Tale of a Battle Lost #1, MP tips for a noob.

**Polorutz** · February 07, 2010, 01:17 PM

Hi guys, this is my very first post here but I've been lurking in the shadows for years. I read the AAR's and I've been playing TW games ever since Rome. I've come to TWC many times to learn strategies and such.

Recently I started playing ETW Multiplayer and decided to register on the forum so I can learn a bit more.

So, my idea is to tell you how I lost a battle, then you can discuss with me how you would have proceeded and hopefully I'll end up learning a bit more and get better.

So here goes:

Battle 1: Grassy Flatlands, Medium funds, 1v1 Early Period, rules: No fixed arty.

I chose to play with the Austrians because I like them, my army was as follows:
1x General's Bodyguard
2x Horse Regiment
4x Light Infantry
5x Line infantry
1x 12pdr Artillery

I set up my army to have all light infantry grouped and deployed in a single line 2 ranks deep, all my line inf to be also on a single line 3 ranks deep. I normally move my light infantry way ahead of my main force to skirmish and start moving back after each volley, reload, rinse repeat.

I set up my artillery on my right flank an unlimbered, cavalry was on my centre a couple of meters behind my line.

As soon as the battle started I saw:

Opp Army
1x General's Bodyguard
2x Horse Regiment
4x 12pdr
rest is line infantry.

He formed his infantry on a single line 3 ranks deep, cavalry on flanks and his 4 artillery batteries in front of his line unlimbered and ready to fire.

Situation so far: He outguns me, I outman him, equal cav.

I start by moving my artillery piece forward to engage his line, taking care to not get in range of his own guns, I protect my arty with all my Cav.

After I pepper his left flank with artillery he decides he's had enough, moves all his cavalry to his left flank and moves it forward, I wait and micro my artillery to load grapeshot and wait. His cavalry start to charge my own and his Gen's BG makes a beeline for my single arty unit. I wait until he's very close then order fire, his General dies instantly, my cav engages his but the morale blow is too much and his whole cav force routs.

Situation so far:

I out-man him, I out-cav him, he outguns me.

By now I'm feeling good but I still have no clue on how I'm supposed to take his 4x artillery positions without getting destroyed by grapeshot on the advance. Still he outguns me and I need to move, there is no point in exchanging fire from afar if he's got 4x the firepower.

I try to go right with all my cav and even though I thought I was far enough from his guns, he gets off a lucky volley with 2 of his units and takes out my general and half his BG, with round shot, almost at the end of range. My cav now routs instantly. Tables are turned, I'm left with 15 horses only.

Now here's when I lost the battle. I decide to try and flank him to avoid his guns, I divide my forces, send all my light infantry with 2 line infantry units on his far left flank and move all my guys forward. On the resulting engagement I end up in a precarious position and end up losing the battle.

Noob Questions:

1-How do you engage an opponent who's camping and outguns you? do you rush forwards immediately or is there a stratagem I should know?

2-How would YOU have handled the situation?

3-What starting army would you have chosen and why?

Sorry for the long read, this is just an experiment, if you think this is too much I might make youtube videos instead. Thanks!

-Polo

**Valkierei** · February 07, 2010, 01:25 PM

1) fight him in a way which puts his line between yr men and his art.

2) i cant be bothered to read so i dont know what situation u were in.

3) a powerful army.

**Desufer** · February 07, 2010, 11:46 PM

Originally Posted by Valkierei

1) fight him in a way which puts his line between yr men and his art.

2) i cant be bothered to read so i dont know what situation u were in.

3) a powerful army.

what a helpful post. So glad you could take the time to not read his post and then give him vague and useless advice.

* I note the irony that I also skipped past his post because I didn't feel like reading about the battle and also made a useless post just to fight with you.

**Valkierei** · February 08, 2010, 02:25 AM

Originally Posted by Desufer

what a helpful post. So glad you could take the time to not read his post and then give him vague and useless advice.

* I note the irony that I also skipped past his post because I didn't feel like reading about the battle and also made a useless post just to fight with you.

lol XD dont be a cutie, i havnt read it this time too, the 2nd time i browsed down. well the 1st advice would save him a lot of troops from canister. lol.

strategems, formations, etc. if ure against arty without having arty of your own, meaning you have more firepower by men and men, the best way to win is definitely by using those men to take out those arty before that arty kills more men your extra cash for not buying arty gets u. end of story. rush!

**daniu** · February 07, 2010, 01:48 PM

Valk seems to be going for the title of most useless poster here...

Originally Posted by Polorutz

1-How do you engage an opponent who's camping and outguns you? do you rush forwards immediately or is there a stratagem I should know?

2-How would YOU have handled the situation?

3-What starting army would you have chosen and why?

1 - Flanking as you tried is usually a good idea, can't tell why it didn't work from what you wrote. As a stratagem, meatshield should work (sending a militia in front of your army); it's usually used against late armies to catch the initial rifle fire so you can advance while they reload, but it should work the same against artillery. Speaking of late, in late you can use rifles in light inf doctrine to outshoot cannons, cannister does none or very little damage at their range.

2 - really, I don't get in these kind of situations often. Cannons are one of the scourges of Grassy Flatlands which I stopped playing a while ago now. Anyway, in early, cannons don't have shrapnel so your infantry is pretty safe from them until in cannister range; I would have avoided and ignored them until his line is gone and then taken them out one by one.

3 - That really depends on what suits you, experiment around a little. I don't like 12lbers since they are too slow and sluggy for my taste. Otherwise, your setup seems to make sense; then again, I hardly play early.

**average650** · February 07, 2010, 02:03 PM

The first Thing I would say it 4 light inf is probably too much in early. The only barely outrange other units and th dn't hav the light inf mode where they spread out so they lose that advantage as well. They can be useful, but a 4-5 ratio is probably too high.

It's hard to give real solid advice withou seeing a replay or having some better detail of the battle, but try to get his artillery trying to fire parallel to their line of deployment. That way fewer can engage you at once and they will hit each other. The light inf has better stamina so keep that in mind and use them to move more quickly at the last moment to get the artillery where you want it.

**Strumf663** · February 07, 2010, 02:11 PM

1-How do you engage an opponent who's camping and outguns you? do you rush forwards immediately or is there a stratagem I should know?

Dont be afraid of the art. That was my problem for the longest time. Walk ligh inf into range of the art. Shoot the art. If he keeps inf between him and the art, just advance and shoot the inf. If the art is not howitzer, most people will let art shoot in the back of their own men. Also dont suicide rush art with cav unless, you count the 1 to 1 exchange in your strategy. Sometimes in early i only take indian lancers to take out art in my indian build.

2-How would YOU have handled the situation?

Austian line without chevrons sucks. Always try to pot some chevrons on them so you can use the 150 man perk proprely.

3-What starting army would you have chosen and why?

Maratha army with 7-8 eles, 3 lancers, 3 hindu meat shields and the rest sikh melee guys. It rocks...

**average650** · February 07, 2010, 02:51 PM

Maratha army with 7-8 eles, 3 lancers, 3 hindu meat shields and the rest sikh melee guys. It rocks...

except cannons would really do a number to those elephants before they got there, and as long as they they didn't take too much cav, they will have enough guns to kill the rest of them easily. Honestly, I would love to face an army with that many elephants.

**Strumf663** · February 07, 2010, 02:55 PM

Originally Posted by average650

except cannons would really do a number to those elephants before they got there, and as long as they they didn't take too much cav, they will have enough guns to kill the rest of them easily. Honestly, I would love to face an army with that many elephants.

Eles are strange. They seem to be able to hide behind meat shields re. cannons, yet are easily defeated by two Obijawas, supported by one petun and one medicine man.... Strange...

**average650** · February 07, 2010, 03:47 PM

Originally Posted by Strumf663

Eles are strange. They seem to be able to hide behind meat shields re. cannons, yet are easily defeated by two Obijawas, supported by one petun and one medicine man.... Strange...

re. cannons?

The meatshields would work for cannister, but for round shot all the way to the battle, they'll take some casualties.

**Polorutz** · February 07, 2010, 06:35 PM

Thanks to everyone for their responses,

@daniu, I tried the flanking maneouvre but ended up outnumbered on the flank when he turned half his army to meet my inf, I also timed the main assault wrong and left it a bit too late, allowing him time to deal with the flank first and then the main line. That's why I lost.

Now that I've read your responses I guess I should have marched my guys right up to their cannon and taken it like a man. Will try to next time. If I get my butt handed to me again I'll post more questions.

This community rocks btw.

-P