July 23rd. Enhanced fighting stats, archers and cavalry specific: Updated for RC may 22

[Berserker1]

Ok for anyone who are not really satisfied with archers, here is a submod for ya. If you believe nothing should be changed, turn around, go away, get out!

Basically, if you want faster gameplay, play this. It is more action oriented. Gone are the days of decisive victory after decisive victory, you really have to do something special to get that. It is designed considering how the AI is, so the stats are made to give the AI a fair chance. The only way you are going to get a decisive victory is if you use cav against nothing but swordsmen, but cav cost a lot in this game, so you win because you had way more costly units on the field.

Latest update:
cav charges increased and balanced for all factions.


UPDATED TO LATEST RC VERSION
changed game dynamics considerably.

-settlements have been changed to be able to output more units
-all good factions have significantly reduced units (except rohan horsemen). I reason I did this is because I just felt that the evil faction did not sufficiently outnumber the good factions in a realistic way. It improves game performance, also gives you the feeling that the evil side has massive numbers. Balancing kill ratios as much as I can with factions like dale and gondor.
-Berserker numbers reduced significantly, increased stats. If you did not notice, my name is berserker, I want these units to be special.
-Uruk crossbows (1/4 their normal size) and archers (1/2 their normal size) reduced significantly.
-Isengard general units are no longer halberds, but regular uruks who are basically more skilled.
-raider units for evil factions are spaced so they are not to "formal" looking. same with ranger units, so they are not similar to regular army units, and thus makes you want to hide them.
-Archers are expensive, carry 12 arrows normally (like in medieval times), they deal large ammounts of damage, humans are better at archery compared to orcs. Expect archers to always do a lot of damage, most units will only be able to take a couple of arrow hits, but whether they hit or not, is determined by the quality of the troops. You can basically tell if they are accurate arrows versus innacurate, one the units are prestine, and have lots of armor. And two, what their looks tell you. Also the blood effect has been taken out, and it adds an arrow mod that makes it so the arrows do not disappear.
-Physics in game greatly improved for trolls, ents, balrogs, siege weapons, and mumakils.
-cavalry charges have been vastly improved, they have much greater affect, but I increased their cost to counter their improved charging.
-keep in mind that spearmen and pikemen are better against cavalry, THAT DOES NOT MEAN they will kill them outright, and can still get run over the same. But pikemen are much better at slowly them down.
That is all, have fun! Give feedback.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=XQXOUE0Bcontains all necessary files, just copy to your data folder in the mod section of the medieval total war folder . I would recommend that you try darths ai modification, it really works with this submod.

make sure to download the latest EDU from page 10 on the top, I will update this download link below later.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=DKWC9L65 Enjoy the music, just put in the sounds folder inside the data folder (just right click on the third age icon, and go to "open folder." Put the description file, in the data folder, but not in the sound folder. You will enjoy the music... trust me. It contains Howard Shore music and warcraft 2 music. Now that might sound odd to have warcraft 2 music, but for one thing warcraft 2 is based on lotr... 2nd, not all howard shore music really fits with some of the situations very much. 3rd, since some music is regional, it can be weird to hear rohan music as the uruk hai, so there is a need for variation. Or music the fits both sides.

CREDITS: Drakenlorde, really helped keep the ball rolling on this, I started it, but he took it to a whole new level.

FOR ALEXANDER LOTR_TW
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=H5LNNVII

[el Cid]

Though I won't use it, I appreciate your hard work. Good job!

[Berserker1]

Hoping more people take notice. It was a lot of work, if anyone has questions please ask. The one thing I could not do, is have more serious physics, like the mumakils can throw units, but not as far as I would like. It seems like this game engine limits that type of thing for some reason. No big deal though.

[mase_elite]

Hey Berserker! This is exactly what I was thinking! Gondor battalions were way to numerous!
Can you tell me what to do with the files I just installed, I'm new so I fail at everything lol

[Berserker1]

Right now, you are just going to have to wait for export_description_units, it is no longer compatible with the current RC release (I need to delete the file until further notice). It should not be that long, go ahead and put description mount, projectiles, settlement mechanics (basically all files), in:

Sega/Total war/mods/Third Age/DATA, it should ask you if you want to overwrite any data, go ahead and do it. Go ahead and make a back up of your original folders

Nice to have some more interest, I feel my mod is so underrated. Or, people are just waiting, which do not feel like they need to post feedback (I guess it is not finished so it makes sense). This is about making the game much more quicker, it makes the way you play the game way different, which it will also make the game much harder. For example, long gone will be the days that you can shoot literally hundreds of snaga arrows at royal guards, and they would be unscathed. I mean, the horse does not have the same armor

I guess a good way to think about this mod, it gives a movie-like effect, some people like the battles to take a great deal of time, but you know how many battles there are? This changes the way the game looks too, the way the units are situated, the icons.

We kind of are the real RC, the way I see it, they really are more of a add-ons mod, as far as their real combat goes, it just corrects obvious unbalances. This is simply putting attention to detail, like the mumakils will not do an attack that kills units 50 ft away from its tusk. Drakenlorde is doing some cavalry stuff, which their is a submod for that too.

I am pretty sure my music is all in order, I did nothing with the dwarves, or the easterners, their music seemed fitting anyways. Then again, I wonder if iceland dale music would be fitting.

To Drakenlorde: I think the wargs are too strong in combat, it is not just their charges

[mase_elite]

Thanks dude!
I don't have the RC - I just play 1.4 - when I tried downloading your files with FROME it crashed my game! Lol. I didnt use FROME anyways!

[axnsan]

Well I don't think a lot of people will. RC/RR does a much better job at it

[Berserker1]

What is "it?" You do realise this adds to RC.... Right? It just changes the archers, also physics is emphasized, which RC has nothing to do. Also improving the radius of the mumakils, trust me. This adds onto the gameplay.

[axnsan]

""

Well RC already does a good job with the archers. Despite their "low" 2 - 5 attack they kill a lot of orcs with a volley, because as you mentioned accuracy plays a big part. I dunno about the mumakils and trolls, but aren't they already annoying enough ?

[MonkeyChief]

yeah i agree with axnsan - RC is a big improvement over vanilla in terms of archery, and i'm not sure adding physics to mumakil and trolls will help with balance (won't that make them even more powerful?) But you have some cool ideas (especially concerning elves, who i agree should have some stronger archer ability.

[Aikanár]

and i'm not sure adding physics to mumakil and trolls will help with balance (won't that make them even more powerful?)

It does not add it, the "throwing units around" effect is related to the mass assigned to the unit in the EDU. Trolls, Cav., Mumakils and Ents already have enough mass assigned in vanilla and RC+RR to "throw units around".

[Berserker1]

Only when charging. Though I disagree with the archers in RC, you have the most elite elven archers shoot at regular foul orcs, and like 4 die at most, kind of pathetic. I just hated having to fire multiple volleys to kill a good number of them. I am not sayying rc is wrong, but I think my way is more entertaining. This does not make the game unbalanced, because all archers are changed. 2 damage... come on, they might as well be throwing rocks, even orc raiders have plenty of armor against that.

Of course when it comes to balance, or realistic, how do you truly measure that. I think it is also about making the game more fun.

Plus, if you have not actually played with my system, do not criticize... I mean you need to do your research, otherwise your just being biased.

Trust me, this does not make archers overpowered, it does not necessarily mean that archers do more damage. Changed the dynamics if that makes sense.

Anyways, I am sure there are plenty of improvements to make. Plus there should be way more to come with confused_german.

[Baywatch]

Only when charging. Though I disagree with the archers in RC, you have the most elite elven archers shoot at regular foul orcs, and like 4 die at most, kind of pathetic. I just hated having to fire multiple volleys to kill a good number of them. I am not sayying rc is wrong, but I think my way is more entertaining. This does not make the game unbalanced, because all archers are changed. 2 damage... come on, they might as well be throwing rocks, even orc raiders have plenty of armor against that.

Of course when it comes to balance, or realistic, how do you truly measure that. I think it is also about making the game more fun.

Plus, if you have not actually played with my system, do not criticize... I mean you need to do your research, otherwise your just being biased.

Trust me, this does not make archers overpowered, it does not necessarily mean that archers do more damage. Changed the dynamics if that makes sense.

Anyways, I am sure there are plenty of improvements to make. Plus there should be way more to come with confused_german.

Weakening the archers makes the game much more melee oriented. It means a battle can not be properly fought without colliding infantry lines. As a result, battles tend to last longer since armies cannot be defeated solely by arrow fire. I believe this was the intention of the RC sub mod and I think PB did a fine job at it.

Although, I realize it's really not for everyone. Some people enjoy having archers with a bit more of a strategic importance. It's really not my style but from the sound of it, you spent some time making this. So congrats I'll find some time to give it a go.

[axnsan]

Only when charging. Though I disagree with the archers in RC, you have the most elite elven archers shoot at regular foul orcs, and like 4 die at most, kind of pathetic. I just hated having to fire multiple volleys to kill a good number of them. I am not sayying rc is wrong, but I think my way is more entertaining. This does not make the game unbalanced, because all archers are changed. 2 damage... come on, they might as well be throwing rocks, even orc raiders have plenty of armor against that.

Of course when it comes to balance, or realistic, how do you truly measure that. I think it is also about making the game more fun.

Plus, if you have not actually played with my system, do not criticize... I mean you need to do your research, otherwise your just being biased.

Trust me, this does not make archers overpowered, it does not necessarily mean that archers do more damage. Changed the dynamics if that makes sense.

Anyways, I am sure there are plenty of improvements to make. Plus there should be way more to come with confused_german.

I'm not criticising it, I'm just telling you why I think you have so few people checking out your submod.

[Berserker1]

I think people are having misconception of this mod, it does not make all archers super fast killers of the extreme, only the most elite elves would qualify for that. It just makes them a bit more useful. Makes every arrow as useful as the other, if only the units had the same bows and skill.

This is just for people who want something new, plus I can not help if people do not take notice really, because I am not really recognized on this forum. In my opinion it is their loss

Anyways, I should update it, because I do see some archers being too good like the orcs, considering they have so many units, they do more damage than I thought, also formations will be fixed with them as well. So, if anyone notices a unit does more damage than you think they should, tell me about it.

[MonkeyChief]

Of course your main problem Berserker, is that you have to compete with other submods. Can you be more specific with what this is compatible with? You mention RC in the OP - does that mean this will work with RR/RC 31st Jan? But this won't work with other submods that alter the EDU (like FROME) so you have really tough competition - people would have to sacrafice other submods to use this.

[Baywatch]

Of course your main problem Berserker, is that you have to compete with other submods. Can you be more specific with what this is compatible with? You mention RC in the OP - does that mean this will work with RR/RC 31st Jan? But this won't work with other submods that alter the EDU (like FROME) so you have really tough competition - people would have to sacrafice other submods to use this.

Yepp, which is why I have several different Third Age folders on my hard drive. Too many great submods out there to just ignore them all.

[Point Blank]

If you look at descr_projectiles, you'll see that every different arrow type in RC, and there are many, many different types, has a different velocity, range, accuracy and impact mass, as well as different damage.

Missile fire was far less effective than many think. As an example, each English archer at Agincourt shot about 100 arrows each. That's over half a million arrows. And how many casualties did they cause, on average? Less than 1 each. And these were elite archers firing at bunched targets, who were also slowed by mud etc. This also shows that armor was very effective at protecting against arrows.

If you want to make arrows more effective, you can also increase the following values in battle_config.xml:

<missile-target-accuracy>
<infantry>1.0</infantry>
<cavalry>1.5</cavalry>
<elephants>2.0</elephants>
</missile-target-accuracy>

[Baywatch]

Missile fire was far less effective than many think. As an example, each English archer at Agincourt shot about 100 arrows each. That's over half a million arrows. And how many casualties did they cause, on average? Less than 1 each. And these were elite archers firing at bunched targets, who were also slowed by mud etc. This also shows that armor was very effective at protecting against arrows.

Wow, I had no idea they were that ineffective against armor. I'd also assume the english archers were using Bodkin arrows rather than broadheads? If so that is saying alot for the quality of plate armor.

[Wolfsblut]

Wow, I had no idea they were that ineffective against armor. I'd also assume the english archers were using Bodkin arrows rather than broadheads? If so that is saying alot for the quality of plate armor.

The bodkin arrows was more effective against armor then the broadhead ones, but to pierce plated male you ve needed a lucky shot, the points wasnt hard enough.
Mainly it was "chainmail-killers", the slender, conical arrowpoint was able to break the chains and pass the protection.

The archers basicly have thrown as much arrows as possible on a certain spot in battle, they barley aimed on a single target most of the time.