Diplomacy.

[Michael^]

I'm sorry if this topic doesn't belong here, but I wanted to see your opinions on Diplomacy in Empire:TW.

The problem I'm facing is, quite stupid (in my opinion) offers / counter-offers from other countries. That did happen in Medieval2:TW, but some patches partly solved that. The problem that persists now, is AI's (not quite clear) perception.

Yeah, I do consider the bonuses such as same government, history of the countries, joint enemies / allies, or anything else that comes into effect, but yet a lot of my QUITE generous offers are declined with "no waaaaay".

It might be a problem that I was playing Russia for quite some time (Orthodox vs Other religions, main problem in Medieval2), and well, might be hated for the territorial expansion (poor countries who share borders with me), but still I don't get how some countries decline such offers they'd benefit greatly from while I gain not that much.

[eXistenZ]

Diplomacy has always been trouble in total war. Honestly, i rather hve them make stupid offers than constantly backstab you

[Michael^]

Yeah, but I dunno why would Spain need Russian region in far east they got no access to and some techs, in exchange for alliance and 7.5k gold.

[Archimonday]

There are a number of poorly tweaked variables that account for the poor AI. One of them for instance is a variable about noncontiguous expansion, or in other words: territorial expansion where the expanding nation is not adjacent to the region its expanding to. While this is there to allow the AI to work with colonies, it ends up presenting the problems that you are facing.

Look for a number of mods that work with the AI and choose your favorite. If you cant find one or you want me to upload my (now dead) AI mod again, I will.

[Michael^]

There are a number of poorly tweaked variables that account for the poor AI. One of them for instance is a variable about noncontiguous expansion, or in other words: territorial expansion where the expanding nation is not adjacent to the region its expanding to. While this is there to allow the AI to work with colonies, it ends up presenting the problems that you are facing.

Look for a number of mods that work with the AI and choose your favorite. If you cant find one or you want me to upload my (now dead) AI mod again, I will.

Can't disagree.

Every country is given some regions it has to capture to win the campaign, but I enjoy some kind of realistic, long and difficult game. Not a row of easy similiar fights that results in picking a building to destroy, building a church and exempting region from taxes temporarily for it to settle down. In my game Poland-Lithuania, due to lack of actions from my side (partly), managed to nearly destroy both Austria (it lost Vienna, managed to keep /ONLY/ it's lands obtained in a war with Ottomans, and Prussia (left in pieces).

Thank you for the advice, I'll search for some mods (I'd really love to see something involving France. Similiar to the Guerre de Cent Ans historical conflict (There's a Medieval2:TW mod like that).

[Daneboy]

I think that the diplomacy has been severly improved in the latest (and last) patch.

Now you can actually persuade enemies to accept peace if the deal is sweet enough.

.....or they have no other option

[Maesar]

I think that the diplomacy has been severly improved in the latest (and last) patch.

I agree. The diplomacy sucked in RTW and MTW2. It was hard to make factions your vassal even if you stood on their doorstep with 20 armies and they only had one territory.

I love the way how they look at you, if you do or do not have the same government type or religion, etc. Though it is kinda hard when playing the Dutch, as it is hard to find the same country with the same governmenttype and religion.

Much more realistic.

[Michael^]

I agree. The diplomacy sucked in RTW and MTW2. It was hard to make factions your vassal even if you stood on their doorstep with 20 armies and they only had one territory.

I love the way how they look at you, if you do or do not have the same government type or religion, etc. Though it is kinda hard when playing the Dutch, as it is hard to find the same country with the same governmenttype and religion.

Much more realistic.

Indeed, those factors are cool enough.

Also if you move the cursor over the country name in the diplomacy list, there's a list of positive and negative aspects that give a "total" amount, do the relations improve, or not (+/-). Though I wish it was possible for them to determine such factors as, their threats, other countries' expansion (I don't see why Prussia and Austra, having lost Vienna (not sure about the Berlin, too), left with two provinces, would've declined a military alliance with Russia, the only possible savior from a war with them.

Poland, despite all those factors, is one of the most capable factions as they've got enough territories, a bit more developed cities, Russia's occupied with other things at the east, plus the relationship with them is decent from the start. While Prussia to the West and Austria, to the south / west, are quite weak (from what it seems to me). While it's not really supposed to be so, is it?

[Ahlerich]

etw has the best diplomacy of all games i think. bear in mind though as harder as you set your campaign difficulty as less efficient will diplomacy be.
military access is powerfull to get a deal. money works but you will need to pay s.

[dutch81]

etw has the best diplomacy of all games i think. bear in mind though as harder as you set your campaign difficulty as less efficient will diplomacy be.
military access is powerfull to get a deal. money works but you will need to pay s.

Exactly I play N/N and rarely have weird offers ... although the Ottoman were reluctant to give me a cease fire when I played as Russia ... but once I sacked Constantinople (although I couldn't hold it due to rebellion) they did give it to me.

But you have to contain yourself to keep it challenging ... small armies and few schools or otherwise it gets too easy.

[Michael^]

Exactly I play N/N and rarely have weird offers ... although the Ottoman were reluctant to give me a cease fire when I played as Russia ... but once I sacked Constantinople (although I couldn't hold it due to rebellion) they did give it to me.

But you have to contain yourself to keep it challenging ... small armies and few schools or otherwise it gets too easy.

Frankly, I only started as N/N and switched to VH/VH later (just because I was unsure I could take all the changes so easily and quickly), though most of the problems disappeared once I got trade routes and good relations with Spain and France.

I wish there could be alliances and multi-faction negotiations.

I know that ETW isn't a game about that, but from real life, diplomacy is not only around set, limited amount of direct proposals about one or another thing. Would love to see some system that would expand the diplomacy better, or possibly a mod, even. ;o

[Archimonday]

I think normal is the best setting if you want a more peaceful game. There are a few ways you can improve your relations on that setting, first and foremost is negating the use of Peace Treaty's wherever possible. At most I have one or Two Allies, some people see it fit to ally themselves with the whole world and when a war starts they are flabbergasted when suddenly everyone hates them.

Minimum treaty's maximum trade routes is my strategy.

Secondly, even if not at war, keep as large a military as possible, a large military does alot to influence AI decision.

[Michael^]

I think normal is the best setting if you want a more peaceful game. There are a few ways you can improve your relations on that setting, first and foremost is negating the use of Peace Treaty's wherever possible. At most I have one or Two Allies, some people see it fit to ally themselves with the whole world and when a war starts they are flabbergasted when suddenly everyone hates them.

You got me a bit wrong here. I want an /active/ game. With a lot of realism and diplomacy.

Minimum treaty's maximum trade routes is my strategy.

Ye', maximum trade routes, though I find blockades more useful. =P

Secondly, even if not at war, keep as large a military as possible, a large military does alot to influence AI decision.

Clearly. As well as the other dozens of bonuses that affect their attitude towards you.



Although, I can't refrain from saying this again -

I wish there could be alliances and multi-faction negotiations.

I know that ETW isn't a game about that, but from real life, diplomacy is not only around set, limited amount of direct proposals about one or another thing. Would love to see some system that would expand the diplomacy better, or possibly a mod, even. ;o

It either has to be a major mode, or possibly some kind of new parameter for the new game of TW series, "Historical / Realism mode", which would involve some /events/ (similiar to those three major american powers have, "capture "this this this", and "this" goes under your control"), vivid diplomacy and possibility to forge alliances not just faction + faction, but multi-alliances, possibly some more proposals.

I'm not sure if the community demands that over a re-worked "AI intellect" to increase the varieties in combat, not just straight similiar battles that just require nothing but "Know how-to". Hate that it turns into criticism, but the point was - Such a mode would possibly be just LOVED by the players who want to see some kind of a realistic game like that. <:

[Ahlerich]

by very hard campaign setting you will not get a realistic game experience though and little diplomacy because the ai diplomats will behave like burning zombies on pcp. they will want territories and money a lot and if you refuse they will want your blood. its like diplomacy with hitler