Eye Candy > Gameplay?

Over the past few weeks I've seen a lot of eye candy discussion about NTW. People ogling over uniform colors, faces, and soforth. I'm not seeing much discussion about the heart of the game: gameplay. I want to know if this game will be fun! How well does the BAI function? What about CAI? Will I actually be able to negotiate a treaty without laughing my ass off at the terms. How about turn one? What about sieges? Are they improved from ETW.

Im hoping this will foster some discussion about NTW gameplay. The game is only a few weeks away and I think gameplay has not been discussed enough. Frankly, I've grown tired of the screenshots. I want to see some gameplay videos.

Originally Posted by Abspara

Over the past few weeks I've seen a lot of eye candy discussion about NTW. People ogling over uniform colors, faces, and soforth. I'm not seeing much discussion about the heart of the game: gameplay.

Because we haven't played it yet. But we've seen it.

Originally Posted by Graphic

Because we haven't played it yet. But we've seen it.

Ah, yes. graphic, nameless et all, representative members of the BFN (Blind Faith of NTW) group.

Abspara is right.

And we have a good idea of the gameplay from ETW and previews. there`s plenty to see of the gameplay for those without gold-coloured blinkers on.

The problem is that we can only discuss the confirmed information or share ideas about a subject, if we really want to judge gameplay we need something to base it on (more than just 15 minutes of a noob melee rushing the ai)

I'm almost afraid to learn the truth. I really don't think that my fragile psyche can handle another TW disappointment. Show me more pretty pictures!

We discuss what we're able. So far, we're seeing lots of imagery from the game - so its very easy to discuss it. The past couple weeks have seen the emergence of beta-preview-builds, as well as the SEGA/CA community events in SF and NY (which is tomorrow), which is enabling us to discuss more the gameplay.

Like you said, gameplay videos would be nice. But we can't really discuss the gameplay until we've, well, seen the gameplay. We've just started seeing that.

We can't really discuss the gameplay until we actually have something in our hands yeah?

Originally Posted by Abspara

Over the past few weeks I've seen a lot of eye candy discussion about NTW. People ogling over uniform colors, faces, and soforth. I'm not seeing much discussion about the heart of the game: gameplay..

that's sadly true. It's indeed one of the reasons TW games became awesome in graphic and so poor in tactic and realism compared the first TW realeases.

CA knows his main target

So I guess you have red coloured blinkers on?
And a representative of the PPV (Prophetically Pessimistic View) group?

Throw generalized words against people and you'll have it "returned to sender"

@Topic; We discuss what we can, until we get to see some true gameplay in form of gameplay videos, we will discuss the graphical part.

The fact that there`s not as much open clear info on gameplay as `easy-to-see` graphics` is no excuse. If people really cared enough about gameplay then you`d see plenty of posts on gameplay, strategy, tactics, not just empty aesthetics 24\7.

Look at game forums like EU3 for example or HOI3, they talk much more about gameplay, 100% more when these games were coming up to release. But people there KNOW what`s important to a strategy game.

And I would finally add... How much better does eye candy need to be, really? Was MTW2 not good enough? Do your eyes need to bleed before you`re happy? They could have stayed with the MTW2 graphics and bought 5 AI programmers to make CERTAIN we`d get a game that would be the benchmark for every strategy game out there!

How are we going to discuss something when we don't have facts?
Make assumptions? that's not good enough.

We will get to see the gameplay when the reviews are released and when gameplay videos are uploaded, I can promise you that when that happens there'll be alot of gameplay discussion.

Originally Posted by Greve Af Göteborg

How are we going to discuss something when we don't have facts?
Waffle....

You are not reading what I wrote because you don`t want to deal with my points. I nearly forgot not to get into roundabouts arguments with you again, so I won`t.

Originally Posted by Humble Warrior

You are not reading what I wrote because you don`t want to deal with my points. I nearly forgot not to get into roundabouts arguments with you again, so I won`t.

Seeing how NTW is different from ETW, that's a no-go.
And the previews are beta code, so that's not a fair representation of the game.

We will see true gameplay when the reviews and the gameplay videos come out.

Edit; you replaced my arguments with "Waffle" how disrespectful.

Originally Posted by Greve Af Göteborg

Seeing how NTW is different from ETW, that's a no-go.
And the previews are beta code, so that's not a fair representation of the game.

We will see true gameplay when the reviews and the gameplay videos come out.

Edit; you replaced my arguments with "Waffle" how disrespectful.

Not necessarily, the reviewers may play scripted battles and CA may show us a human vs. human game again and play it off as AI.

The status quo is that CA does not know how to properly program BAI, Sieges, etc. The proof will be in the pudding but everyone has a right to be skeptical. If the BAI and other AI in ETW was fine, we'd all have the same faith as you. But right now, that is blind faith. As Kieren said, "Judge CA by their actions." Their BAI stinks and they refuse to fix it....So that's what I will judge them on until proven differently.

Originally Posted by irish437

Not necessarily, the reviewers may play scripted battles and CA may show us a human vs. human game again and play it off as AI.

The status quo is that CA does not know how to properly program BAI, Sieges, etc. The proof will be in the pudding but everyone has a right to be skeptical. If the BAI and other AI in ETW was fine, we'd all have the same faith as you. But right now, that is blind faith. As Kieren said, "Judge CA by their actions." Their BAI stinks and they refuse to fix it....So that's what I will judge them on until proven differently.

The fact remains that, as much as many of the people in this community critisize CA to no end (myself included), we still line up and buy the games as they come out.

That means many of us still choose to hope that the BAI will improve, because whether we like it or not, as far as massive battles are concerned, CA has little if any competition.

Originally Posted by irish437

Not necessarily, the reviewers may play scripted battles and CA may show us a human vs. human game again and play it off as AI.

The status quo is that CA does not know how to properly program BAI, Sieges, etc. The proof will be in the pudding but everyone has a right to be skeptical. If the BAI and other AI in ETW was fine, we'd all have the same faith as you. But right now, that is blind faith. As Kieren said, "Judge CA by their actions." Their BAI stinks and they refuse to fix it....So that's what I will judge them on until proven differently.

Thanks for writing this (+rep)

Well if you don't have confidence about the gameplay there's a simple solution- don't buy the damn thing. Time will vindicate your decision either way. As release is impending it seems odd there hasn't been any gameplay vids to digest so perhaps holding off is the wisest course of action.

Sadly many gamers have all the self-restraint of dogs in heat.

From the most recent refresh of my browser - these are the applicable thread titles from page one of NTW General Discussion:

Please tell me this is an in-game pic! = Eye candy.

protectorate units? = Game play.

SOME QUESTIONS ANSWERED by Kieran (not all) = Game play.

New interview of Kieran in San Francisco event. = Game play.

NTW forts = Game play.

Dead Bodies. = Eye candy.

Column and fire = Game play.

Another review on the SF event = Game play

Cannon ball craters! = Eye candy



That list omits topics that can't be specifically placed into either category (say, discussing DLC or CA). Sure, there's talk of eye candy, but I'm failing to see the extreme disparity between game play and eye candy discussions. Maybe you'll just completely forget all the topics discussing the wonderful new army-specific sprites that came out with HOI3?

And while I'm sure you'll run back here and claim that the SF Event threads don't count as gameplay discussions, just remember that by discounting those as gameplay discussions, you'll be proving "graphic, nameless et al" and the "BFN"'s point - that there simply isn't enough material to have the lengthy discussions you so desire.

Originally Posted by KippyK

From the most recent refresh of my browser - these are the applicable thread titles from page one of NTW General Discussion:

Please tell me this is an in-game pic! = Eye candy.

protectorate units? = Game play.

SOME QUESTIONS ANSWERED by Kieran (not all) = Game play.

New interview of Kieran in San Francisco event. = Game play.

NTW forts = Game play.

Dead Bodies. = Eye candy.

Column and fire = Game play.

Another review on the SF event = Game play

Cannon ball craters! = Eye candy



That list omits topics that can't be specifically placed into either category (say, discussing DLC or CA). Sure, there's talk of eye candy, but I'm failing to see the extreme disparity between game play and eye candy discussions. Maybe you'll just completely forget all the topics discussing the wonderful new army-specific sprites that came out with HOI3?

And while I'm sure you'll run back here and claim that the SF Event threads don't count as gameplay discussions, just remember that by discounting those as gameplay discussions, you'll be proving "graphic, nameless et al" and the "BFN"'s point - that there simply isn't enough material to have the lengthy discussions you so desire.

HumbleWarrior, he's got a point. Also, since you really just seem quite 'bitter' maybe you should consider simply not getting the thing.

TDuke, you brought up

Originally Posted by T-Duke

that's sadly true. It's indeed one of the reasons TW games became awesome in graphic and so poor in tactic and realism compared the first TW realeases.

CA knows his main target

Are you forgetting the 'Jedi Generals' of Shogun and MTWI?

Originally Posted by Thoragoros

Are you forgetting the 'Jedi Generals' of Shogun and MTWI?

A single Varangian guardsman General routs the entire Polish Army. Good times.