Gaelic?

[PhilipO'Hayda]

So peolpe were saying in the Suggestions, that they would like more room for more functions in Stainless Steel
So why not put all the Gaelic Functions (Ireland,Scotland and wales) togeter as one to make room. that would work. just give them Edinburgh and the North of Ireland to kick off with.

(give them the Scottish Family Tree and Little land, so the Gaelic Function will have to try to Unite fast, to fight off the English as the English try to take as many lands as they can befor they have a really powerfully enemy to fight in the Gaelic)

Units also fit in
Missle

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Highland Archers,Saethwyr,Scots Guard and Calivermen

Infantry

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Highland Rabble,Ostmen, Scots Pike Militia, Highlanders, Highland Pikemen,Muire,Gallogliach. etc.

Militia Units

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Ceitherne,Cliathairi,Deisi Javelinmen,

Cavalry

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Ridire,Hobiguir and Lord's Retinue

Missile Cavalry

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Horseboys and Mounted Calivermen.

[JorisofHolland]

I don't think this is very hostorically correct. Don't think Ireland and Scotland were ever ruled by the same rulers. Also, Ireland was more celtic than gaelic, if IIRC (though I'm not a historian) And Wales is just represented by rebels, as well as Ireland (RR/RC)

[Chappy4756]

I don't think this is very hostorically correct. Don't think Ireland and Scotland were ever ruled by the same rulers. Also, Ireland was more celtic than gaelic, if IIRC (though I'm not a historian) And Wales is just represented by rebels, as well as Ireland (RR/RC)

I believe Dal Riata, western Scotland was "Gaelic" settlers from a Celtic kingdom of the same name in Northern Ireland (Antrim)....I think in this case the terms Gaelic and Celtic are almost interchangeable. Either case I don't think that there was a united nation in Ireland or Scotland. Might work to have Dal Riata as the compound Irish/Scots faction, and because we re-write history playing the game, unifying both regions wouldn't need to be "historical".

[PhilipO'Hayda]

I believe Dal Riata, western Scotland was "Gaelic" settlers from a Celtic kingdom of the same name in Northern Ireland (Antrim)....I think in this case the terms Gaelic and Celtic are almost interchangeable. Either case I don't think that there was a united nation in Ireland or Scotland. Might work to have Dal Riata as the compound Irish/Scots faction, and because we re-write history playing the game, unifying both regions wouldn't need to be "historical".

the Celts worked as un-United in say, each clan picking to fight or not to fight.
and must of the time Becouse of this way that the Celtic way was run, the Celts would end up fighting each other, half the time.

by the time Gaels way of United thinking came in.
it was to late. They had already lost must of there land and were now going to lose there homeland to the romans.

The Peolpe of Scotland didn't become United untill alexander the 1st and just in time.

so in 1080 there still speaking Gaelic and are put in to clans just like in N.Ireland.

(so for the first part of the Gaelic Campaign you can have the Gaelic trying to Unite all the Gaelic lands and the English power grabbing befor all the clans are United)

[PhilipO'Hayda]

nope you don't know your Hisorty there JorisoFholland.

try looking up the GAA aleast. lol

[Awellesley]

nope you don't know your Hisorty there JorisoFholland.

try looking up the GAA aleast. lol

You are both kind of right. During the time frame of this mod, JOH is correct that they were never ruled by the same ruler. They did often fight together, but rarely officially. The concept of nationhood and national identity was much blurrier in this time period than it is now. It was not uncommon for nobles technically belonging to a kingdom to conduct itself financially and militarily independently. I think having a pan-gaelic faction would be historically incorrect, but perhaps Scotland could recruit directly more Irish units as auxiliaries or something like that.

[cuo]

By the way: It's "factions" not "functions".

[PhilipO'Hayda]

You are both kind of right. During the time frame of this mod, JOH is correct that they were never ruled by the same ruler. They did often fight together, but rarely officially. The concept of nationhood and national identity was much blurrier in this time period than it is now. It was not uncommon for nobles technically belonging to a kingdom to conduct itself financially and militarily independently. I think having a pan-gaelic faction would be historically incorrect, but perhaps Scotland could recruit directly more Irish units as auxiliaries or something like that.

Scotlands not really looked on as Scotland in europe untill 1200 with alexander 1st and robert the bruce.
so there all just Gaelic Clans untill then.

however a few years befor that. we do have ulster taking and moving around the noth of Ireland and Scotland.

I say get rid of both factions and get some new ones in that will make the game a bit more exciting

(well first off I didn't know there was anything wrong with me having Dyslexia so there being a cure is kind of odd)
and 2nd why get rid of a whole lot of cool units?

[gluteus maximus aurelius]

(well first off I didn't know there was anything wrong with me having Dyslexia so there being a cure is kind of odd)
and 2nd why get rid of a whole lot of cool units?

On the first, it's just a joke from The Naked Gun, no offence or downbeating intended.

Secondly, to me Scotland's only purpose in M2TW is to stop England from having such an easy time of it. I can't stand waltzing around with pikes all the time, and would much rather waltz around with peasants in all honesty. Furthermore, neither Ireland or Scotland were actually a power at all at this time (or in fact at any time whatsoever) and therefore to put what was a loose confederation of tribes opposed to the brutal rule of a foreign king into a game of superpowers seems strange. If you told any M2TW player that the number of factions had to be trimmed down by one, you can bet your ass they're more likely to say Scotland than any other faction.

[PhilipO'Hayda]

On the first, it's just a joke from The Naked Gun, no offence or downbeating intended.

Secondly, to me Scotland's only purpose in M2TW is to stop England from having such an easy time of it. I can't stand waltzing around with pikes all the time, and would much rather waltz around with peasants in all honesty. Furthermore, neither Ireland or Scotland were actually a power at all at this time (or in fact at any time whatsoever) and therefore to put what was a loose confederation of tribes opposed to the brutal rule of a foreign king into a game of superpowers seems strange. If you told any M2TW player that the number of factions had to be trimmed down by one, you can bet your ass they're more likely to say Scotland than any other faction.

I think you sould watch all of the History Of Scotland http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hG01ZzlKxI if you get the time and hopefully you will see why Scotland was added to Total war.

its a very good show. so if anyone eles is thinking about it, i think everyone sould, have a look of it.

[Awellesley]

Scotlands not really looked on as Scotland in europe untill 1200 with alexander 1st and robert the bruce.
so there all just Gaelic Clans untill then.

however a few years befor that. we do have ulster taking and moving around the noth of Ireland and Scotland.

Exactly what time frame are you talking about? I dont want to get into a history debate here, but for most of the middle ages, Ulster was ruled by norman lords. And north Scotland was called Scotia (land of the Gaels-Latin) from the 11th Century (1000's) and possibly earlier. Alba was the name in Gaelic btw. Since there were also pockets of English, Norse and Normans in "Scotland", the whole country would not have been the "Land of the Gaels" and would not have been referred to as such. Like I was explaining before, the concept of nationhood was much more fluid in these times. Thus the place with the highest concentration of "Scots"- the north- was called "Scotland". However more territory than this was under the control of the Scottish king. This reality would be very difficult to represent in M2TW.

[PhilipO'Hayda]

Exactly what time frame are you talking about? I dont want to get into a history debate here, but for most of the middle ages, Ulster was ruled by norman lords. And north Scotland was called Scotia (land of the Gaels-Latin) from the 11th Century (1000's) and possibly earlier. Alba was the name in Gaelic btw. Since there were also pockets of English, Norse and Normans in "Scotland", the whole country would not have been the "Land of the Gaels" and would not have been referred to as such. Like I was explaining before, the concept of nationhood was much more fluid in these times. Thus the place with the highest concentration of "Scots"- the north- was called "Scotland". However more territory than this was under the control of the Scottish king. This reality would be very difficult to represent in M2TW.

the game kicks off befor the normans came over to say hello.
I thought it was the o'neills of ulster that run the N.Ireland till king charles cames over.

[Henry707]

The only good about this faction would be the Gaelic Bread - which in my opinion is the reason to go to Pizza Hut.

Sorry but I'm not a fan.

Henri

[gluteus maximus aurelius]

I say get rid of both factions and get some new ones in that will make the game a bit more exciting

[Kawee]

Assuming it has historical place, this faction would be quite the powerhouse no? Combines the solidity of the Scot Pikemen with the fire power of the Welsh longbowmen! Plus, once it kicks England out of the picture, which it will because England will now face one strong enemy rather than two week ones, it's got a solid base to kick some serious butt.

I say get rid of both factions and get some new ones in that will make the game a bit more exciting

Wouldn't that make playing England a tad too easy? It would take the British Isle unchallenged? And how then would you represent the Scot pikemen? Does England get to recruit them?

[Awellesley]

The O'Neils held power in the west of ulster, the east fell to Normans such as the de Lacy's and the de Courcy's.

[PhilipO'Hayda]

The O'Neils held power in the west of ulster, the east fell to Normans such as the de Lacy's and the de Courcy's.

A! thanks for that. I didn't know that. but the games site at 1080.

[riadach]

The O'Neils held power in the west of ulster, the east fell to Normans such as the de Lacy's and the de Courcy's.

Which they maintained for 150 year, only to fall after De Burgo's Earldom of Ulster disintegrated on the Brown Earl's death. From then on, it was dominated by the Uí Néill Chlann Aodha Bhuí and a collateral branch of the Lord of the Isles, with small vestiges of Anglo-Norman power in MacQuillan of the Route and the Savages. It was hardly dominated by the Normans for most of the middle ages.

[PhilipO'Hayda]

Which they maintained for 150 year, only to fall after De Burgo's Earldom of Ulster disintegrated on the Brown Earl's death. From then on, it was dominated by the Uí Néill Chlann Aodha Bhuí and a collateral branch of the Lord of the Isles, with small vestiges of Anglo-Norman power in MacQuillan of the Route and the Savages. It was hardly dominated by the Normans for most of the middle ages.

I was thinking that alright, that sounds more like the Hisorty I know little of. (right now!)

[Cináed]

Scotland was a mature medieval kingdom by the time the game starts. To suggest that it was some sort of savage tribal confederation is wildly inaccurate: by 1080, the country had filled out to include almost all of her present day borders, with the exception of the Northern Isles and Galloway, neither of which are represented in the game. There's maybe a case for Inverness starting out as rebel ruled, representing the Moray dynasty's semi-autonomy from the Scots king. But there's no question whatsoever about Scotland not being in the game. The idea that it should be removed is laughable.

Now, the idea of Ireland as anything even approaching a united entity is much more questionable. But I certainly wouldn't support having any part of it Scottish-controlled. That would be highly ahistoric.