Too many generals?

**Chicherin** · January 19, 2010, 06:59 AM

I now understand why some of you choose only to accept generals by blood. This man of the hour, and suitable husband malaki means I currently have 25 generals for 34 regions.

Some generals are good as governors, making the populace happy. Most of them, however, on Very Hard level, have negative traits that make them steal my dough.

These are the money stats as things stand at the moment:

Wages: 16850
Army Upkeep: 17314

As you can see, I practically pay half the cash just to generals same as I pay for the whole of my armed forces.

Considering I made 80610 the last turn, this is only 34164 just for my army, and this much only because I have a lot of generals (accepted most of the men of the hour thrown my way).

A quick look at the family tree and there are still 9 kids that will come of age. That's a total of 34 generals. 9x250=2250 so a total of 19100 on wages when that happens.

How do the experts handle this sort of chaos? I'm thinking of making an army of generals with about 5 or so of them and just taking them on a kamikaze mission.

Financially this is a pain in the neck. Also, how do I avoid them from gaining negative traits? It seems charging high taxes on cities inevitably leads to the general gaining deep pockets or becoming a gambler, save very few exceptions.

PS
Corruption. I made 293 from it and spent 8143 on it last turn. How do you reduce the amount of money spent on corruption?

**H Con** · January 19, 2010, 07:07 AM

Make sure your generals aren't corrupt.

I'm not sure, but I think you earn cash from other factions' corrupt generals.

**cisse** · January 19, 2010, 07:08 AM

Either accept less generals into your family or send them on a mission to die.

Apart from the influence of your governors, corruption is higher when your cities are further away from the capital, so you can perhaps choose a new capital more central in your empire.

**Soul Firez** · January 19, 2010, 07:20 AM

Leaving a genral in cities that have certain buildings will lead to bad traits eg brothel they get sexual traits taverns they become drinkers etc . you can avoid this by every now and then say every 3 turns step them out of the city to finish one round outside the city this will help greatly in stopping them from become greedy womanising drunks who will gamble and steal your money till your broke

Dont take adoptions dont take man of the hour just dont (unless you are a small nation and desperately need the leaders. You think real royal families just let any old commoner in and most the guys they offer you are terrible generals so dont take them

only if an exceptionally good one appears should you even consider it

**Chicherin** · January 19, 2010, 07:42 AM

I've made my decision. When the Mongols come, and more likely than not they will come straight for me, I will have a full stack of generals waiting for them

Muhuhahah

**Silent Assassin** · January 19, 2010, 08:05 AM

Well having too much general is like not having enough, you are right some players don't know that your generals costs you money so more you have more it costs ya. This is something important to keep in mind

**Nazgûl Killer** · January 19, 2010, 08:37 AM

I don't care where I get generals from, as long as they are good enough. The generals I prefer, however, are those who come up blank - No chivalry nor command, yet a lot of loyalty and I don't mind piety.
This way I can build them from the very foundations and I feel much better about them like this.

I rarely have more than 7 fighting generals, yet it depends on the size of my kingdom. Right now with my Stainless Steel Venitian campaign I have 50 regions and 30 generals, only 10 of which are fighting generals - 5 of which have no enemy to fight, not even a perceivable enemy.
Getting more than 10 fighting generals seems useless to me, I mean, why should you? That's just too many armies to handle. I usually have 2 generals per army, so this means I have around 5 fighting armies, however, having generals at important cities (With chivalry, of course) can only help - As long as you keep a tight eye on their traits.

Having generals in important border-castles can be very helpful in time of dire need, as a general is far, far, better than a captain and highly unlikely to rebel, unless truly disloyal.

In conclusion: Having more than 30 generals just seems odd to me, no matter how many regions you have, and having more than 10 fighting generals is just ill advised. Too much micromanagement means mistakes are bound to happen, some might even cost you the game.

The last important thing I have to say: make sure your prince and king are not in the same army, yet also that they will be in the front lines.

Why should they be in the front lines?
1) Princes and Kings are the most important characters you have, getting them up with command, authority and the likes improves your relations with everyone (Yes, it does) and increases the loyalty of your other generals.
2) Princes and Kings supply the best morale bonuses for your soldiers on the battlefield.
3) Princes and Kings are usually very hard to kill/take.

Why not in the same army?
1) If your king's army (With your prince in it) is repelled or loses a battle, BOTH your king AND prince will suffer decrease in many traits and gain unwanted traits - Something you don't want.
2) If you put your king and prince in the same army, you're giving your enemy the perfect opportunity to cut your family tree right there and then.
3) The morale bonuses they both supply are just too good to waste them on just one army.

**cisse** · January 19, 2010, 01:05 PM

Didn't know about the traits of Kings/Princes affecting your standing with other nations, or about them giving an extra morale bonus. Thanks for the tip!

**Nazgûl Killer** · January 19, 2010, 01:29 PM

It's nothing special, just notice the traits such as "Heir Apparent" and stuff like that, Kings and Princes tend to get amazing traits.

**Chicherin** · January 19, 2010, 03:58 PM

Thanks for the tips guys. Definitely going to have to shave off some of those generals and keep the minimum possible.

**RMSN NIKE** · January 19, 2010, 07:16 PM

Originally Posted by Chicherin

Wages: 16850
Army Upkeep: 17314

A quick look at the family tree and there are still 9 kids that will come of age. That's a total of 34 generals. 9x250=2250 so a total of 19100 on wages when that happens.

PS
Corruption. I made 293 from it and spent 8143 on it last turn. How do you reduce the amount of money spent on corruption?

it is 34 x 200 = 6800 for each general, 16850 - 6800 = 10050, which is for your Priests, Spies, Assassins, Princess and Admirals. If your are playing Vanilla Grand Campaign and Kingdoms.

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...=221123&page=2

I posted my search here, post #35, 38 and 42 with additional information and clarifications.

There were 2 other topics about wages before.

Reduce corruption by building Law buildings, and not get bad traits by not getting too much money. It is the same theme as in RTW, after you earn to certain amount of money, bad traits will start to appear.

**Silent Assassin** · January 20, 2010, 07:33 AM

Also Corruption is due in part by building Brothels buildings and the effect is even bigger with higher level buildings of that line

**Chicherin** · January 20, 2010, 09:00 AM

But Brothels and Inns increase population growth as they are considered sources of Entertainment and Fun.

Realistically speaking, I think a Tavern in every province is a must. I mean, we all need a pint every now and then.

**Silent Assassin** · January 20, 2010, 09:01 AM

Originally Posted by Chicherin

But Brothels and Inns increase population growth as they are considered sources of Entertainment and Fun.

Realistically speaking, I think a Tavern in every province is a must. I mean, we all need a pint every now and then.

I agree but it also brings corruption, which in the game and in real life is also the case.

**RMSN NIKE** · January 20, 2010, 04:39 PM

To Chicherin: OK, I am back, do you still need help on the break down of the wages? If so, just let me know.

**Chicherin** · January 20, 2010, 05:08 PM

Hmm that would be nice NIKE. I've noticed they pay more than just generals, since in my Russia campaign where I have 62 spies, 14 assassins and 5 diplomats my wages are higher than in my Hungary campaign where I have the same amount of generals but less spies (42 or so), assassins (7?) and diplomats (2?)

**RMSN NIKE** · January 20, 2010, 08:22 PM

Poland wages 2050 - 50(Diplomat) - 200(2 Priests) - 300(3 Spies) - 200(Assassin) - 600(2 Princess) = 800. 200(Generals only) * 4 = 800.

Using this as a base to input your numbers:

Russia Wages: 16850 - (100 x 62 Spy) = 10650 - (50 x 5 Diplomat) = 10400 - (14 x 200 Assassin) = 7600 - (25 x 200) = 2600. The rest depends on your Priest, Princess and Admirals. And Princess' coast also varies depending on the age.

I am guessing you do not have Princess or Priests. As I mention in the post in the other thread, the 200 for the Family Member is for each individual Generals that added only during battle. It is their "allowance" for that turn. The Upkeep is for the bodyguard soldiers. Also, just check each agents, Spy, Diplomat, and Assassin's upkeep from right click of the agent's picture. If there are more questions, I will answer them ASAIC.

Edit: Need to remember that this formula is for Teutonic Campaign. Like I mention a few lines above, check each agent's upkeep, and pluck them into that formula. OOPS! mistake in my calculation, please recheck the bold numbers.

**Chicherin** · January 21, 2010, 06:02 AM

I have a lot of priests dude.

Wait let me count them for you. BRB

So, at the last count:

62 spies, 14 assassins, 5 diplomats, 27 merchants and 38 priests. Oh and a few of my generals died (of old age) so now I've got 24, with 10 in the making.