Ukrainian election.

**Nikitn** · January 17, 2010, 12:33 PM

Yup, (the pro-Russian) Yanukovitch is definitely going to win.

Thank god for that.

**Del Valle** · January 17, 2010, 12:38 PM

Forgive my ignorance on the subject, but what exactly does this mean? A new union between between Russia and Ukraine, or just closer relations?

**Panzerbear** · January 17, 2010, 12:45 PM

I do not think that Yanukovich is pro-Russian. first and foremost, he is pro-Ukrainian. there are absolutely no guarantees that he will take pro-Russian stance on anything when it comes to politics.

but he is definitely more favorable to Russian elites than Yushenko was. the era of US-sponsored orange revolution experiment is hereby over.

**Nikitn** · January 17, 2010, 12:47 PM

Ya he is foremost pro-Ukraine but he wants close relations to Russia (I think even if it would mean worse relations with the West), which is a good thing.

**Tiberios** · January 17, 2010, 12:54 PM

Personally I cannot see why good relations with either the West or Russia automaticly means having bad relations with the opposite. Nor why good relations with the West is a bad thing.

**reavertm** · January 17, 2010, 01:14 PM

Let's see how 2nd round turns out (which is to come in February) - if Juščenko supporters (with strength around ~6%) go after Yulia Tymoshenko, "pro-Russian" wet dream of Nikitn may be over

Janukovych's win is not that 'certain'.

**adamove** · January 17, 2010, 02:00 PM

I think Julia gonna win easyly in 2 turn, just ask yourself would you wote for crimal convicted rapist for president of your country? the reason this guy is popular is that ukrain is very young democracy, east is under heavy propaganda from russia, and russian speaking ukrainians

FREEDOM FOR UKRAINE!

**Nikitn** · January 17, 2010, 01:10 PM

There are many things which Russia and certain* western countries disagree with..

**Admiral Piett** · January 17, 2010, 01:35 PM

Anyone on these boards from there? How are the conditions in this country? Generally from what I've seen of it, it's the only Russian satellite country I'd live in.

**Nikitn** · January 17, 2010, 01:46 PM

Originally Posted by Future Filmmaker

Anyone on these boards from there? How are the conditions in this country? Generally from what I've seen of it, it's the only Russian satellite country I'd live in.

Belarus is a much better alternative (though neither are a satellite country IRL), as it wasn't that much

ed by privatization.

Interesting thing is, it went from the poorest region in Soviet Union to the now richest region in former SU except for the (EU parasites) Baltic.

Originally Posted by reavertm

Let's see how 2nd round turns out (which is to come in February) - if Juščenko supporters (with strength around ~6%) go after Yulia Tymoshenko, "pro-Russian" wet dream of Nikitn may be over

Janukovych's win is not that 'certain'.

Yes it "may be over "

PS. Their strength is like 4%..

**ivan_the_terrible** · January 17, 2010, 05:13 PM

Originally Posted by Future Filmmaker

Anyone on these boards from there? How are the conditions in this country? Generally from what I've seen of it, it's the only Russian satellite country I'd live in.

I'd rather live in Belarus than Ukraine. Or Russia, for that matter.

Ukraine is one of the poorer countries in europe (per capita).

**Heathen Hammer** · January 17, 2010, 02:13 PM

Pro-western or pro-eastern.. Both Timoshenko and Yanukovich are pro-"stealing as much as we can of what was left since collapse of USSR". I also don't think that Yushenko is so pro-west, after all he was stealing gas from Europe like crazy last year. An isn't Timoshenko more pro-Russian anyway?

**Nikitn** · January 17, 2010, 02:16 PM

Timoshenko is more balanced, Yanukovich is more pro Russian. About stealing: I doubt Yanukovich can match the Orange revolution duo.

**Admiral Piett** · January 17, 2010, 02:22 PM

Nikitn, yeah, that happens when you have completely piss-poor privatization. That's why when the US adopted a style of free trade, it had to have a certain type of policy that was best suited to the economy. I think private economies are like unleashing a powerful beast. If you can steer it in the right direction, it will bulldoze its way into booming prosperity, if you let it steer too wild, it will run the country right off a cliff. I don't think many of the nations in the former Soviet Union were at all ready for the type of reforms it had instituted with little guidance at all. It should have been a more gradual, moderate process.

Of course, I may be wrong, it's just that's what I'm seeing.

**Nikitn** · January 17, 2010, 02:27 PM

Problem is when the Soviet Union collapsed (thanks to Yeltsin and other moronic republic leaders) the entire Soviet economy collapsed as well. It had to do with the crappy privatization (which was not only done horrible, it was also done FAR too much - practically everything slipped away from state ownership) as well as the fact that the manufacturing and resource extraction areaswere completely separated by new states, so things couldn't work in union any-more.

**Admiral Piett** · January 17, 2010, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by Nikitn

Problem is when the Soviet Union collapsed (thanks to Yeltsin and other moronic republic leaders) the entire Soviet economy collapsed as well. It had to do with the crappy privatization (which was not only done horrible, it was also done FAR too much - practically everything slipped away from state ownership) as well as the fact that the manufacturing and resource extraction areaswere completely separated by new states, so things couldn't work in union any-more.

Yeah, I see how that could be horrid. It's like going from an almost entirely command market into a Thatcherite republic. And we all see how well that goes.

For some reason, I've for a while had a fondness for Russia and Ukraine. I don't know what it is, but the fact that its so different a place and culture, yet its still distinctly European is striking. Plus there's a certain mystery about both countries that I find fascinating.

**Salvatorel** · January 17, 2010, 02:44 PM

Timoshenko is more balanced, Yanukovich is more pro Russian. About stealing: I doubt Yanukovich can match the Orange revolution duo.

Dunno,but fact is that Yanukovich had plenty of time to steal during his tenure as a prime minister and well... apparently he stole enough to send around 60 percent of votes to his opponents

in either way saying that Yanukovich has already won is not quite right,considering Timoshenko's results and that it's very likely that the runoff will be challenging.

**Heathen Hammer** · January 17, 2010, 04:26 PM

Originally Posted by Salvatorel

Dunno,but fact is that Yanukovich had plenty of time to steal during his tenure as a prime minister and well... apparently he stole enough to send around 60 percent of votes to his opponents

in either way saying that Yanukovich has already won is not quite right,considering Timoshenko's results and that it's very likely that the runoff will be challenging.

There was also that Tigipko guy, who received a considerable amounts of votes as well, and people who vote for him would probably give their votes to Yanukovish. After all last time he did large-scale stealing was 5 years ago, and Timoshenko was doing it very recently.

**Salvatorel** · January 17, 2010, 04:49 PM

. After all last time he did large-scale stealing was 5 years ago, and Timoshenko was doing it very recently.

Apparently Ukrainians have rather short memory or are concerned with all these "equality" things and want to let Yanukovich to equate his wealth to that of Timoshchenko's

BTW as far as I've heard that Tihipko guy is rather pragmatic with all this "Russia is our best buddy,but if west pays more than... well,lemme see..." politics
P.S. most Russians always ignore that there is that damn "h" thing in Ukrainian language