Coalition? But I don't WANT to be coalesced!

A rhetroical flourish there. But my point is. Is the 'Campaign of the Coalition' perhaps going to feel like: four factions, one of which you control, all fighting against the French. Is France going to be so much stronger than the other factions that this balance of power is going to be neccasry for gameplay purposes? Example: if Prussia is able to ally with France, and does so, rather than join the Coalition against Napoleon, is that gameover Europe? In a sense I like the idea that there IS one obviously stronger faction. Empire tried to be too 'fair.' I don't even care either way its going to be great whatever.

youre not bound to the coalition, but your relation to the coalition factions would be of course way better than to france. in reviews they even saidd that as soon as one of your allies takes a region important for your victory conditions yiu would HAVE to declare war on him, for example austria

Originally Posted by Nicolaos

youre not bound to the coalition, but your relation to the coalition factions would be of course way better than to france. in reviews they even saidd that as soon as one of your allies takes a region important for your victory conditions yiu would HAVE to declare war on him, for example austria

So you have no choice but to declare war...

Thats just ...

Originally Posted by DoomBunny666

So you have no choice but to declare war...

Thats just ...

But it's realistic. After the defeat of Napoleon, the members of the victorious Coalition were several times very close to going to war against each other because they could not agree on who should get what territories. Frederick William III of Prussia, for example, demanded that the province of Southern Prussia which he had lost in 1807 be returned to his kingdom. Czar Alexander, however, considered that territory his rightful booty and refused to withdraw his troops from there. They were ready to fight over it. But in the end, Frederick William was appeased by giving Prussia the Rhineland. He was not completely satisfied (an entirely Catholic province, with a population spoiled by the Code Civil and other dangerous French stuff, and disturbingly close to France), but he accepted the deal. It proved to be a very good bargain a few decades later - after it became clear that Prussia had received the enormous coal deposits of the Ruhr Valley.

Originally Posted by Nicolaos

youre not bound to the coalition, but your relation to the coalition factions would be of course way better than to france.

What he said, I'll bet your starting relations with France are going to be horrible, making it difficult to ally with them even if you wanted to. Which made sense historically because Napoleon was notorious for being uncooperative with nations who would otherwise be friendly to him, even his allies.

Now for the coalition side, unless we figure out a way to get the wonderful CAI to cooperate, I have a feeling we'll be fighting each other as much as France.

@Nicolaos: Or you could turn to diplomacy and try to get it in a peaceful way without destroying your alliance.

You only "HAVE" to declare war if you really, really want the stupid little Well Done video at the end

And anyway, I could imagine such a conflict being plausible. I.E. Russia (me) joins fight for France because conflicts allow borders to be readressed, and Russia wants a pretext to invade the Ottoman Empire and/or possibly request Austrian lands in the ensuing Treaty of Somewhere after the French are beaten. Austria refuses to give over "rightfully Russian lands" as Russia's compensation for the invasion of her homeland, and, as such, goes to war with Austria

Yep, coalition warfare is "interesting". I'm going to take this opportunity to post a paper by my "nephew". (j/k - but he has good taste in surnames.)

http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc...c=GetTRDoc.pdf

Complexity in Coalition Operations - "Each coalition partner allowed national interests to govern the movement of its forces instead of focusing on the strategic objective of defeating Napoleon."

re: post-conflict friction - yep, both Russia and Prussia were quite expansionist at the time.

Now for the coalition side, unless we figure out a way to get the wonderful CAI to cooperate, I have a feeling we'll be fighting each other as much as France.

Yup. Before we worry about if we have to declare on our friends, first we need to know if we can even call them our friends. If allied AIs are still as useless n unresponsive like in ETW, then what's the point of joining a coalition anyway. You'll still be fighting on your own in the end.

Actually scratch that. I don't need AIs helping me to make the game even easier. Just make sure that when I play as France or some other expansionist tyrant, the enemy AI coalition can really gang up on me instead of being swallowed up one by one as usual. That's the main thing I hope to see from the CAI this time.

The Real question is going to be is the AI controlled France going to be a Cake Walk moron. OR is it going to have some intelligence?

How can they make the AI France even a challenge. Compared to Empire Total War the only way I can think of it is to let them cheat by reducing Unit cost and starting them with a very large army. I mean it would have to be Inaccurate Historic wise numbers to make them somewhat of a challenge vs the Other AI and a human player.

What you guys think?

Originally Posted by Malkuth

The Real question is going to be is the AI controlled France going to be a Cake Walk moron. OR is it going to have some intelligence?

How can they make the AI France even a challenge. Compared to Empire Total War the only way I can think of it is to let them cheat by reducing Unit cost and starting them with a very large army. I mean it would have to be Inaccurate Historic wise numbers to make them somewhat of a challenge vs the Other AI and a human player.

What you guys think?

I hope that they have, somehow, scripted France to be hard in the war of the coalition. If France is simply 'just another AI faction' the whole point of this game goes out the window.

France needs to be like the Maratha Confederacy in the Coalition campaign.

Originally Posted by Graphic

France needs to be like the Maratha Confederacy in the Coalition campaign.

AW god the horrors!

Originally Posted by Graphic

France needs to be like the Maratha Confederacy in the Coalition campaign.

Non-existent?

Originally Posted by OdinX

Non-existent?

Utterly deadly and unstoppable in its random lust for land and elephants

I agree Thoragoros. I really hope that this game has France as very powerful, start with a good amount of cash, units stronger etc, or just simply harder to defeat. This will make the game much harder, atleast if you try to attack France, there will be armys there to attack you, and atleast have a 50% chance of defeat.

I'm interested to see how far it is possible to NOT fight the French while playing as one of the historically coalition nations. Will the French be so blinded by scripted rage that they declare war upon Prussia in the first three moves for example. Similarly, if Prussia decides to sit on the French and see what territory be gleaned from the smaller nations, will the major coalition nations neccesarily declare war on you. I want to see how far I can game theory my supposed friendly neighbours, whilst avoiding the French as far as possible. I want to undermine the coalition to my advantage, and then perhaps take on the French in a 'battle for the universe' final.

Originally Posted by Sid

I'm interested to see how far it is possible to NOT fight the French while playing as one of the historically coalition nations. Will the French be so blinded by scripted rage that they declare war upon Prussia in the first three moves for example. Similarly, if Prussia decides to sit on the French and see what territory be gleaned from the smaller nations, will the major coalition nations neccesarily declare war on you. I want to see how far I can game theory my supposed friendly neighbours, whilst avoiding the French as far as possible. I want to undermine the coalition to my advantage, and then perhaps take on the French in a 'battle for the universe' final.

Given the purpose of the game, I both want and expect France to be scripted towards war in such a way that makes France a very, very difficult and aggressive opponent.

However, I would also like to see player be allowed, through diplomacy, to switch sides.

Originally Posted by Sid

if Prussia decides to sit on the French

LOL

You just can't trust those damn Prussians.