Artificial Intelligence

[HIC SVNT LEONES]

So, I was thinking about this today. Why are there people creating artificial intelligences? I mean, its cool and all, but wouldn't it lead to that inevitable day of questioning of self and existence that could lead to many problems such as rebellion/overthrow?

Which also brings up, is it even correct to create artificial intelligences?


(( Also as a side note, if anyone has ever played the game Mass Effect/Mass Effect 2, a situation similar between the Geth and the Quarians. Why would one even create something that could potentially want to be on its own, if we don't believe in slavery and like-minded things? ))

[The Dude]

Why not?

If we can evolve AI to the level that it could be qualified as life, then we're effectively the creators of a species. We can say that we've the power to create, and possibly control, life. It'll be a tough nut to swallow for those who believe in god when it turns out that we're pretty much capable of the same thing.

Or maybe something even greater is at play. Ever considered the advantages of a synthetic over an organic race? Maybe there is a purpose to human life, namely the creation of something better. That's just pure conjecture of course, but hey, if it turns out that space is inaccessible to an organic then obviously the benefits of being a machine are tremendous.

[Gordon Freynman]

Creating artificial intelligence is only dangerous if we're stupid and allow it to be.

[HIC SVNT LEONES]

See, its cool and all. It'd be a great achievement. But why do it, if it brings the possibilities of great danger - not your normal, I just made the nuke, danger, but, there goes humanity, danger. I'd rather humanity to be the greater winner! lol.

[MaximiIian]

It'll be a tough nut to swallow for those who believe in god when it turns out that we're pretty much capable of the same thing.

Not really.

See, its cool and all. It'd be a great achievement. But why do it, if it brings the possibilities of great danger - not your normal, I just made the nuke, danger, but, there goes humanity, danger. I'd rather humanity to be the greater winner! lol.

Well, it's not like Instant AI, Just Add Water. It's not going to spring up suddenly and turn on us for no reason. AI would, like any advanced computer program, have to be deliberately developed and built. If that is the case, then we'd surely have basic safety protocols in the design and making of such a construct. We're stupid, but not that stupid.

And there's no reason to assume that an AI, when constructed and raised in a proper, humane environment, would ever rebel and attack its makers. Does a human baby raised in healthy surroundings plot revenge on its parents?

And don't you dare a picture of Stewie Griffin.

[Katsumoto]

Why do anything if it brings the possibility of great danger? You have to take risks my friend. Besides, you've been watching too much Matrix/Terminator, I'm sure humans wouldn't make the AI so intelligent that it can outsmart its creators.

[empr guy]

Why do anything if it brings the possibility of great danger? You have to take risks my friend. Besides, you've been watching too much Matrix/Terminator, I'm sure humans wouldn't make the AI so intelligent that it can outsmart its creators.

too late, they can already win at chess

still, the possibilitys of true AI could be increadibly beneficial, like if a flooding tunnel needs a door manuely shut, or a space craft needs repair on the outside but the crew is sick. Things like using them to do things that would kill humans is only one thing they could be used for to (providing they have somekind of body)

still, if we wish to avoid rebelion we should not give them emotions and things, and if we didnt treat them like crap im sure there would never be a rebelion in which every sinle one attacks.

still, it could be dangerous yes, but then so is almost everything else.

[Elfdude]

Well it's sort of ridiculously difficult to create artificial intelligence with 1s and 0's but quantum computing may usher in the computational power need to create a true rivalry between human and artificial intelligence.

I believe the biggest obstacle will be figuring out how to make the intelligence moral. Our morality is an evolved concept. To function with humans AI's must also have human morality; however even human morality is prone to failure in situations and our definitions leave room for fantastical loopholes. It's difficult to predict what an AI who is more intelligent than a human could accomplish or would consider moral. As such until morality as a species is absolute I would hesitate in creating artificial intelligences that rival or outpace my own.

I do agree with you however that if we produce truly autonomous humanoids with AI's we may be in significant trouble. Luckily it's a simple solution to lock their minds up where they can never have a body until we can establish how thinking and morality works more definitively.

[HIC SVNT LEONES]

Lol, I don't mean it in a Matrix/Terminator sort of way. I'm just saying, risks are good in science-innovation... but why give them real brains? Why do that when they can "live forever" ? What if they figure out how to disable their perimeters and make themselves "Normal" ? Why create slaves?

[Shaio]

^ Why would your robots have personas? i don't expect to ever see robots that can think conceptually, it would be a very dumb thing to create, robots are likley going to stay as they are for a long time, robotic arms and such that repetitively do the same simple tasks, not crazy walking super smart humanoids made of metal.

And if we did create ai's that could think, conceptually, and evolve..... why the hell would we connect them to anything outside the room there in? Or give them a body capable of doing anything humans can. (ie hands legs motor-skills needed to self replicate via preprogramming some factory or something.)

Theres no morality for your robots, just a set of tasks there programmed to do, and a set of parameters.

besides which were still safe for a while, ai's really suck.

[HIC SVNT LEONES]

AI =/= Robots with personas. If the plan with AI is to eventually make something to think, why do it when it will bring many other issues. This isn't in the things that will/may be created like self-driving, self-parking cars that are given a set series parameters and scenarios with some "free-thinking" to do that.. but the growing trend/fantasy that will be to make robotic servitors/friends and the like to converse/use/whatever to do jobs we may not be able to do at all or easier - along with the ability to have the human ability to think because that would make it on par with humanity, without so much as you would call "organic flaws".

If it isn't us, and could potentially destroy us with its longevity/ability to think/ingenuity not to mention its ability of being a machine/AI with the likely ability to work within/use what we call the internet and its future developments/incarnations... why make something like that? Something theoretically better than humanity. Though, I guess if we use movie rules we'll win every sort of scenario.

[Shaio]

AI =/= Robots with personas. If the plan with AI is to eventually make something to think, why do it when it will bring many other issues. This isn't in the things that will/may be created like self-driving, self-parking cars that are given a set series parameters and scenarios with some "free-thinking" to do that.. but the growing trend/fantasy that will be to make robotic servitors/friends and the like to converse/use/whatever to do jobs we may not be able to do at all or easier - along with the ability to have the human ability to think because that would make it on par with humanity, without so much as you would call "organic flaws".

If it isn't us, and could potentially destroy us with its longevity/ability to think/ingenuity not to mention its ability of being a machine/AI with the likely ability to work within/use what we call the internet and its future developments/incarnations... why make something like that? Something theoretically better than humanity. Though, I guess if we use movie rules we'll win every sort of scenario.

Well, if there capable of three thought, then there a sentience to rival our own, and I'm my opinion should have rights to rival our own, but that's because i think its a humans 'sentience' as to put it that makes us special, if they are our equal in thought, they are our equal in everything.

but i think it more likley if intelligent ai's are invented they'll be controlling labs and doing experiments, i don't think the intelligent, capable of free thought robot would ever make it into the home, and hopefully not replce the military, and we'd likley keep them from any central connection for security purposes, at-least anyone smart would.

Its only really a problem once they start being able to form there own agendas( which if programmed right should never happen), your ai freind bot(example) will generate random, and realistic conversation, and simulate emotions in the conversation, but it wont really care where it is and what its doing, one task is as good as another, heck it won't care about being turned off, no real emotions or attachment, no programming on how to attack or fight.

I would hope at-least we didn't see three thinking ai's in mobile apparatuses, doomsday scenario there, if anything robots should not be programmed for self preservation.
but alot of what ifs, i mean unless this particular ai got spread almost globally, and/or everything gets hooked up to the net, its unlikely that they'll all bug our at once and go "humanity be slaves now rargh robots rule!!!" all at once, and if it happen sporadically they'd be put down or it'd be fixed very fast.

At the very least i imagine different countries would have differently programmed, and organized ai's so hopefully what affects one wouldn't be world wide, and if they destroyed all the humans in an area you could just nuke it to hell and send in robot cleanup squads with there wireless turned off.

>.> or we could make them think you kill humans by patting our bellies and feeding us grapes. So if it all goes wrong we have a few more seconds before it figures out limb removal is far more fatal.


Also, 5 dollars that first casualty is someone getting crushed by there sex bot.

[Manco]

True AI isn't possible yet anyways, all we have now are computer programs who react to input in preprogrammed ways. We just call it artificial intelligence, while it's simply complex programming.

If we however create it one day, what's the point? The second we've created true AI, we'll have to let it go on it's own. Doing otherwise would be slavery.
As an intellectual feat it would be astounding, but we wouldn't be able to use it in the same way as a machine.

[HIC SVNT LEONES]

Exactly Manco! I don't really understand why we would do that.. sure.. it'd be cool! But there is all this red tape surrounding it. Why do it when nothing good is going to come from it? There is no gain.

[The Dude]

Exactly Manco! I don't really understand why we would do that.. sure.. it'd be cool! But there is all this red tape surrounding it. Why do it when nothing good is going to come from it? There is no gain.

But why wouldn't we?

Consider a few options:

1. There is no alien life in the universe that we can realistically interact with. An AI race would be a great way to fill the emptiness of space, and possibly a good companion.

2. Humanity remains locked in international war, even in the centuries to come. A truly smart politician would fund an AI engineering program for the purpose of giving man a common enemy.

3. An AI race would offer us a great deal of insight into ourselves. What things will they do differently than us, and why? Will they develop a moral standard, and if so, will they therefore be susceptible to the lure of religion? What does the concept of god mean to them, if anything at all? How will they explain things they can't understand? Do they have an inherent benevolent drive, or do they only take action based on calculations that produce the most positive result? And how do they measure whether a result is positive or negative?

More than all of that though, there is one single reason why we're so interested in AI: humans are social creatures. While it may appear at times that we are not, due the great hostility we -can- harbor towards one another, it's no secret that humans best function in packs with a high level of social cohesion. A lonely human being would quickly degenerate into a raving lunatic due to the absense of social context. It makes sense that we would develop true AI if it means companionship.

[empr guy]

1. There is no alien life in the universe that we can realistically interact with. An AI race would be a great way to fill the emptiness of space, and possibly a good companion.
.

i wouldnt say this, but i have to wonder if another species may have created AI once...

[PointOfViewGun]

i wouldnt say this, but i have to wonder if another species may have created AI once...

It's possible that we humans are some sort of AI that a species from a different planet created thousands of years ago.

You may find it Cheesy but I'd recommend watching Caprica the Tv-series and Stealth the movie. If you scrap of all that animations and romance and heroics of these you'd see the very same idea you guys are talking about here. Once you create a being that learns by itself you can't stop it from learning one thing and let it learn an other. That wouldn't be a true AI.

On top of that there is no moral question here. Creating anything doesn't make it wrong. Creating an AI is not different than creating the bicycle of the car. In their core they're the same, mens creation and there is nothing wrong about it morally.

[Tacitursa]

I'm sure humans wouldn't make the AI so intelligent that it can outsmart its creators.

Technically we wouldnt have to and we didnt in the movies. If we designed a proper AI robot it would upgrade itself overtime but unlike the movies that would be fairly easy to stop or limit. If left alone tho and given enough time there's no reason why it wouldnt become alot smarter.

[Manco]

1. There is no alien life in the universe that we can realistically interact with. An AI race would be a great way to fill the emptiness of space, and possibly a good companion.

Or you know, other humans...

2. Humanity remains locked in international war, even in the centuries to come. A truly smart politician would fund an AI engineering program for the purpose of giving man a common enemy.

Oh yeah, let's create a species so we can then try and wipe them out. Can't you really see the problem with that?

3. An AI race would offer us a great deal of insight into ourselves. What things will they do differently than us, and why? Will they develop a moral standard, and if so, will they therefore be susceptible to the lure of religion? What does the concept of god mean to them, if anything at all? How will they explain things they can't understand? Do they have an inherent benevolent drive, or do they only take action based on calculations that produce the most positive result? And how do they measure whether a result is positive or negative?

That might be interesting, but still creating a species as a glorified lab experiment?

More than all of that though, there is one single reason why we're so interested in AI: humans are social creatures. While it may appear at times that we are not, due the great hostility we -can- harbor towards one another, it's no secret that humans best function in packs with a high level of social cohesion. A lonely human being would quickly degenerate into a raving lunatic due to the absense of social context. It makes sense that we would develop true AI if it means companionship.

Euhm, we have humans for companionship.
And what if this AI wasn't even interested in you as a companion?

[Ludicus]

..Something theoretically better than humanity

Interesting idea...
Susan Calvin ("I Robot, Asimov")
"Are robots so different from men? Worlds different. Robots are essentially decent"
Hehe.