Why do (some?) Romanians think John Hunyadi was a Romanian?

[Nikitn]

Hell even the name says he is a Hungarian.

John Hunyadi (Hungarian: Hunyadi János, Romanian: Iancu de Hunedoara, Slovak: Ján Huňady, Serbian: Сибињанин Јанко / Sibinjanin Janko; c. 1387[1] – 11 August 1456), nicknamed The White Knight[2] was a Hungarian general (1444–1446) and Regent-Governor (1446–1453) of the Kingdom of Hungary.[3]. He is widely celebrated in Hungarian history as its most prominent, successful and powerful generalissimo who promoted a revision of dated military doctrine, as such a recognizably outstanding and iconic military opponent of the Ottoman Empire; in a sweeping scope of European military history was undoubtedly the pre-eminent strategist and tactician of the 15th century in Christendom.[3] He was also a Voivode of Transylvania (1441-1446), the patriarch of the Hunyadi family, and father of the most renowned king in Hungarian history, King Matthias Corvinus.
Hunyadi's unique personal martial genius, prowess and wherewithal to prosecute preventive and very muscular aggressive crusading warfare policies that weld together many Christian nationalities against the onslaught of the vastly numerically superior Ottoman Moslem forces achieved a state of integrity, stalemate and détente for the Hungarian Kingdom and the many European states that lay to her periphery.
John Hunyadi's aim to re-organize the military ancien régime constituents of Hungary from strictly a fuedal-based aristocratic levy into an efficient, professional, formidable standing army would bring reform to European military components everywhere in a 'post-Roman' European war-making society that his successor and son, King Matthias Corvinus of Hungary would bring to its ultimate culmination with its ruthless Black Army of Hungary.
John Hunyadi is often considered the bellwether of the European "post-Roman" professional "Standing Army". Hunyadi is mostly renowned as one of the greatest Medieval field commanders of all time, his brilliant and prodigous overthrow of Mehmed II at the Siege of Belgrade in 1456 against overpowering odds is regarded as a seminal piece of European military history as "Having decided the fate of Christendom", and is as decisive a macro-significant event in European historiography as the 732 Battle of Tours and the Battle of Vienna in 1683.
To this very day worldwide, every Catholic and older Protestant churches tolling of church bells at noon means a commemoration of John Hunyadi's very historic victory over the Ottomans in 1456.

[emperorpenguin]

Here we go again. How do you get 3800+ posts by trolling?

[Carach]

Here we go again. How do you get 3800+ posts by trolling?

i can answer that: Moderators doing jack

It is unbelievable he and a couple of his peers have been allowed to remain in this part of the boards..hell at TWC at all.

[CiviC]

Kirov you developped an obsession about Romanians.

However, just to respond to you

Hunyadi (also Hunyady in historical sources) was a Hungarian[1] noble family from the Middle Ages, probably of Romanian[2][3] origin.
Their Romanian ancestry is claimed by medieval authors [4][5] and by the majority of modern historians[6][7][8][9]. A Hungarian source suggests the Cuman[10] ancestry.
The first recorded member of the family was Serbe (also called Serb, Serban or Sorb) who settled in Hunyad county in Transylvania from Wallachia. His son Vojk (alternatively spelled as Voyk or Vajk in English, Voicu in Romanian, Vajk in Hungarian), adopted the name László and adhered to Catholicism (a common practice among Romanian cnezes from Transylvania)[11]. He was ennobled in 1409 and received the estate of Hunyad Castle (now Hunedoara in Romania, then Hunyadvár, now Vajdahunyad in Hungarian) which was to become the hereditary seat of the family. Not a few Hungarian noble families had some Vlach ancestry and intermarriage between the two did not even become controversial until after the Ottoman wars.

[Nikitn]

OMG HE HAD A FEW DISTANT ROMANIAN RELATIVES!! how does this have 2 do with anything?

[CiviC]

OMG HE HAD A FEW DISTANT ROMANIAN RELATIVES!! how does this have 2 do with anything?

Yeah a few distant relatives, like his father, grand father and grand grand father.

[MaximiIian]

OMG HE HAD A FEW DISTANT ROMANIAN RELATIVES!!

Why is it such a big deal if he was Romanian?

[Nikitn]

Back in the middle ages it was irrelevant from which village someone's aunt came from (and where is non-Romanian source that his father was Romanian?). Fact of the matter is he served Hungary in all of his life, and quite exceptionally too. Hell, the army he created even destroyed the Romanian and Turkish forces at the battle of Breadfield.

[CiviC]

Back in the middle ages it was irrelevant from which village someone's aunt came from (and where is non-Romanian source that his father was Romanian?). Fact of the matter is he served Hungary in all of his life, and quite exceptionally too. Hell, the army he created even destroyed the Romanian and Turkish forces at the battle of Breadfield.

It was his father, nobody said about his aunt.
If you pres the references (the little numbers between brackets) you'll see the references, some even contemporary with John Hunyadi some of modern historians, most non Romanians. (you should learn to do some research before making ignorant comments).

Nothing exceptional he fought even Romanians, in Middle Ages people were not loyal to nations, as nations didn't existed, they were loyal to their suzerain. He was an ethnic Romanian loyal to Hungarian Crown. During The Hundred Years War many French nobles were loyal to the English King, still nobody claims those nobles being English.

[jankren]

My god, I had a Romanian roommate one time and this guy couldnt stop talking about the Hungarians and the Gypsies.

[CiviC]

My god, I had a Romanian roommate one time and this guy couldnt stop talking about the Hungarians and the Gypsies.

He was probably the Romanian counter part of snipa
Now seriously is anything on topic you want to say?

[Romano-Dacis]

My god, I had a Romanian roommate one time and this guy couldnt stop talking about the Hungarians and the Gypsies.

If I had a nickel for ever muslim that would not stop talking about "evil organ-harvesting Jews"...

[Dr. Oza]

If I had a nickel for ever muslim that would not stop talking about "evil organ-harvesting Jews"...

u did not just go there, first of all he isnt even muslim, lol

but i am

if u want to go into a crazy forum-crossing hate bash with other balkans and russians , do so, god knows u all dont have the turks to collectively hate anymore

but that was not necesary, try to be mature, youre a citizen for gods sake

[Atterdag]

In hungarian: „Barátaim, védjétek meg a kereszténységet és Magyarországot minden ellenségtõl és kövessétek példámat a pogány elleni harcban. Egymás között ne veszekedjetek. Ha erõiteket veszekedésre pazaroljátok, megpecsételitek saját sorsotokat és megássátok a haza sírját.”

Is there a way to double check that this is actually true?

because their country sucks so much that they need at least one great man in their history?
it really only matters of what he thought of himself not what some illiterate romanian thinks.

That's pretty much the same conclusion I've arrived at. Deeply silly, of course, but I also find it rather interesting that seemingly all posters from this poor Eastern European country buy into this gig.

[Carpathian Wolf]

That's pretty much the same conclusion I've arrived at. Deeply silly, of course, but I also find it rather interesting that seemingly all posters from this poor Eastern European country buy into this gig.

Because nobody from western Europe ever discusses their histories, battles, and national heroes....they've evolved beyond that. Oh so enlightened. Please please please come to my little poor mud hole village and teach me the enlightment of freedom and democracy magic spaceman from the west!





In case you didn't notice, (and I don't think you would) it was Russian Kirov who made this troll thread, and snipa yelping in here about his unhistorical non sense. I don't think correcting his non sense for people who might want to discuss history is wrong. But sure go ahead and go on with the east European bashing. Because we all know people who feel good about themselves always do that.

[Carpathian Wolf]

I think what everyone is missing is Kirov's assumption that "HUNyadi" was evidence of his Hungarian origin...I mean if that doesn't make you lulz...

[Pious Agnost]

Why does his ethnicity matter, anyway?

[Carpathian Wolf]

It's just a historical detail and matters just that much.

[SorelusImperion]

If I had a nickel for ever muslim that would not stop talking about "evil organ-harvesting Jews"...

... you'd be poorer than if yo had a nickel for each muslim not talking at all about "evil organ-harvesting Jews".

It's just a historical detail and matters just that much.

Given the time in which Hunyadi lived it doesn't matter at all. Nobility was pretty much international. First and foremost he was active within the political entiety of the Kingdom of Hungary in so far he was "hungarian" but given where he lived it is most likely that his ancestry was not solely magyar. The most accurate answer within the context of the time would be: "Hunyadi was a Hungarian noble with transylvanian ancestry" (I consciously avoid "Romanian" since Romania did not exist yet)

[Romano-Dacis]

Given the time in which Hunyadi lived it doesn't matter at all.

This is a very liberal thing to say regarding history. The concept of nationality is dismissed, but there is really no evidence for such a dismissal. There were distinctions between a noble of Szeckler origin and a noble of Saxon origin in Transylvania.
The fact that he was Romanian mattered quite a fair bit to him. It's no coincidence that more Romanian cneazes reached the status of nobles in Transylvania during Hunyadi's reign than during the rest of Transylvania's history. I don't believe in coincidence. Ethnicity, if not nationality, remained a significant social factor in Transylvania for many centuries.
http://www.stm.unipi.it/clioh/tabs/l...op_111-124.pdf

The most accurate answer within the context of the time would be: "Hunyadi was a Hungarian noble with transylvanian ancestry" (I consciously avoid "Romanian" since Romania did not exist yet)

So on the one hand you deny the concept of nationality, yet on the other you say that a group cannot exist because its state did not exist yet... thereby projecting the idea of nation-state into the past.
This is incredibly ignorant. It's like saying Serbs no longer existed because Serbia ceased to exist in 1459. Consider the huge list of peoples' that did not have a unified state in the Middle Ages: Italians, French, Germans, Russians, Albanians, Ruthenians, Estonians, Finns, Romansch... the list is formidable.
By your logic, Teutonic Knight is more of an ethnicity than Russian...