The best horses since Antiquity?

**Argeus the Paladin** · March 17, 2010, 12:27 AM

A question I placed in my home forums without an answer yet:

Simple question: Which is it?

I'm asking this question partly as an effort to research for my fanfic, and I already have a few in mind:

1) Nisaean horses. Think Cataphracts, think these dudes. Unfortunately they are all but extinct as of late no thanks to the Crusades.
2) The Hanoverians. Still around until today, but I am not very sure they would serve well as war-horses.
3) Shire horses. From the picture, probably big enough to carry heavy bardings and gallop with no problem. Downside is they are listed as a modern rather than an antique breed.

So, have any knowledge of horses and horse breeds you'd like to share?

Could anyone here help?

**Hounf of Culan** · March 17, 2010, 02:04 AM

Depends on your criteria, are european warhorses better than mongolian steppe horses? They both fulfilled different roles extremely well. It would be easier if you were more specific about what qualities exactly you were looking for.

**Argeus the Paladin** · March 17, 2010, 02:07 AM

If you mean for my researches, I need a particular breed of horses, presumably with the following qualities:

- Can carry Cataphract barding/heavy plate armored rider.
- Can run fast enough to charge.
- Appears in or around Denmark or at least easily accessible to the Danes.
- Has good number/relatively easy to breed.

But for the purpose of the thread, perhaps the best mount overall? Like one that could best fulfill the needs of the country in question?

**Visna** · March 17, 2010, 06:51 AM

Originally Posted by Argeus the Paladin

If you mean for my researches, I need a particular breed of horses, presumably with the following qualities:

- Can carry Cataphract barding/heavy plate armored rider.
- Can run fast enough to charge.
- Appears in or around Denmark or at least easily accessible to the Danes.
- Has good number/relatively easy to breed.

AFAIK the standard Danish horse to carry heavy knights was a destrider-like horse. They're big (around a ton of bodyweight), so strong that charging into battle wearing some sort of armor as well as carrying an armored knight is not an issue at all, and easy to train. They're extinct now, though. Their descendants have kept a good amount of their characteristics and look like this:

**Marie Louise von Preussen** · March 17, 2010, 02:42 AM

You're probably looking for late Medieval destriers: they were capable of carrying full plate barding and still charge at gallop pace. They were not used for traveling though, too valuable for that.

**Argeus the Paladin** · March 17, 2010, 02:48 AM

Could I ask for any specific name, for instance, of breeds in and aroudn Denmark?

**maerd2003** · March 17, 2010, 03:49 AM

akhal-teke, a sub-breed of the extinct turkoman horses..
it is known these golden horses can take more than 200km a day..
most beautiful imo..http://www.golden-horses.net/history.htm

**Ulf** · March 17, 2010, 04:16 AM

**AnthoniusII** · March 17, 2010, 04:37 AM

The Irano/Armenian breed considered the top of the war horses ever.
Lydians used those horses for their famous cavalry and armenian tribes too!
Persians did not had any cavalry tradition until they occupied those areas.
In Perseppolis the sculpture on the stairs walls show Armenians to give such horses to the Persian Emperor!
After the Alexander's conquest,Hellenistic states based their cataphracts on those horses as the Parthians after them.
The hellenistic state of Bactria used that same breed for its heavy cavalry.
Chinese texts of that era mention that some of those horses were given to a Chinese lord as gifts and from that time ,chinese warlords had a stable horse trade ! Those horses became legends in the chinese myths and texts!
Later Romans of the eastern empire and Sassanids still used that kind of horses for their cataphracts. Those irano/armenian breed was so valueble for both that even when those empires were in war with eachother there was a pact of free horse trade!!!
Later after the fall of Sassanid empire Romans(byzantines) inorder to secure a stable breed of those horses,created two main breed areas (Thessaly and Constantinople). Afcourse Armenians still had scimilar horses of their own!
Despite the irano/armenian horse breed in Thessaly in the middle ages we must not see those horses same as the "original" thessalian ones that they were short.
The irano/armenian horses were so valuable because they were tall,strong and with a huge stamina that made them perfect for heavy cavalry.

The breeds that europeans developed to become war horses in central europe were huge and strong but they were slow and heavy and not agile enough.
So my vote goes to the 1st option!

It is a pity that those horses do not exist these days!

**Kagemusha** · March 17, 2010, 05:28 AM

Mongolian horse. Doesnt need anything other then grass to eat. Can survive exreme conditions. Is very sturdy compared to its size and could carry heavy armored lancer on its back and charge while at it. A small and sturdy powerhouse that maintains itself.

**Manco** · March 17, 2010, 07:11 AM

Pecherons, Brabancons, shires and so on are hypothetically descendants of destriers, but I've heard it's unlikely destriers themselves actually reached the massive sizes and musculatures of those draught horses.
They'd be more like a modern Frisian, which is still strong and large but more agile.

Whether they're the best, depends on what you expect them to do. They'd be useless for a steppe horse archer, but invaluable for a 15th century knight.

**Londinium** · March 17, 2010, 10:27 AM

Seriously you would not use a Shire Horse as a warhorse. Those things are freaking huge if you've ever seen one in real life, just mounting one in full armour would be hard enough. They were primarily used as farm animals more than anything else.

**Marie Louise von Preussen** · March 17, 2010, 10:29 AM

Yeah draft horses may be huge, but they're not really prime war making material.

**Manco** · March 17, 2010, 10:32 AM

Modern day huge draught horses didn't even exist when knights were dominant on the battlefield I think, so it's kinda moot.

**DAVIDE** · March 17, 2010, 10:57 AM

What an idiotic thread. Is there an horse better than another one for battles? No. All horses can be the best with a good and healthy eating and training.

**Manco** · March 17, 2010, 11:02 AM

Euhm, no. Some breeds have better stamina, others strength, even others speed.
A Brabancon or Pecheron couldn't dream of being as fast as an Andalusian, and an Andalusian wouldn't stand a chance in a tug war.

**Frederich Barbarossa** · March 17, 2010, 12:23 PM

IBERIAN HORSES HANDS DOWN. Descendants of the nisaean horse through greek exportation to Iberia, and they just look so magestic in my opinion. Must be why the conquistadors prefered them to any other!

**Hounf of Culan** · March 17, 2010, 01:44 PM

^^^ According to the wiki page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horses_in_the_Middle_Ages the Spanish breeds were regarded throughout Europe as being the finest warhorses available even in places as far away as Germany. If German warriors who had the money to spend preferred to import Spanish breeds for their warhorses it seems likely that any Danish warrior with the money to spend would do the same. Check the referenced material p[art of this wiki link too, it likes there is a lot of information about medieval warhorses available.

**conon394** · March 17, 2010, 03:32 PM

Question is rather impossible to answer as is:

Best at what? - anyone ever ride a Frisian or a Frisian cross it might be a good heavy cavalry horse but rather unpleasant to ride (day in and out) and certainty useless for a light cavalry archer or cattle cutting.