand against the mighty greek allied with pergamum,, maybe i need to help macedon because if they are destroyed the greek will be to powerfull!!... hmmmmy campaign can become interesting,, not?

Let them When the Greeks are done land your armies and a bunch of spies near Athens and start capping away there money making villages, ally yourself with Pergamum or make them a vassal state

[jus2121]

If I propose to pergamum to become a vassal state they never accept! I need to siege some cities of them or I need to offer a lot of money right???

[TTRouble]

Pergamon . phaaa .. I'm giving them and their Ptolmey's allies a real pasting as well and out of the 5 armies I have in Asia Minor only 2 were battle hardened - against the Dacians and Gatea. I've also got Syracuse on the backfoot in Sicily as well.

So in terms of hardest factions so far :

1. Rome - Every battle was hard one, hardly ever routed and usually would fight to the end.
2. Geata/Dacia - some really crazy full on battles with them. Those falx men can just rip through a phalanx if theyre not stopped early. More to come as they've not been defeated.
3. Greek/Syracuse - Not really fair to put the greek cities in this list as they were taken out so early.
4. Gaul/Pergamon/Syracuse - a lot easier than I thought they would be, and the Gauls more so esp with their best units.

I know the Ptolmey's are going to be hard to beat once I move east out of Asia Minor but so far they've not sent too many Agema/elite phalanx and hoplite armies . The real monster I think is going to be Parthia as their the richest Nation in the campaign at the moment - thought of all those Persian horse archers, cataphracts and cataphract horse archers is not nice at all !!

TTrouble