Spanish Recruits in the British Army 1812 - 1813

"I never saw better, more orderly, perfectly sober soldiers in my life, and as vedettes, the old German Hussar did not exceed them." -Sir Harry Smith, 95th Rifles

This web page was sent to me by fellow TWC member 'carricanta' & is a most interesting read, so I thought I'd pass it on to you chaps ...

http://www.napoleon-series.org/milit...c_spanish.html

Excellent link + Rep for that

I wonder how they communicated, being spread out amongst British companies

I have recently come by an old diary of a Rhine Bund Westphalian soldier sent to fight in Spain. While initially the man served with his own regiment, soon enough he became detached from it and served for years in a French light inf regiment. After much campaigning up and down the Penninsula he eventually found himself and his company separated from the main group and assaulted by Spanish troops and cavalry. His unit got slaughtered and he came away from it with a sabre blow to his head and Spanish POW. He gets sent to a prison "hospital" near Valencia, then Minorca where him being german helps him meet another german doctor from the British KGL. He enrolls with the KGL, trains in Sicilly and gets sent to Spain where he fights along the east coast his fromer french comrades.

I would think this was not uncommon

I'm not sure I'd want someone like that fighting by my side. He changed sides once ,he could well do it again if the chips were down ...

Originally Posted by Sir Digby Chicken Caesar #

I'm not sure I'd want someone like that fighting by my side. He changed sides once ,he could well do it again if the chips were down ...

I have opened a new thread here to show and translate this very interesting life before it gets lost in time. Will take me a while but its a nice project

I've just read it mate .. great read ! I've commented here as I don't want to mess up yr page for now.
+ rep and waiting for the next installment

: Just an idea mate, maybe it would be better to put each installment in spoilers on the first post. Then any comments won't mess it up

Originally Posted by Ebusitanus

I have opened a new thread here to show and translate this very interesting life before it gets lost in time. Will take me a while but its a nice project

Well, the British Empire employ former enemies like allies (for instance: Sikhs)

Originally Posted by carricanta

Well, the British Empire employ former enemies like allies (for instance: Sikhs)

Hi mate He's talking about a diary he is translating on here about a german soldier fighting for the france ...

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=332135

Originally Posted by Sir Digby Chicken Caesar #

"I never saw better, more orderly, perfectly sober soldiers in my life, and as vedettes, the old German Hussar did not exceed them." -Sir Harry Smith, 95th Rifles

This web page was sent to me by fellow TWC member 'carricanta' & is a most interesting read, so I thought I'd pass it on to you chaps ...

http://www.napoleon-series.org/milit...c_spanish.html

I think I first posted that link in this forum some three months ago. The Napoleon Series website is probably the most presitigious open Napoleonic research group in existence today, any topic there is emminently worthy of repost here. +rep for taste.

Originally Posted by Randall Turner

That's not accurate. I'm referring to the Spanish and Portuguese recruited into the British Army, not those fighting in their own army. And that's one of the reasons I say the 50k number for Vitorio is open to debate, or interpretation. If these guys aren't in the British Army, then they didn't have 50K at Vitorio. (did I get that name right, vitorio, typing quick)

http://www.napoleon-series.org/military/organization/c_spanish.html

"One of the little known episodes of the Peninsular War was the active recruitment of Spanish men into the British Army in 1812 and 1813." <snip> "In 1811, the British Army only recruited 26,000 men to replaced the 21,000 casualties, plus as replacements for ALL of the regiments on active duty, not just those serving in Spain and Portugal. To put it simply, the British Army was running out of men!" <snip>
"Nor could Wellington hope for reinforcements. There were less than 30,000 regular troops left in the British Isles. Many of the battalions were depots for their sister battalions and they were hard press to provide replacements, no less whole units."

Goes on to detail the recruitment particulars. It amounted to a significant percentage of the (admittedly small) British forces, ie, 95th Rifles, "The Spanish recruits for the 1st Battalion comprised 34% of all replacements for the battalion in 1812!" These men were only intended to serve in the Peninsular war, ie...

"One of their conditions of service was that once the war in the Peninsula was over, all Spanish soldiers serving with in British regiments would be discharged and not be required to serve elsewhere. There is some question on whether this occurred in late 1813 when the Allied forces moved into France, or in 1814 after peace was declared and the British Army departed for the British Isles or other locations. Whatever the date, the Spaniards were released and in at least the 95th Rifles, their parting was not a happy one for either side."




He'll get over it.

Edit: I forgot. There's also some question of whether entire Portuguese battalions serving under British command are considered part of the "British Army". The Light Division was half-Portuguese. Again, I'm agreeable to counting them as part of the British Army. Litmus is pretty much whether they were drawing pay directly from the British Army quartermasters.

I'm sorry but I missed that .. Now, where's this +rep you was giving out

The Spanish finally cooperated with the British/Portuguese but it wasn't until the battle at San Marcial that they beat the French alone at this stage of the Peninsular War when Wellington held back the rest of the army to give them the victory.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_San_Marcial

Although there were Spanish recruits in the British regiments most were in Spanish battalions acting as part of Wellington's army with the new blue uniforms and reorganisation

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

You are aware that you have not really added anything to this thread, right? No one was talking about independent battalions and to say San Marcial was the only victory Spain came up to in the whole war, and then because Wellington graciously allowed it to. Well....just read up a bit more. You come across as yet again one of those anglophiles that believe the war in the Penninsula would have been won by Wellington even without Portuguese and Spanish troops tying the rest of the 350.000 men strong Armee de l´Espagne down.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peninsular_War

I didn't say that.I said at this stage of the war. Learn to read.My point about independant Spanish battalions is that not all Spanish were recruited into British regiments. So get off your high horse mate.
http://www.mundoforo.com/archivo/men...o-de-1813.html

I read all this before commenting ,obviously you didn't. I don't just rely on English sources.

I guess you explained yourself rather aweful then. The OP speaks about individual Spaniards integrated in regular british outfits, not auxilliary battalions which are far from unknown. He did not try to say at any point that there were scores of them but nevertheless its an interesting and not very known piece of history.

Whatever but the point is the OP's quote may give the impression that the Spanish at this later stage were only recruited into British regiments.My point is that the majority of Spanish formed thier own reorganised regiments which cooperated with Wellington's army.

Originally Posted by Jihada

Whatever but the point is the OP's quote may give the impression that the Spanish at this later stage were only recruited into British regiments.My point is that the majority of Spanish formed thier own reorganised regiments which cooperated with Wellington's army.

Yeah, but don´t forget the spaniards and portuguese fighting with Napoleon against the british, the spaniards followers of Fernando VII... I think that the Peninsular War was a little "civil war" too.
I know stories about the guerrilla´s war in my country, a real total war against the invaders

Originally Posted by carricanta

Yeah, but don´t forget the spaniards and portuguese fighting with Napoleon against the british, the spaniards followers of Fernando VII... I think that the Peninsular War was a little "civil war" too.
I know stories about the guerrilla´s war in my country, a real total war against the invaders

There was only one Portuguese regiment that served under the French, the Portuguese Legion, which was put together under order of the French, after the first occupation of Portugal. They were sent to France, and served there for the remainder of the war. They never fought against their countrymen.

I expect there were a lot of reprisals in Spain after the war. I remember reading about the Marques de la Romana and the expedition to Denmark ,then defecting to board British ships.

http://hispanismo.org/historia-y-ant...la-romana.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pedro_C...s_of_La_Romana

Originally Posted by Jihada

I expect there were a lot of reprisals in Spain after the war. I remember reading about the Marques de la Romana and the expedition to Denmark ,then defecting to board British ships.

http://hispanismo.org/historia-y-ant...la-romana.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pedro_C...s_of_La_Romana

Yes, but when the kingdom of Spain and France were allies... some troops of the expedition fought against the russians too.
About the reprisals after the war... yes, but is so common in the civil wars

the book "The Spanish Bride" which is an extremely well researched fictionalised version of the above mentioned Sir Harry Smith and his experiences from badajos to waterloo... in that it mentions the Light bobs being wary of the spanish recruits and said that like the Portuguese Cacadores it wasn't a problem with the courage or resolve of the men but often poor morale, supplies, weapons and tactics. these where all due to what both Smith and Kincaid claim to largely be the result of poor native officers. but it is commonly claimed that with good leadership they where equal to any soldier.

Originally Posted by AUSSIE11

the book "The Spanish Bride" which is an extremely well researched fictionalised version of the above mentioned Sir Harry Smith and his experiences from badajos to waterloo...

Badajos (sic)... the correct name is Badajoz

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Badajoz