slowly going to v2.0

[Sethestel]

Hello guys,

okay, i'm fully enjoying patch 1.4 ! I just love it
I played alone, also in hotseat, tried most of the different factions for the moment

I'd like to make a recap for next 'upgrade' It certainly is going to suggestion part, but it will have a beter visibility here for a few hours I guess

I just want to encourage the modders, as i did in a previous post, to give every faction it's own 'way' of gameplay. It's already what modders are doing, and i love that.

I'm a kind of hardcore gamer, and by that i mean not that i spend hours for a game, but just try to play 'the way the faction would react' in the lore. I'm not for an 'equilibrate gameplay'.. Eriador, for example, will never be a great military leader.. but they have other arguments

Here is some 'gameplay' advise i can give (not anything about fight and units..)


Dwarves :
major strength in : infantry, enginering & trade/money
major flaws in : discovering & 'backstab strategy'

difference with actual 1.4
+ dwarves could reintegrated merchant.
- dwarves should not have spies.
- dwarves should not have assassins.

It would reflect the fact they stay (initaly) in mountain, and don't want to expand in the world of middle-earth.
Merchant back would represent their love for trading and getting treasure.
No spies make their movement and strategical decision more 'blind', so more 'hold on a place' like dwarf do.
No assassins force the dwarves to 'go for it', as they would


Sylvan Elves and High Elves :
major strength in : high quality of the troops
major flaws in : they don't want to expand, but to leave middle-earth

difference with actual 1.4
+ both elves should be allied
- elves : they shouldn't have an objectif of conquering 30 settlements. Their objectif should be destroying OotMM AND Mordor, as the ancestral ennemy, (and Isengard?) but with less regions to hold !
- high elves : no assassins
- sylvan elves : no diplomat


Eriador :
major strength in : trade and light troops
major flaws in : the rest it SHOULD stay weak and peaceful BUT... + war? -> need Alliance

difference with actual 1.4
no stress, it's actually a faction rebuild by modders, and which is going to propose an alternate way of playing by rebuilding arnor
+ Eriador should enjoy the use of Spies, Assassins and guerillas made by rangers. All this with the support of diplomacy to use bribe and ceasefire and look for peace.
+ The 'war' way of playing would come if they choose to extend to Arnor (in new version)
+ Eriador could reintegrated merchant.


Dale :
major strength in : economy and all mix around units
major flaws in : good troops accessible 'later' + war ? -> Need Alliance

difference with actual 1.4
+ Dale could reintegrated merchant.


Rohan and Gondor :

nothing else to say !


Evil faction next time but about Isengard already something :

Isengard:
major strength in : everything ! Diplomacy, economy, expansion, discovering, units...
major flaws in : cavalry units ! (only wargs) + evil faction begin with... nothing 'sophisticated' BUT Isengard tower.

difference with v1.4
+ Isengard should have high abilities in diplomacy, spying and assassins since the begin of play (actually, Sarouman's faction begin with...'nothing' of those ! you have to build all of this..)

..we should remember that 'at the time' Sarouman isn't declared 'evil', and search for the ring with a lot of spies, preparing the invasion which will be discoverd 'later' by the good factions!
So, to represend the high capacity of Isengard to 'sneak' and 'use Wormtong-like specifities, i would introduce since the begin a high level of diplomat + spy + assassin.

Isengard will then need time to 'improve' his military side.. BUT will already have a lot of use of diplomat assassin and spies !

Oki, that's it for today

Hope you enjoy it, and see any good sense in it I just want to improve the difference of gameplay with every faction !
...and it could be great if in the intro of a faction, their where 'tips' explaining 'whichi' direction you should choose playing with it !!

enjoy !

Sethestel

[Vifarc]

Good ideas, I agree with the whole. Maybe that's some work for RC+R!!

- sylvan elves : no diplomat

Ouch! You may be right, but that's tough.
But I however want to be a beta-tester for Silvans without diplomats.

[Æsir]

Why nobody is using Suggestion Thread to post suggestions? Don't you want you suggestions to be implemented? Just discussed around?

[MasterBigAb]

Æsir is right, use the suggestion thread please.
And it will take a while for the next patch, and it probably won't be 2.0 and there are already "other goals" .....

[Russian Gondor]

Well, let us say this. I agree with everything but 2 things. 1) dwarves should not have merchants, they prefer to MINE for everything underground and not go out to trade.

and 2) A faction without diplomats is a dead faction. AI is stupid enough not to bring a diplomat to you when you really really need it.

Other than that I agree with everything except I would like to add something.

Rhun should have their large city near the water when they start to be able to transport troops faster to dale.

[Ozzmosis]

Urgh... no merchants. There will never be merchants in TATW. It has been discussed TOO many times. Just today, another "merchants" thread was closed. The only thing merchants ever gave to M2TW was a little more money. It would not fit in ME and was always unrealistic anyway, so please just let that idea die.
Also, playing dwarves and elves as non-expansionistic, while true to lore, would make for a bloody boring campaign, unless they actually made it that, because of the onslaught of evil factions, they were not able.

[Mega Tortas de Bodemloze]

Nice breakdown....Thanks...+Rep. Sethestel, Welcome the the TWC Forums...

[hazdude222]

on the Dwarves' merchants point - Is there any way to only allow the merchants to be attached to a unit - I say this as dwarves would go out in parties to find and mine and would be a nice addition (probably hardcoded though so don't worry about it)


P.S I am very much interested in these "other goals"

[Lordinquisitor]

The rework of Eriador can be considered big. As is figuring out effective ways to add custom settlements. And maybe even more stuff.

[Russian Gondor]

* hides behind corner from Ozzmosis talking about my steam rolled thread *

[nalivayko]

I love the idea about changing campaign goals for Elves and Dwarves.

To summarize:

1. Make it difficult for Elves and Dwarves to expand their home regions (extremely slow culture growth)
2. Change campaign victory requirement from 30-50 settlements to a much smaller number.
3. Require Elves and Dwarves to eleminate 2-3 evil factions instead.

This will allow people who like to role-play and gift away settlements to their historic owners to still enjoy the campaign and have a chance to see the victory screen once in a while.

[Vifarc]

I love the idea about changing campaign goals for Elves and Dwarves.

Then play RC+R submod, that's in.

[Ozzmosis]

* hides behind corner from Ozzmosis talking about my steam rolled thread *

*ahem* Sorry. I only realised when I looked afterwards! Srsly though, it has been much debated and explained.

[Brightgalrs]

on the Dwarves' merchants point - Is there any way to only allow the merchants to be attached to a unit - I say this as dwarves would go out in parties to find and mine and would be a nice addition (probably hardcoded though so don't worry about it)

I'd say give OotMM and Dwarves merchants and rename them 'prospectors' and 'scavengers'. Then lay out mithril, iron, coal, etc. around the map (mostly around mountains) for them to fight over.

[Astor]

Why shouldn't the dwarves have assassins and spies? If you'd read the books, you'd know that dwarven travellers were a fairly common sight through Bree, staying at the Prancing Pony and going down the Greenway, and occasionally the Shire, travelling from one mountain hold to another. Couldn't some of them report back to their lords on the state of readiness and so on, of the lands they pass through? Elves should be the ones without the spies, as they are much more conspicuous. Faramir mentioned that the Men of Gondor hadn't seen an elf for many long years and Eomer was gobsmacked when he first saw the three hunters. He even thought of Galadriel as a witch.

[Abyrvalg]

Elves should be the ones without the spies, as they are much more conspicuous. Faramir mentioned that the Men of Gondor hadn't seen an elf for many long years and Eomer was gobsmacked when he first saw the three hunters. He even thought of Galadriel as a witch.

It proves that elves had excellent invisible spies