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Thread: Tsardoms Total War - FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

  1. #101
    slavic_crusader's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    solved!
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    Supporter of Eastern Europe Total War!





  2. #102
    \Vazul's Ghost/'s Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Awesome horses. It'll be a shame to see so many of them get butchered...

    Good work!
    γνῶθι σεαυτόν ~ μηδὲν ἄγαν

  3. #103

    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Superb when we can play a beta?

  4. #104
    Wallachian's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Quote Originally Posted by \Vazul's Ghost/ View Post
    Awesome horses. It'll be a shame to see so many of them get butchered...

    Good work!
    haha mate wouldn't you rather butcher these awesome horses rather than those square vanilla ones?

  5. #105
    Visarion's Avatar Alexandros
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Quote Originally Posted by Wallachian View Post
    wouldn't you rather butcher these awesome horses rather than those square vanilla ones?

  6. #106

    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Quote Originally Posted by Wallachian View Post
    Great crests pheonix, never seen them before but I had assumed they were some sort of boyar heraldry Do you have the information as to what family the crests belonged to? (Just for my curiosity)
    Those crests were taken from Ian Heath's "Medieval Armies, Vol. II" book. The families the crests were taken from are not explained. By the looks of it Heath may have derived a lot of his work from Polish coats-of-arms. Abstract symbols as seen on those crests were more popular in these parts than traditional heraldry one might see West of the Elbe river.

  7. #107
    SerbianInfantry's Avatar Tiro
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Love the horses! Keep up guys!!!!!!!

    Kosovo is Serbia! If you don't believe me, read a book.

  8. #108
    Wallachian's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Quote Originally Posted by Romano-Dacis View Post
    Those crests were taken from Ian Heath's "Medieval Armies, Vol. II" book. The families the crests were taken from are not explained. By the looks of it Heath may have derived a lot of his work from Polish coats-of-arms. Abstract symbols as seen on those crests were more popular in these parts than traditional heraldry one might see West of the Elbe river.
    Hmm thats really interested, i have that book in pdf so im going to have a look at it. But if they were derived from Polish CoA I'm not sure how accurate they would be. For lack of more information we would have to make do with them

  9. #109
    Visarion's Avatar Alexandros
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Quote Originally Posted by Wallachian View Post
    For lack of more information we would have to make do with them
    you meant they will have to do? I don't get this last phrase!

  10. #110
    Wallachian's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Because there are no other sources to cross-reference this information with (at least not for all of them) what else can we do but accept them as being correct? (when I say "we" I am referring to whoever is interested in the subject)
    Last edited by Wallachian; May 15, 2010 at 03:02 AM.

  11. #111
    Visarion's Avatar Alexandros
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Thank you! that is much more clear...

  12. #112

    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Quote Originally Posted by Wallachian View Post
    Because there are no other sources to cross-reference this information with (at least not for all of them) what else can we do but accept them as being correct? (when I say "we" I am referring to whoever is interested in the subject)
    They are derived from Polish CoA but we did not use only that as our source. Much of the heraldry we have also comes from coins (green-yellow stripes for example). Of course, since seignorage was reserved for the prince, this did not provide a wide enough selection. If someone has any better sources for heraldry I'm open to suggestions.

  13. #113
    Wallachian's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Thanks for clearing this up romano. I wish i had better sources for wallachian heraldry

  14. #114
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Verry good preview. I can't more to wait playing this mod. Cheers!
    "A people with no history is a people with no future" - Nicolae Iorga

  15. #115
    Wallachian's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    @Romano

    I was reading in the preview that Vladislav Vlaicu ordered 10,000 armours from Venice. However, I have a large poster made by Radu Oltean that i bought from the History Museum in Bucharest which mentions that it was Radu I, Vladislav's son, that did this. This is also confirmed in wikipedia.ro but i don't know how reliable that is. Can you please confirm which one is correct?

  16. #116
    mircea's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Quote Originally Posted by Wallachian View Post
    @Romano

    I was reading in the preview that Vladislav Vlaicu ordered 10,000 armours from Venice. However, I have a large poster made by Radu Oltean that i bought from the History Museum in Bucharest which mentions that it was Radu I, Vladislav's son, that did this. This is also confirmed in wikipedia.ro but i don't know how reliable that is. Can you please confirm which one is correct?
    I think I can help you. Yes it was Radu I who ordered the 10,000 full armors from Venice in c. 1378. The armors were ordered in the context of strained relations and even clashes with Hungary. I have to mention that the numbers seems grossly exaggerated, and in fact represents as much as c. 1/2 of the army fielded by Tara Romaneasca during that era.

  17. #117
    Wallachian's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    Cool, thanks for the info mircea. Yea thought that was the case, just a small hicup in the preview it's funny you mention the exageration because that's exactly what it says on the poster aswell

  18. #118
    mircea's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    The preview looks great, although I'm probably (read as surely) subjective, I think that it is the greatest preview of the mod. I especially like the curteni, they look great, and they will probably be a very potent force.

    Now a few notes about several things that I think that are disputable.

    Curteni they were probably the most important social and military force of the principality, being assimilated to the social category of small and medium boyars. They served the Voievod as state functionaries, but more importantly, they formed the backbone of the permanent army. As such I think that Curteni (both on foot and cavalry) should be uprated to a medium dual function (melee & missile) cavalry & infantry unit.

    At the same time, Mosneni should be downgraded to light archers and light spear men. They were free peasants, as such their wealth was much smaller than the wealth owned by Curteni, or the other military categories such as Calarasi.

    I like the diversity of weaponry, and the mace men look fearsome, but more men should be armed with axes (mainly small axes used both on foot but also on horse, by boyars - Hache d'armes axes), spears (a very basic and easily available weapon), while generals and the princely family should be armed with the topuz (a highly decorated mace).


    More on a weapons review from several sources:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    As I heard that a new re-skinning for Tara Romaneasca will soon begin, than maybe I could help with some research

    Typology of weapons used in the armies of Tara Romeneasca & Moldova during Late XIV-middle XVI centuries

    The bow was the most used offensive weapon for Romanian armies, and only by middle XVIIth century did the firearms became much more common. The importance of archers for Romanians is mentioned since Early Middle Ages, if not even earlier. In the battle of Hindau in 1395, Antonio Bofini states that Stefan I of Moldavia “recruited a army lightly armed and a large number of archers”. Dlugosz talks about the archers sent by Alexandru the Good of Moldavia in support of Poles at the battle of Marienburg (1422), but also about the fact that if a peasants comes to army without bow, sword and spurs, he may be executed. While in a letter of Mihail I of Wallachia, the ruler promises to help the inhabitants of Cisnadie (in Transylvania) with “a band of our sagetasi (archers)”. A Byzantine chronicle from 1332 stated that Romanians are “most often mounted archers”. Paulo Giovio, Anton Verancsics, Italian travelers from XVI century both talked about the abundance of cavalry in the Romanian armies, with the latter even asserting (probably exaggerating) that “they mostly fight mounted, using footmen only to harass the enemy in mountains areas”.

    Two types of bows were used: the common European bow, used by most archers (by middle XVth century, he have mentions about longbows) and the composite bow, which is less used.

    The crossbow, although not used on a large scale, is nonetheless archeologically attested starting with early XVth century. For example in a contemporary document it is said that Alexander the Good of Moldavia ordered four large crossbows (called ballista or whirl bows) from Lvov, and in the 1445 siege of Giurgiu, crossbows are mentioned as being used by Romanians. Nonetheless, crossbowmen were not used as a special only crossbow unit.

    As melee weapons, the most popular are the swords, widely used by all the military categories of the Romanian army. Both straight, double-edged bladed swords as well as curved bladed swords are widely used, although by middle-late XVI th century, the curved swords (scimitars) seems to partially replace the straight swords. For most part of XVth century, the most common type of sword used in the region was the double-edged bladed sword, with straight crossguard, and hilt ended in a disc.

    Other weapons often used are the axes, various types of scythes, as well as halberds. The axes were used both by poorer soldiers, as well as by some boyars, which used axes of the type Hache d'armes, of various sizes.

    The halberd variant typically Romanian, is the type with an small axe blade topped with a spike mounted on a long shaft. It always has a very curved hook or thorn on the back side of the axe blade for grappling mounted combatants. Such examples were discovered at Suceava, Cetatea Neamtului, Bacau, Buzau (all in Moldavia).
    Also widely used were the clubs, especially by poorer soldiers. The mace was another widely used weapon, a special kind of mace, the topuz was the symbol of leadership or/and monarchy.

    Lances and spears were frequently used by the Romanian armies, with the spears being the most popular. In the first quarter of XVIth century, a few chroniclers and foreign travelers mention a type of spear with two spikes, one for thrust, and the other for curved as a hook, useful against mounted enemies (guisarme pole weapon).

    Martin Bielski, talking about the army of Petru Rares stated that it was composed of “brave soldiers, skilful in using the spear and the shield, although they are only stupid(simple, common) peasants”. A.M. Graziani (1564) mentioned that Moldavians “are armed with very long spears, shield, curved sword, weapons of Turkish influence, some use iron maces, and most use axes”. Another traveler, Giovan Andrea Gromo (1564) was reports that the Transylvanian infantry was armed with shields, yatağans, long swords, maces, and many with “wheeled arquebuses ”. They also “used lances (8-10 feet long), even the professional trabants use arquebuses, lances or yatağans. In late XVIth century, the dorobanti are mentioned using arqebuses and swords, while the cavalry uses especially bows. In the same period, the szlekers used “very few arqubuses, scythes, yatagans and short axes”. By 1620, it was estimated that Moldavia could mobilize “10.000 mounted archers, they are the bravest troop in this country, while Wallachia could mobilize 8,000 mounted archers,, but not as brave”
    .
    As means of protection, the soldiers used shields, of various shapes, made of wood or iron. According to Laonic Chalcocondil the shield used by Romanians were “large, long, similar to those used by tatars”. The heavy armours of XVIth century were rarely used, the Romanian boyars and curteni often used chain mails (often enforced with lamellar appliqués) and sometimes cuirasses. Heavy armors were mostly used by important military leaders or foreign mercenaries. In 1377, Radu I of Wallachia commanded from Venice 10,000 heavy armors for its soldiers. The poorer soldiers often used cuirasses made of rigid leather and filled with pieces of cloth and other textile materials. The Saxon geographer Georg Reciherstorffer, as well as the Italian Anton Verancsics relates that the “heavy cuirasses are very rare, only the richer have steel helmet and chain mail, as cuirass the use cloths filled with cotton or flax, 3-4 digits thick.” In 1569, the Moldavian ruler Alexandru Lapusenanu ordered chain mails, while 1574, the boyar Albu Golescu is represented on its tombstone wearing chain mail and steel helmet (calotte type).

    The helmets were of various types. In the beginning of XV century, coins from the period, as well as fresco show soldiers wearing what looks like a simple bascinet, later replaced by sallet type helmets. Also very at popular, were the barbute and its derivate the close helmet.

    Fire weapons were used starting with the first part of XVth century. The first gunsmith in the region is attested at Sibiu, Transylvania in 1373. In 1440s, Vlad Dracul of Wallachia was using two very large bombards, the same ruler was request in from Brasov, 100 guns, possible small portable fire weapons. The use of siege artillery is also attested as being used by Stephen III of Moldavia during the siege of Chilia(Kilia) in 1465. The ottoman chronicles noted the powerful effect of the guns used by the same ruler during the battle of Razboieni in 1476. The fixed, fortress artillery was also very used, especially the fortresses in Moldavia and Transylvania were heavily armed with artillery. The Moldavian prince Petru Rares (1527-1538, 1541-1546) even used organ guns, highly mobile field artillery.


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Early – middle XVI century images






    Sources:
    Istoria Militara a poporului roman
    Constantin C. Giurescu Istoria romanilor
    Dinu C. Giurescu - Tara Romaneasca In secolele XIV si XV

  19. #119
    matija191's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    what the word "trabant" means?

  20. #120
    Bagatyr's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: FACTION PREVIEW: Principality of Wallachia

    In bulgarian is very old car




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