Infantry Generals Battle Performance

[confused german]

I have a question to you all concerning the performance of your infantry generals themselves in the battle situation. By "infantry general" i mean a general whose bodyguards are a footsoldier unit.


Looking at them in close view I saw they appear to be quite incapable of melee battle only surviving due to their hitpoints: Constantly they perform the "i got hit"-animation, seldomly a blocking or attacking move. No matter the enemey they get beaten up all the time, only occasionally doing something else. Then suddenly sometimes they get a freakin boost and kill several guys in a row. I once even had it that my general, being the last man standing, hew his way deeply into a goblin unit. He killed another ten or twelve and then fell. Everytime he hit somebody he moved deeper into the unit (because he performed the special hit animation were the beaten enemy turns round and the good guy stabs him in the back) and so it seemed the big goblin unit couldn't "aim" on him correctly, they did do nearly nothing.

So, how do your infantry generals act in battle? Do they perform well?

[Seleukos_I.]

I don't like Infantry generals that much. They are very useful when you have to defend a settlement, but I prefer the mounted ones.

[Deedlit]

I don't like Infantry generals that much. They are very useful when you have to defend a settlement, but I prefer the mounted ones.

Yeah infantry generals suck. Its not that there not mounted. Its just that they never seem to last as long in combat.

[confused german]

Well, I think they got a special heroic attitude with them, if you know what i mean?

[Lordinquisitor]

Well, I think they got a special heroic attitude with them, if you know what i mean?

Till you realize that a devastating charge looks far more heroic.

[confused german]

"devastating charge"


been there, done that

[KingLeonidas300]

most of the time i have my general in battle he just stands there taking hits and he doesnt swing at all he just lets the enemy pount on him till he dies? happen to anyone?

[mattgoby]

i like some suck as the silvian elves and ithilien rangers but i am always reminded of the battle where i killed gimli with 3 units of elf light archers

[confused german]

most of the time i have my general in battle he just stands there taking hits and he doesnt swing at all he just lets the enemy pount on him till he dies? happen to anyone?

Yes! That's what i'm talking about. I experience it all the time and in battle testing i found out: it gets worse if his bodyguard got high defensive-skill. I supposed generals got no proper block animation. But they have, they just don't do it.

[KingLeonidas300]

Yes! That's what i'm talking about. I experience it all the time and in battle testing i found out: it gets worse if his bodyguard got high defensive-skill. I supposed generals got no proper block animation. But they have, they just don't do it.

ah yeah like i get all excited when i have my generals in battle especially boromir and when they go to fight they jusst stand there taking hits till they die, sucks doesnt it? i wonder if it is a bug? something must be done!

[Dava2710]

same here and it's very anoying

[confused german]

Okay, something has to be done. Everyone says "the general has the stats of his bg" but obviously something is different. Anyone goy any ideas what?

Edit: I posted an own threat about this in the bugs&technical-help corner http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...43#post6759743 I find it's a better place for modding discussion.

[Muffer Nl]

Actually the BG get the stats their general has. I read this when the Balrog was discussed.

[confused german]

Actually the BG get the stats their general has. I read this when the Balrog was discussed.

Well, actually it's more like the other way round but yes, their stats should be equal. But something (besides battle map model and textures) is different, e.g. the gen is always walking on the units left side (which is hardcoded and not possible to change as numerous discussions showed). Regarding performance in battle, i have to say I suppose that the gen (as well as the officer or flagbearer) have a special hightened defensive skill. Why?
1.) They die later than the average soldier in the unit, taking many more what looks like "hits" before.
2.) Very often they perform the "i got hit"-animation without visible effect.
Now, i played around a little with the defensive skill values and my test showed: higher defensive skill does the exact same result: late dying, lot of "hits" (few blocks, no matter if def-skill high or low).
Can somebody give information what defensive skill, armour and attack really do and how they are used in battle game mechanics?

[Muffer Nl]

You should also remember that the general also has more HP. This means he *dies* several times before he dies.

[confused german]

You should also remember that the general also has more HP. This means he *dies* several times before he dies.

Well, I'm not too sure about that: as long as your gen doesn't have "marks of war", "healthy" or similar traits respective ancillaries like shieldbearer or armour, he should not have more than one hp. At least, it's not mentioned anywhere.
Regarding non-charakter generals it becomes even more obvious: Make a test custom battle and field one unit you like against one unit you hate, but has nearly equal strenght. Now, direct attack and regard your (non-charakter, no-hitpoints) general in action.
He is different. He is dying later. I think it looks like more def-skill.


Concerning the whole "infantry gens suck or not"-discussion: I play dwarves .
(But anyways, I like foot-gens for other factions too: in my game dismounted numenorians as mordor bodyguard rock, likewise berserkers for isengard, though it's a strange story to let yourself being protected in battle by this bunch of wild things. If only the general himself wouldn't show such a embarassing behaviour, i would not be forced to play in farest zoom all the time .)

[drogoth232]

Infantry generals on the field work fine for me, even after I was outnumbered but then again Gondor has higher quality.

[Kawee]

It's especially worse when they charge. For whatever reason, the general becomes very isolated. If they're asked to hold their line, it works better, that's why they're quite useful during sieges.

[Seleukos_I.]

I put them on the walls most of the time. Pikemen are much better when it comes to holding a line.

[confused german]

It's especially worse when they charge. For whatever reason, the general becomes very isolated. If they're asked to hold their line, it works better, that's why they're quite useful during sieges.

Hihi, aaarrgh, don't mention their charge!! Especially when you close up a infantry gen unit with a unit of cavalry: say you wanted to charge but abandoned and pulled the riders back, often you see the enemies unit start to move in your direction as to charge, but since your riders get out of range to fast they stop except the general figure and the flagbearer! I've seen it several times: these two continue to charge behind your cav over remarkable distances. Anyone else found it?

I just remember: there were no inf gens in med2, right? But at least the Kingdoms America Campaign fielded many. I didn't play it that much, so anybody got experience, if their foorsoldier generals showed the same flawed behaviour?