What if NTW is actually a bad game?

Ignoring what we've seen and the decisions many (COUGH....ForlornHope...COUGH) have made already, I pose this question:

What will you do if it turns out to suck?

Now, obviously, I don't mean "I'd rant/start a revolution", but what would you do with regards to sucessive Total War titles?

Obviously we have to judge each game on its own merits, but two bad-to-average games in a row can't be all that good

Would a bad Napoleon make you avoid further TW titles? Would it jade you like it has jaded Forlorn and Humble, amongst others?

Basically, would a bad Napoleon affect your outlook on the series permenantly?

probably not, ETW was THE worst TW iv played, and i own em all. but i still play it constantly. TW is like Pizza even a bad TW is ok. ETWs graphics on ultra are awful 30 yards from camera, so i zoom in as much as possible. The ai is atrocious so i amuse myself by ripping opposition with arty and sit back and watch them run in circles. by adding the smoke and blood mod with a proper empire terra inc and darthmod its made the game ok. so i make the best of ETW

I believe the next title will be a title where the game is set in Roman period; I.E we will all buy it, anyway.

True true and true, even a TW game is a win compared to the majority of other strategy titles..

Rome II is imminent, as sure as day follows night so it might appear.

Originally Posted by ♔GrinningManiac♔

Ignoring what we've seen and the decisions many (COUGH....ForlornHope...COUGH) have made already, I pose this question:

What will you do if it turns out to suck?

Now, obviously, I don't mean "I'd rant/start a revolution", but what would you do with regards to sucessive Total War titles?

Obviously we have to judge each game on its own merits, but two bad-to-average games in a row can't be all that good

Would a bad Napoleon make you avoid further TW titles? Would it jade you like it has jaded Forlorn and Humble, amongst others?

Basically, would a bad Napoleon affect your outlook on the series permenantly?

I couldn't play ETW until the July patch because of CTDs, and even then hardly ever saw the AI use naval invasions. It was the first title I was disappointed in.

Since this one rotten apple is, imo, offset by the many wonderful earlier ones, I've given them the benefit of the doubt and pre-ordered NTW.

If NTW doesn't excite me to the same level as their earlier titles, it really won't matter to me how much they pay off PC Gamer to promote their product, won't matter how many cutesy words Kieran can say, won't matter if its Rome II with a special Caligula statue surrounded by naked nymphs....we will be done until the buzz after release is motivational to try them. Never again will they have my pre-order trust.

Fortunately the earlier TW games are good and getting better all the time thanks to the modders. Tons of mods for MTW2 and RTW with different units and time periods. The lack of moddability for ETW and NTW is going to make for a stale vanilla game. Eye candy DLC does nothing to excite me.

Originally Posted by Turbo

Fortunately the earlier TW games are good and getting better all the time thanks to the modders. Tons of mods for MTW2 and RTW with different units and time periods. The lack of moddability for ETW and NTW is going to make for a stale vanilla game. Eye candy DLC does nothing to excite me.

yeh im definately annoyed at the deliberate attempt to cut modding by the suits so they have complete control over what we can play. they want anything extra to cost money. buggers

Thus far I've been pretending to myself that I believe CA learned its lesson from ETW despite all the contrary evidence and have, therefore, confined most of my rants to historical issues which modders will no doubt correct quickly.

If NTW actually proves to be as broken as ETW on launch, well, I may have consider joining the ranks of 'never buy another TW game at launch again.' people.

Originally Posted by Turbo

Fortunately the earlier TW games are good and getting better all the time thanks to the modders. Tons of mods for MTW2 and RTW with different units and time periods. The lack of moddability for ETW and NTW is going to make for a stale vanilla game. Eye candy DLC does nothing to excite me.

Hit the nail on the head my man.... CA seems to be placing all their emphasis on smaller scale, "shiney, pretty" battles, rather than Theatre/Worldwide strategy and truely TOTAL WAR'esque gigantic battles.

I'll NEVER forget my most epic total war battle ever, playing SPQR mod. I was finally able to move on the Senate's Armies, and marched on Rome. I had 3 full stacks versus 4 different Senate Armies in the first battle, follow on battles were multi stack battles as well. I had to turn down all my video settings to get it to run, but it was playable.


ETW.. and it appears NTW have abandoned the CORE aspects that made all the other TW games so great.

-Modder Friendly(Number ONE reason the TW series has been so great)

-Ability to control, or allow ALL reinforcing armies 'en masse, to enter the battle simultaneously, resulting in EPIC, multistack battles. (HUGE.. HUGE.. HUGE step TEN YEARS backwards in the progression of the Total War sersies with Empire's trickle in reinforcement system).

-Ability to decide WHICH, if any, reinforcing armies you want to join the battle.

-Interactive Family Tree

-Ability to Name successors

-Functional, believable SIEGES. Ladders, trenchworks, tunneling, use of fire...

caveat: Functional BAI and CAI, are what everything's built around, still not FULLY FUNCTIONAL in Empire 11 months after release. Too bad I have to mention this one.

I wouls still buy the next TW's. The only reason is because CA's Revolution/Evolution idea, meaning the next standalone TW is going to be on a new engine, or still Warparth, but completely revamped, with new features, and could be possibly the best engine yet, or the worst. So as I see it, TW games are always surpising customers, ETW was set for a win, but look at it now, NTW is set at nothing, we don't have many expectations atm, its still 50/50, same with the next TW, who knows! For me, I buy TW games cause I'm a TW fan, and I feel like I'm missing out, unless its a really bag game, worse than ETW!

Originally Posted by Marshal Beale

the next standalone TW is going to be on a new engine, or still Warparth

Its Warscape mate

If its bad, mods will fix it

If NTW is a bad game than I will just put it aside and do something else. If they move away from the gunpowder eras and go back to Roman times or Medieval times than I will probably buy the next title.

If NTW fails, that's it.

If it is bad I won't be crying CA a river..

i'd probably not buy another TW game on release, nor preorder.

coming from EB to ETW was a painful experience: far too buggy. i will probably get Napoleon, but only after a while, and if it turns out to be another 'mainstream gem' with greta reviews from the review sites, and terrible user reviews, then i'll pass.

CA dropped the ball big time with E:TW, and ignoring/failing to patch the game, and thus leaving issues unsorted so long after release is unacceptable.

i'll just keep playing EB, and buy M2TW:Kingdoms, and wait for EB2. there's also Roma Surrectum...

IF and its a big IF NTW turns out to suck then you can kiss ww1 TW goodbye as RTW2 would be a dead cert

as a matter of fact, if it sucks I may skip next Tw game.

But more than sucking NTW this will depend on the period they choose for next title. For I HATE coming back, where we all have been.

If they make rome2 I do not buy it. Only thing they may improve about ROME is eye-candy (no-clones).
Perhaps only comback I would accept would be SHOGUN 2 (we had not seen this period in 3D yet also there is interesting change in warfare during sengoku period, when muskets were introduced.

But more than that. If CA finds some period totally new and with different strategy, tactics.. It would tease me most to find out how it works. Something we do not expect or think that would not work.
Something with new level of gameplay.

1/ So if you say WW1 is impossible - I agree, but if CA dares to go there, somehow -THAT WOULD make me want to see how they fare and see for myself. i would buy THAT.

2/ What about 30-years war? Muskets, pikes, swords, guns, dragoons all there. End of middle-ages, many great generals.. religious wars, etc.

3/ Ancient China? - count me in (would THAT not be a money machine CA? think of the Chinese market - my bets are on this one, CA loves money)

4/ American civil war + conquest of the west: cool period, american players would be in heaven. Cool features: slavery, many well described historical battles to be scripted and refought. Chance to work on new way to aproach skirmish fight, using terain (shooting when lying, using corners of buildings, better presented cover-spots: carriages, boxes, logs.. etc. baricades), new way to present native warfare: individualistic skirmishing, hit-and run tactics, with movable settlements (think of advantages, penalties). OH.. almost forgot: RAILROAD - developing trade routs, fast way to move armies, etc.

5/ stone age TW (or Calahara TW) - fight against nature. I must explain this: the BAI is bad... so bad.. it cannot kill player .. so leave the BAI, remove flags and make the player fight herds of wild cattle for food in real time HUNT .. Let the player hide his hunters in a thicket and other group of hunters scaring the cattle to run HEADLESSLY (as the computer armies already do) to their death.

.. well about the last one: I could not resist

I'd be pretty annoyed, and then I'll move on to some other game. I don't know what everyone else's deal is but to me a bad game isn't the end of the world.

My eye's towards CA have changed a lot since Empire made its ugly arrival, I doubt that Napoleon could really hurt my opinion of CA any more but it could close my eye's to them in the future if it is bad. I would still take a look at any new Total War releases but I would certainly wait to see what the comunity thinks about them before making the mistake of buying them again. And I would warn everyone that takes an interest in all new Total War games not to buy them.

I do play Empire a fair bit, but I in no way play it as much or enjoy it as much and the past games. I get bored of playing it really quickly, it has no heart or soul, but you already knew that.

I would like to say that I would be Done With CA.

But CA always has a way of sinking me into the next over rated game somehow.

I told myself I would not buy NTW.... And yet I went and pre ordered it in January anyway. It must be some sort of defect.