Is homophobia a social creation?

[iudas]

I am wondering whether there is an instinctual cause for homophobia, as opposed to it being simply an ancient social creation (as is racism, among others). Myself, I've become progressively more comfortable at the thought of homosexuality, to the point that it doesn't seem any less natural to me than heterosexuality, though at first I thought of it as a perversion. Throughout history there have been cultures both tolerant and intolerant, but then again, the view of sexuality has varied so much that it's impossible for me to draw any conclusions.

[Lysimachus]

I think that it's something part of us humans. The idea of people of the same sex being sexual with one another seems to provoke hostility and the only way to mend that is to train our minds to not be concerned with it, perhaps mending a gay-friendly attitude in to the "social norm" so that people gradually just accept it, just how racism which was once widespread has now been narrowed down greatly since we now consider it unacceptable and we get it indoctrinated in our heads that racism is wrong all the time.

[SigniferOne]

I think that it's something part of us humans. The idea of people of the same sex being sexual with one another seems to provoke hostility and the only way to mend that is to train our minds to not be concerned with it, perhaps mending a gay-friendly attitude in to the "social norm" so that people gradually just accept it, just how racism which was once widespread has now been narrowed down greatly since we now consider it unacceptable and we get it indoctrinated in our heads that racism is wrong all the time.

However racism has not been present in all times and all places. For instance the Romans had very little discrimination -- most of their slaves were white, and some of their later emperors (Severus) came from Africa. So racism is by no means a universal human institution, it's just a refuge of small bigoted minds at certain points in history. However homophobia has been universal since the beginning of human writing. Those same Romans thought of themselves as manly, and mocked the perfumed gay Greeks. Even among the Greeks, the supposed paragon of homosexual tolerance, the few elites engaged in the practice while the peasants in the countryside reviled them and mocked them as effeminate and disgraceful. These are the words which Aristophanes uses to mock gay people, he wrote several plays in which he mocks homosexuality in just this way.

Thus homophobia is a universal human institution, and people in all times and all places have innately experienced this reaction (whether they chose to or not).

As I said in another thread, having reached this conclusion you can either start to believe that the nature as such is unjust and homophobic, or that we experience unsettlement at the sight of homosexual actions because we instinctively equate them with a mental debilitation.

[Lysimachus]

However racism has not been present in all times and all places. For instance the Romans had very little discrimination -- most of their slaves were white, and some of their later emperors (Severus) came from Africa. So racism is by no means a universal human institution, it's just a refuge of small bigoted minds at certain points in history.

Well, i'd been under the impression that racism is an inevitability since humans would always be wary of things which were different, so seeing people with different skin colour would provoke feelings such as fear, envy, prejudice and others. Humans will always find a petty reason to claim their superiority over one another and if skin just happens to be one of the things used, then so be it.

[Phier]

If I recall with the Romans, you could only have homosexual sex with a slave (not another Roman) and you had to be 'top' by law.

Signifier is basically correct that homosexuality having 'issues' with the main stream is not new.

What is new is the term homophobia, its consciously designed to make those who are not openly accepting of gays and gay culture seem to be the ones with the negative condition.

Now there are undoubtedly people who are truely homophobic as in they have a great fear of homosexuals, but the term is usually applied to those who are not afraid of it, not secretly gay (which is another way dirty trick used to make those not accepting of homosexuality seem less honest) but just object to some aspect of gay culture.

[Monarchist]

I'm certainly not accepting of homosexual intercourse, and that makes me a homophobe by today's definition. Any cursory look at my personality will tell you that this makes no sense, from the societal standpoint.

[Boyar Son]

I'm certainly not accepting of homosexual intercourse, and that makes me a homophobe by today's definition. Any cursory look at my personality will tell you that this makes no sense, from the societal standpoint.

off topic here, you're gay, but you don't accept homosexual intercourse? am not understanding

[Marie Louise von Preussen]

Homophobia is a natural instinct. Children, and people who do not spend their entire childhood under the indoctrination of the Western school system, either ignore it as impossible or openly disdain it; 'tis no wonder that in the very few passages where "sodomy" is mentioned, even by non-Christian lawmakers, it is named not "homosexuality" (a modern, more apologetic term), but "the crime against nature".

Some ancient Greek philosophers even thought that female homosexuality was "naturally" impossible, and contrarily to the fabricated image of a gay happy paradise, most Ancient Greek poleis forbade "buggery" with death or exile. So as to say, the vast majority of all peoples under all circumstances have criminalized the practice - despite these prohibitions being sometimes overlooked by people of power or people who could hide well.

[Fiyenyaa]

Some ancient Greek philosophers even thought that female homosexuality was "naturally" impossible,

And now that we actually know things about the natural world, we know this is utterly ridiculous - female homosexuality is extremely prevelant in many primates (not just humans).
Must those damn Baboons watching 'the L Word' and getting ideas, right?

[Marie Louise von Preussen]

And now that we actually know things about the natural world, we know this is utterly ridiculous - female homosexuality is extremely prevelant in many primates (not just humans).
Must those damn Baboons watching 'the L Word' and getting ideas, right?

This just shows how it was seen as a fringe phenomenon, just like psychopathy or rare illness, that it was barely understood by anyone. It tends to be overhyped today when you have gay activists buzzing on the streets, media gossip and even TV shows; much beyond its own natural extent.

[Fiyenyaa]

This just shows how it was seen as a fringe phenomenon, just like psychopathy or rare illness, that it was barely understood by anyone. It tends to be overhyped today when you have gay activists buzzing on the streets, media gossip and even TV shows; much beyond its own natural extent.

Translation: If we remain ignorant, we can remain intolerant.

I'll pass on that thanks.

[Marie Louise von Preussen]

Translation: If we remain ignorant, we can remain intolerant.

I'll pass on that thanks.

More like, if the culture does not stimulate otherwise obscure vices to the extreme, we will not talk about them all the time or practice them all the time either.

[43rdFoot]

I have no tolerance for homophobes. To me it it simply illogical and bigoted, and no better than racism.

It would be a happy day when humanity finally rids itself of such things.

[Phier]

I have no tolerance for homophobes. To me it it simply illogical and bigoted, and no better than racism.

It would be a happy day when humanity finally rids itself of such things.

What exactly is a homophobe?

[43rdFoot]

What exactly is a homophobe?

Someone who believes that homosexuals are somehow inferior people, guilty of a crime, or morally wrong.

[Phier]

Someone who believes that homosexuals are somehow inferior people, guilty of a crime, or morally wrong.

Which is why the term is incorrect.

[Yosemite]

Someone who believes that homosexuals are somehow inferior people, guilty of a crime, or morally wrong.

ho·mo·pho·bi·a (hm-fb-)
n.
1. Fear of or contempt for lesbians and gay men.
2. Behavior based on such a feeling.

[iudas]

How can a term be incorrect?

[Phier]

How can a term be incorrect?

Simply because its not a phobia. I think moral problems with homosexuality are wrong, but if someone thinks its morally wrong its not a phobia its an opinion.

[43rdFoot]

Simply because its not a phobia. I think moral problems with homosexuality are wrong, but if someone thinks its morally wrong its not a phobia its an opinion.

I believe it's a fear of something they don't understand, so they fall back on outdated standards and religious standards.