Carthage discoverd america??

[A Demented Goldfish]

Check dis out http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/A1029313, on one of the pharagraphs it says that Carthage may have discovered america but kept it a secret........... what do you think??

[empr guy]

idk, i think we would have found ruins of a city or something, i'd imagine if it brought them "great wealth" they would have settled there. its a cool article anyway,

To the left is another continent, which could only be America. In typical American fashion, it appears to be displaying an extended middle finger to the 'Old World'.

although if carthage had discovered the Americas and made maps, it would explain how the ottomans had this map in 1513AD (not sure how the ottomans got it but what ever)

[A Demented Goldfish]

idk, i think we would have found ruins of a city or something, i'd imagine if it brought them "great wealth" they would have settled there. its a cool article anyway,





although if carthage had discovered the Americas and made maps, it would explain how the ottomans had this map in 1513AD (not sure how the ottomans got it but what ever)

Intresting maybe it was the missing tribe of israel who gave the the map?

[empr guy]

Intresting maybe it was the missing tribe of israel who gave the the map?

the missing tribes of isreal's people were all killed or sold into slavery by assyrians i think, when the article says "convincing stuff indeed!" its a joke based on how absolutly absurd smiths claim the isrealites went to america and then wrote stuff on gold plates is.


although things posted here are true, a storm near africa causing them to go to the americas is highley improbable, but the idea they survived the journey, found a way back to africa, and then knew how to get to the americas after only arriving there after being lost borders on the impossible...

[FreeRadical]

Hmm I always thought the BBC was a reliable source.I guess I am going to have to rethink that now. I guess they are becoming like a tabloid(National Enquirer) and catering to the highly uneducated.No offense to the misinformed,that why we have a history section in the forum

[Juvenal]

Hmm I always thought the BBC was a reliable source.I guess I am going to have to rethink that now. I guess they are becoming like a tabloid(National Enquirer) and catering to the highly uneducated.No offense to the misinformed,that why we have a history section in the forum

Just because a website is hosted by the BBC, that doesn't make it part of the BBC News Service.

What you need to do is find out what kind of website it actually is.

Here is the blurb.

What is h2g2?
h2g2 stands for 'The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy' - an unconventional guide to Life, The Universe and Everything. This site - the Earth Edition of the Guide - is an encyclopaedic project contributed to by people from all over the world. h2g2.com was launched in April 1999, and the BBC took over the running of the site in February 2001 as part of a drive to develop new and innovative online services.
Anyone can write for the Guide, which already has thousands of entries on all sorts of subjects. Meaningful collaboration is encouraged and users help one another, feeding back on what others have written using a peer review system. The result is a living, breathing guide that's constantly being updated and revised, driven forward by the very people who use it.
h2g2's inspiration comes from The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, the best-selling book by Douglas Adams, one of the original founders of the site. Back in 1971, Douglas lay drunk in a field in Innsbruck, Austria, thinking about the galaxy and how you might find your way around it. His solution, the 'Guide', was an ingenious device that offered advice about almost any place, object, entity or event you might care to name - all at the convenience of your fingertips. This vision is now approaching reality, both on the Internet and on mobile phones, in the form of h2g2.

[A Demented Goldfish]

the missing tribes of isreal's people were all killed or sold into slavery by assyrians i think, when the article says "convincing stuff indeed!" its a joke based on how absolutly absurd smiths claim the isrealites went to america and then wrote stuff on gold plates is.


although things posted here are true, a storm near africa causing them to go to the americas is highley improbable, but the idea they survived the journey, found a way back to africa, and then knew how to get to the americas after only arriving there after being lost borders on the impossible...

dude i was joking

[Rilsaur]

Intresting maybe it was the missing tribe of israel who gave the the map?

Well, Colombus "discovered" the New World in 1492, so it's entirely possible they could have had a map by then. There's a pretty good time period where a map could have been made.

[Dave Strider]

idk, i think we would have found ruins of a city or something, i'd imagine if it brought them "great wealth" they would have settled there. its a cool article anyway,





although if carthage had discovered the Americas and made maps, it would explain how the ottomans had this map in 1513AD (not sure how the ottomans got it but what ever)

America had been discovered by 1513, it's not that odd.

[Seleucos of Olympia]

although if carthage had discovered the Americas and made maps, it would explain how the ottomans had this map in 1513AD (not sure how the ottomans got it but what ever)

It is all explained in the comments written on the map itself. You can find a translation here.

As you can see, the Ottomans got all their information on America from captured European sailors.

As for Plutarch, in his "On the Apparent Face in the Orb of the Moon" he mentions a story of how people could cross over to the opposite continent through Britain, by way of three islands. You can find that story here, in chapter XXVI.

To put it in context, the dialogue is on the substance of the moon and there are three main speakers. The first argues for a gaseous moon, the second for a rocky moon, and in his talk he brilliantly counters all the objections of the first speaker with proper physics (for example, if the Moon is rocky, why don't we see the sun reflected on it like on a spherical mirror? Counter: the Moon is not a solid sphere but its surface is broken up in little rocks and imperfections which reflect sunlight the same throughout its surface. Brilliant and true). The third speaker argues for a mystical/religious function of the moon, and relates the story of someone from the opposite continent who spoke on the subject.

[empr guy]

It is all explained in the comments written on the map itself. You can find a translation here.

As you can see, the Ottomans got all their information on America from captured European sailors.
.

more a joke, although i knew the europeans wouldnt just share the information. (thanks for the link though)


Still this map, 21 years after the americas had even been (re)discovered is apperantly exceptionaly accurate for the south america part, not to mention columbus never went that far south which makes me wonder why one of his crew members had that map.

[Vítor Gaspar]

idk, i think we would have found ruins of a city or something, i'd imagine if it brought them "great wealth" they would have settled there. its a cool article anyway,





although if carthage had discovered the Americas and made maps, it would explain how the ottomans had this map in 1513AD (not sure how the ottomans got it but what ever)

It seems that the of America depicted in that map is "Vera Cruz", what later would be called "Brazil". By 1513 the Portuguese were already exploring South America. It wouldn't be the first time the Ottomans got maps from the Portuguese, and vice-versa.

[EmperorBatman999]

It seems that the of America depicted in that map is "Vera Cruz", what later would be called "Brazil". By 1513 the Portuguese were already exploring South America. It wouldn't be the first time the Ottomans got maps from the Portuguese, and vice-versa.

In though Vera Cruz was in Mexico as Cortez's base.

Well I believe the Vikings found Newfoundland 400 years before Columbus, but this is outrageous. Carthage had great sailors, but only for its time.

Wasn't there also a legend of Templars discovering the New World, too?

[Ludicus]

Many people have discovered America. A notable exception is Columbus, the "discover" of India.
-----

Hanno: as far as Sierra leone and perhaps Mount Camerron.
Himilco: descriptions of great masses of seaweed and windless latitudes suggest the Sargasso Sea and the Doldrums.
In summary, Himilco´s voyage may have been fictional, but Carthaginian knowledge of the mid-atlantic seems to have been based on real experience.
Sources :Armesto /L. Casson.

-----
Duberdicus

Vera Cruz", what later would be called "Brazil".

Right.

[Genius of the Restoration]

I could understand if they'd discovered it by going north, but I don't think they'd have been able to make it across the Atlantic if they'd been blown off course sailing down the African coast.

[Drakedeath]

I highly doubt they could have discovered America with galleys. It took a lot of effort to row those things, and if they did find something, it'd be a fluke.

[Timefool]

I don't question that they could have sailed south to Africa and taken the trade winds over. That is, however small, a possibility. The fact that they mapped it, and then went north or south to take the trade winds back to Europe is what makes me a non-believer. Firstly, if it was one ship, they most likely would not have mapped it. More likely, after being at sea for weeks, they would have stayed. Search parties would never have come that far out into the ocean, so really if they managed to get over there, there would be no contact.

[empr guy]

oh my bad lol

[A Demented Goldfish]

Damn moderaters........... if your gonna move my thread atleast anounce it

[MathiasOfAthens]

I remember reading up on this long time ago. Apparently Africa was also circumnavigated centuries before the punic wars by a Phoenician explorer named Hanno who was sailing for Egypt at the time. So by the time of Carthages western med supremacy and their love for exploration and trade it would not be such a wild guess to assume they traveled eastwards again and if by mistake were blown off course and landed near brazil. The library that allegedly held the information for the new world was destroyed by rome in the 2nd or 3rd punic wars. Think it was the 3rd. But Cicero makes a mention of it later on. And I believe some coins were found that show a map of the known world.