Sketches…

[Son of Fire]

Ok, so I have been sketching some things… and some folks seem to like them… so I decided to post them here…


Thus far they have all been Serbs…
Based off of what I have seen from frescos, what I have read, and what I can extrapolate on the given information…




This was my first go at it...
Fairly simple... I am still figuring things out...
I was trying to get the right "feel"...




This is my second... man, are those proportions jacked... but it is mainly just to get ideas down...
I figure this would be a Vlastelicic... lesser noble cavalry... this guy would probably be either an archer or light lancer...
I tried to mix a bit of western in by giving him a western hauberk under his Byzantine style padded corselet and boots...




This is a Vlastelicic light lancer / bowman...
Yeah I know the debate rages on about mounted archers... but since I am drawing the pictures, I am going to draw what I think...
The cross piece on the chest I have seen on 3 frescoes, so I threw it in there to make it a bit more interesting and unique... after all, Serbs should stand out...
The bow is crap through... far too shallow...




I figure this would be a wealthy Vlastela, with good kit...
He has a western style mail hauberk & leggings with shynbalds, vambraces, and elbow and knee cops...
But also a Byzantine style scale corselet with trimmings...




This would be a low-end Voynik…
Thought obviously a soldier, and gird for war… his kit is not up to the degree that more professional or wealthier soldiers…
His helmet with padded ventail is of Byzantine fashion, as is his aketon or jack…
The axe is copied from pictures from museum pieces, and the rawcon/ransure is mentioned in texts…
Though his boots are of Western design, and though adequate, not up to Byzantine standards…


This is a higher end Vojnik, as his equipment shows...
His gear is still very Byzantine, but with subtle Western elements, like the ties on the arms to keep the mail in place, as well as the bill...
Feedback welcome... but be gentle...



My take on a Krajišnici

* I will add more later, and add them to this post to keep it simple

[Alex Maximus]

very good. i like it

[The_Bulgar_Slayer]

Very impressive drawings, great job!

[SerbianInfantry]

Great job drawing these piscs. This took time and skill, I like it.

[Son of Fire]

Thanks guys...
You are all too kind...

Well I put effort in the kinds of visuals... but for my good stuff, I usually ink them... this is mainly an exercise in trying to get down the visuals for Serbs...

I just think they should "pop"...

[Prince Valiant]

Very nice!

[slavic_crusader]

Wow ur skilled man!!! that is really amazing. But i wouldnt call it 100% accurate.

Good Job

[Son of Fire]

Thanks man...
So what would you say isn't accurate?
Details man, details...

[4th Regiment]

Nice drawings, rep + . Just improve proportions and you will be fine

[slavic_crusader]

Well it depends on who intrepets them. U do u have primary sources of what the armour looks like?

[Son of Fire]

Well that is the trick…
I have several sources… I have tons of picks from frescoes, many books about Western European arms and armour, several books about Byzantine arms and armour, and even a few about Balkan nation militaries…
I also even have a couple I can’t read (Cyrillic)…
So all those sources, combined with logical extrapolation, is how I got the images (of course I also considering the discussions here, in other forums, and other net sources as well )…


I know the Serbs liked mail, but also were either allied, vassals, and even incorporated into a Byzantine Theme (depending on the time). And so much of Byzantium permeated the Serbian states in dress, titles, architecture, etc… ergo, the Byzantine influence would have to be prominent. And what I have found, seems to corroborate that...

But, when dealing with historical modern art with Serbs there is really not much out there as far as images go... as it seems the artists tend to focus on larger, more well known nations and cultures... And also from what I hear... even in archeology sources about medieval Serbia are limited... or are focused on other subjects other than their military (church, rulers, etc.)...

Which basically comes down to… A large Byzantine influence, with some Western European influence…



Though to be fair… I am also partially inspired by Igor Dzis (Dzys?)…
I just like how he adds flair to his work… and I like adding a bit of that element of pageantry… I wanted to make the Serbs stand out in a way... so that you could get an idea of who the nation was, besides looking at just the banners...



Hope that answered your question man.

[slavic_crusader]

you have thanx

[Son of Fire]

No worries man...
But if there is something that doesn't sit right with you, just let me know... I mean, I could make a mistake...

[slavic_crusader]

i wouldnt know, only thing i looked closely to medieval serbia was the movie "battle of kosovo" Boj na Kosovo lol. I only know vaguely about my hertitage. But at least this forum gives me a connection and knowledge about it. Unfortunatly i dont have much time. This is my final secondary education year and im half way, i have to study a lot these days.... its called the HSC in Australia and its a pain.....

[Son of Fire]

Ah savvy…
Well I have seen that movie as well… and though cool, I think it had budget constraints as well as other bits that didn’t seem right…
In essence it was good… but take a look at Milos Obilic’s armour… which I tend to think is pretty bad.
But some of the other bits seemed right…



I still think the best line in that movie was when the sultan told his son something like... "Don't worry about taking apart the Serbs, they will do that themselves"...

[slavic_crusader]

yea communist peroid, corruption peroid, lol what you expect of the special affects and costuming, lol they used yugo cars to capture the battle hahahahahaha, i think thats funny.

Anyways i got to sleep its like 3am and got to wake up 7am. Aus

lako noc...

[NikeBG]

Oh, commie times were a wonder for the epic-movie industry. Just look at "War and Peace" and "Khan Asparuh". True, they still had some inaccuracies, but I've seen much worse in actual "historical documentaries" of the BBC f.e. (the Attila episode of the Warriors series was a real horror).

[slavic_crusader]

yea very true i heard cases about BBC as well. They even made a thing called "suciede rats"(something like that) which are rats falling to the sea killing themselves. But actually they are falling off the stage/set. lol funny how things can be and it is not real. Also how the book about christopher columbus said the people didnt thought the world was round but actually u can see the greeks,egyptians and other ancient cultures thought it was round. U can see this when atlas was holding the world. and other things....

[Son of Fire]

Truly... I do so LOVE historical epics...
The only crappy thing is waiting for the European ones to hit North America
It takes too damn long...
I am still waiting for...
Arn: Templar Knight
Taras Bulba
the new Alexander Nevski
I did manage to get 1612 though... so that made me happy... even if they buggered up a section of the film in its editing...

Well I don't get the BBC... but I do get The history Channel... and sometimes I am amazed that they fub their research... Still, it is fun to watch though...

[slavic_crusader]

My dad wanted a movie called Taras Bulba, i can give u a link if i can find. its a movie based on the time, not a documentary