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Thread: IWTE - World editing - (General Discussion)

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  1. #1
    makanyane's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Quote Originally Posted by leo.civil.uefs View Post
    No, it loads ok during daylight, that black only happens at night. That has nothing to do with the new light function, as I said, it seems that the terrain get totally black under the shadow, that is also happening to cliffs wih terrain textures generated by the engine, maybe it is something from TATW and how KingKong has edited the weather/climates.
    yeah, I think he has done that, it's a combination of the weather.xml file and the .lighting files that refers to which are in data/globallighting which looks like either KK or someone else has done some custom stuff to darken night scenes... however if you delete them from the modfolder, your 'path' texture that's used inside Erebor still looks black at night, even if used outside the cave area.

    Even vanilla night lighting for battlemaps makes all textures look a lot darker than they are, your path micro texture looks nearly black already (in photoshop), so when it's darkened by night lighting, plus it's in shadow from the mountain/cave structure, then you're going to wind up with black...

    I think you're so far down the 'dark' scale, the amount of light you get from normal looking effects isn't going to have any impact on it! ...am fiddling with lights currently though will let you know if anything works on it...

  2. #2
    wilddog's Avatar Paintedwolves run free
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Quote Originally Posted by leo.civil.uefs
    No, it loads ok during daylight, that black only happens at night. That has nothing to do with the new light function, as I said, it seems that the terrain get totally black under the shadow, that is also happening to cliffs wih terrain textures generated by the engine, maybe it is something from TATW and how KingKong has edited the weather/climates.
    OK, I thought you were talking about a new issue tied with the lighting but you've just confirmed its a world terrain texture item when something is in shadow rather than anything to do with effects and lighting of .world vertexes. I guess this is something that's been around for a few years but you just decided to mention it now which is the bit I hadn't grasped. I guess you are right its tied to TATW and its setup for.

    Quote Originally Posted by leo.civil.uefs
    my current test is with GIANT light effect I edited in the text files, enlarging it radius.
    You can call the light effect 'Leos mega lighting' it still isn't going to change that the lighting vertex (in the .world file) is currently set based on whether a vertex is less than than 18m (currently) from the light point.

  3. #3
    makanyane's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    RANDOM INFO ABOUT EFFECTS:
    (I'll try and stitch all this stuff together in tutorial form eventually)

    The only effects that which will actually "switch on" lighting if they're assigned to a vertex in vanilla or by IWTE's new "reset complex effects" button are one's with
    type light as the type for one of their components; so in vanilla descr_burning_building.txt
    burning_building_new_medium_set will generate a cast light effect as it's code is
    Code:
    effect_set burning_building_new_medium_set
    
    {
    	lod 10000
    	{
    		flaming_particles_medium
    		fiery_smoke_medium
    		dense_smoke_medium
    		embers_medium
    		burning_building_light
    		burning_building_sound_medium
    		fire_flare_sound
    	}
    }
    which contains burning_building_light which is
    Code:
    effect burning_building_light
    {
    	type light
    	{
    			
    		keyframe_colour
    		{
    				0.00, 	238, 173,  140
    				0.05, 	238, 148, 108
    				0.15	236, 158,152
    				0.18, 	220, 151,  119
    				0.21, 	230, 165,  108
    				0.26, 	238, 177, 137
    				0.31, 	236, 158,152
    		}
    			
    		keyframe_radius
    		{
    				0.0, 	3		
    		}
    		
    		light_map_scale 0.05
    	}
    }
    with the type light bit



    window_fire_small doesn't generate a cast light effect even if referenced by a complex & vertex as its code is
    Code:
    effect_set window_fire_small
    
    {
    	lod 10000
    	{
    		;small_flame
    		flaming_particles_small
    		fiery_smoke_small
    		burning_building_sound_small
    	}
    }
    and if you look up all those included effects, flaming_particles_small etc, you'll see they are all "type particle"

    ********************************************************************************

    Effects that are actually capable of activating cast light, as explained above, should be added with the setting "1" in the dropdown box for "light emitting" when adding the Collision Effect line.
    Effects that aren't should have "0" in the dropdown box. Copies of the combined effects used for the little torches throughout vanilla that use "brazier_small_set" and "light" should have the "light" line set as light emitting, and the brazier line not... because it doesn't contain a light casting effect.

    If you add both as "light emitting" you'll be using up more light effect rows, which makes the Reset process take longer, and might mean you can't get all the effects you want to be activated for a Complex included within the 69 hard coded limit.

    ********************************************************************************
    To get the best possible result from IWTE's new lighting function you ideally need more than 69 light emitting effects in the entire .world, so that IWTE can select up to 69 for each Complex if required to fix an animation bug. (basically where the animation you copied may have referred to, for example, complex effect no.65, and if you then only have 45 complex effects, the animinstances chunk tries and fails to find no.65 and gives you some 'Disco Lighting' effects instead!)

    However you also should remember that only 69 effects can possible be applied to a Complex, so if you've got only one Complex and 90 lights, then 21 of them won't be able to cast light on the structure.

  4. #4
    leo.civil.uefs's Avatar É nóis que vôa bruxão!
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    hey mak we tried making the tree sprites to only be seen really far using IWTE but you remember our flickering thing.

    Now, it is possible to do it by editing some text file? maybe deleting the sprite lines or something.

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    makanyane's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Quote Originally Posted by leo.civil.uefs View Post
    hey mak we tried making the tree sprites to only be seen really far using IWTE but you remember our flickering thing.

    Now, it is possible to do it by editing some text file? maybe deleting the sprite lines or something.
    No the sprites to model switch is solely controlled by the vegetation.db file... and I still think the flickering thing is caused by attempting to display too many trees, either displayed as model... or many more of them displayed as sprite... and then & therefore your graphic card dying

    If you delete sprites for units there's still only a limited amount of them that can appear on battlefield, a dense forest is going to generate a whole lot more tree models... and my computer seems to die (flicker) just on too many tree sprites anyway!

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    wilddog's Avatar Paintedwolves run free
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Could of sworn that question has been asked so many times now with the same basic answer. Can't remember if it was in the IWTE thread or not though as this has become a basic ask Mak a question thread.

  7. #7
    leo.civil.uefs's Avatar É nóis que vôa bruxão!
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Quote Originally Posted by wilddog View Post
    Could of sworn that question has been asked so many times now with the same basic answer. Can't remember if it was in the IWTE thread or not though as this has become a basic ask Mak a question thread.
    I dont remember asking about an alternative way to deal with this.
    Besides, INSISTING has beeing the really big deal in therms of finding ways to do the things we want in this engine, as you can see in my recent founds about pathfinding. So I asked makanyane because she has, always, at least a suggestion for me about something to try. And just because our first tries with IWTE proved of no effectiveness it does not mean that a possible solution has nothing to do with IWTE, so I think the right place to ask is still here, because the IWTE thread is where people will look for answers with matters RELATED WITH IWTE. Dont worry she already warned m about posting the right stuff here.

  8. #8
    wilddog's Avatar Paintedwolves run free
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Next version will have
    1) a speed up of the 3D window changes when amending the world terrain. Change should show in approx 0.2 seconds rather than several seconds. More of an issue for the larger world terrain models.
    2) Speed up of the complex effect light settings. eg Huge city resetting drops from approx 120 seconds to 60 seconds on my machine. I'm still looking at whether I can speed this up further.
    I'm renewing a lot of the software versions I use so not sure when I'll get the next release out.

  9. #9

    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Hi guys, I really don't want to annoy you but still have a few questions.

    - Ok, I'm testing a new custom settlement I created. The attacker (me) breaks the gate, conquers the gatehouse and passes through it but units (defender) placed behind it run to the plaza and stand there, even if there are no defense points (attachments 1 and 2). Also they have a strange behavior while organize (attachments 3 and 4). I've attached the pathfinding.tga with worldobjectPF.tga over it, just in case.

    - add deployment block door
    What is its function? Does it have some relation with the above ?

    - change firing slot
    How does it work? I tried to mess with it but no results. There are two arrow towers (vanilla town), I select them as mainobject and pick up the correct animation (from vanilla town files), but they don't shoot in game.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails FD 1.jpg   FD 2.jpg   FD 3.jpg   FD 4.jpg   fennas_drunin_a_wpf2.jpg  

    Last edited by Arkay; January 06, 2014 at 04:31 PM.

  10. #10
    makanyane's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Quote Originally Posted by Arkay View Post
    Hi guys, I really don't want to annoy you but still have a few questions.

    - Ok, I'm testing a new custom settlement I created. The attacker (me) breaks the gate, conquers the gatehouse and passes through it but units (defender) placed behind it run to the plaza and stand there, even if there are no defense points (attachments 1 and 2). Also they have a strange behavior while organize (attachments 3 and 4). I've attached the pathfinding.tga with worldobjectPF.tga over it, just in case.
    if you look at config_ai_battle.txt " settlement defense stage control" section I think it shows that retreating to the plaza when all the breachable areas are lost, and there aren't any defense points, is actually the planned behaviour. Can't quite tell from the pics what the strange behavior is, presumably a sort of continuous re-arrangement?

    I'd have a look at Leo's tutorial he says on plaza placement
    The AI need space for reaching the plaza by flanking, layouts with only a direct way to the plaza does not work well, so leave latteral entrances for yourt plaza!
    I can't tell from pics where your plaza is, but I suspect it might work better if you opened up the pathfinding a bit more... let them walk around the inside of the walls and give them a couple of alternative routes into the plaza.


    - add deployment block door
    What is its function? Does it have some relation with the above ?
    No - if you have the large sort of walls that troops stand on, then the surface they stand on you create as a "deployment block" and the "deployment block door", connected to a link/ladder and a ground level door, is what they use to get on and off... you don't look like you should have any of them at all.


    - change firing slot
    How does it work? I tried to mess with it but no results. There are two arrow towers (vanilla town), I select them as mainobject and pick up the correct animation (from vanilla town files), but they don't shoot in game.
    animation doesn't matter at all for those... that's just what it would show when destroyed - once you've given your object a collision and made it an Arrow Tower as mainobject, then you use "change firing slots" to add slots, it won't have any yet... first one you add is the flagbase (where the flag appears when the tower is active), then add firing slots, most towers have at least 4 - the little red arrow shows firing direction and the slot height needs to be the height you want it to look like it's firing from in relation to the centre of the object. Arrow Tower mainobjects should be assigned to the relevant 'perimeter', 'one' in your case...

    Arrow towers normally only fire if they're manned, i.e. if a defending unit is close to it. You can change that in descr_walls.txt, but it'll change for all settlements of that wall level.


    Quote Originally Posted by leo.civil.uefs View Post
    I dont remember asking about an alternative way to deal with this.
    Besides, INSISTING has beeing the really big deal in therms of finding ways to do the things we want in this engine, as you can see in my recent founds about pathfinding. So I asked makanyane because she has, always, at least a suggestion for me about something to try. And just because our first tries with IWTE proved of no effectiveness it does not mean that a possible solution has nothing to do with IWTE, so I think the right place to ask is still here, because the IWTE thread is where people will look for answers with matters RELATED WITH IWTE. Dont worry she already warned m about posting the right stuff here.
    We're not trying to be anti-social by asking for things that aren't definitely related to IWTE functions to be posted elsewhere... it's just getting very hard to find info in here. Your thread about the pathfinding problem is a lot easier to follow, and find info about that problem again than if it was posted in here, and split over several different pages with other tool related stuff in-between... It might be worth trying a thread in the main forum about the vegetation issue, I'm pretty sure there aren't any data/...txt files that do anything to it as all the settings are in the .db. Someone else might know more about how to adjust model/texture sizes to get more things on map without problems... and there are some settings in the .cfg which I don't know what they do like "ground_cover_buffers_per_node = 4"

  11. #11

    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Quote Originally Posted by makanyane View Post
    if you look at config_ai_battle.txt " settlement defense stage control" section I think it shows that retreating to the plaza when all the breachable areas are lost, and there aren't any defense points, is actually the planned behaviour. Can't quite tell from the pics what the strange behavior is, presumably a sort of continuous re-arrangement?

    I'd have a look at Leo's tutorial he says on plaza placement I can't tell from pics where your plaza is, but I suspect it might work better if you opened up the pathfinding a bit more... let them walk around the inside of the walls and give them a couple of alternative routes into the plaza.

    No - if you have the large sort of walls that troops stand on, then the surface they stand on you create as a "deployment block" and the "deployment block door", connected to a link/ladder and a ground level door, is what they use to get on and off... you don't look like you should have any of them at all.
    Alright, changed the pathfinding and now units act properly. Should have read that guide better..

    Quote Originally Posted by makanyane View Post
    animation doesn't matter at all for those... that's just what it would show when destroyed - once you've given your object a collision and made it an Arrow Tower as mainobject, then you use "change firing slots" to add slots, it won't have any yet... first one you add is the flagbase (where the flag appears when the tower is active), then add firing slots, most towers have at least 4 - the little red arrow shows firing direction and the slot height needs to be the height you want it to look like it's firing from in relation to the centre of the object. Arrow Tower mainobjects should be assigned to the relevant 'perimeter', 'one' in your case...

    Arrow towers normally only fire if they're manned, i.e. if a defending unit is close to it. You can change that in descr_walls.txt, but it'll change for all settlements of that wall level.
    Ah that's clearer, it works now. Again thank you very much makanyane!

  12. #12
    leo.civil.uefs's Avatar É nóis que vôa bruxão!
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    any guess about why a settlement is giving me a ctd when loading after I deleted a bridge path?

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    makanyane's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Quote Originally Posted by leo.civil.uefs View Post
    any guess about why a settlement is giving me a ctd when loading after I deleted a bridge path?
    not if it's purely a bridge - if no-one can get in it should just be a delay and auto-win... have you tried with different version of IWTE to see if it's a recently introduced bug?

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    leo.civil.uefs's Avatar É nóis que vôa bruxão!
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Quote Originally Posted by makanyane View Post
    have you tried with different version of IWTE to see if it's a recently introduced bug?

    yes, tried the 2 last versions.

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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Quote Originally Posted by leo.civil.uefs View Post
    yes, tried the 2 last versions.
    send me file - or point to them (I've got your ThirdAge patch) and explain what you deleted... Thanks.

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    leo.civil.uefs's Avatar É nóis que vôa bruxão!
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Quote Originally Posted by makanyane View Post
    send me file - or point to them (I've got your ThirdAge patch) and explain what you deleted... Thanks.
    there is a bridge in esgaroth, delete its path.

  17. #17

    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Hey all,
    I've got a weird problem - my IWTE suddenly stopped working. Just some days ago, it still worked fine as I converted some cas files to ms3d and back. Today, I can't get it work in any way, wheter i try files in the vanilla directory or my modding folders. I've attached a screenshot of the command box, maybe the bug is known. Would appreciate any help. Thanks!

  18. #18
    makanyane's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Quote Originally Posted by Fridericus Secundus View Post
    Hey all,
    I've got a weird problem - my IWTE suddenly stopped working. Just some days ago, it still worked fine as I converted some cas files to ms3d and back. Today, I can't get it work in any way, wheter i try files in the vanilla directory or my modding folders. I've attached a screenshot of the command box, maybe the bug is known. Would appreciate any help. Thanks!
    I don't recognise that one... am assuming you're still trying to use the same version of IWTE as you were before?
    If not please say what you swapped to...

    There are odd occasions where having .py files in the same folder as the IWTE .exe can cause it to try and read those instead of loading the ones it's meant to, do try launching it from a folder with nothing else in it.

    Error is looking a bit like there might be something that is now icompatible with your version of OpenGL - has your operating system updated recently?
    also for our info, what is your operating system, and which IWTE version are you using?

  19. #19
    wilddog's Avatar Paintedwolves run free
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    @ Fridericus Secundus

    Need to know what version of opengl your graphics card runs. Has that changed? New card or driver? Error looks like something on the openGL side hit a problem. If not can you PM me the file you tried in case its just one the tool can't handle and that caused the issue.
    Last edited by wilddog; January 08, 2014 at 02:27 AM. Reason: used phone for original message

  20. #20
    Mr.Jox's Avatar WHY SO SERIOUS?!
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    Default Re: IWTE - World editing(Added tutorial)

    Hey guys, i'm sry if this question already was somewhere(i couldn't find it) but my settlement doesn't appear in game anymore. Last changes i did are assigned anim/collisions to my objecs. After i changed angle settlement is "gone". No terrain, no walls etc only plaza. I've tried to change back my changes, nothing helped.

    FIXED: somehow my files disappeared from my settlement folder. All files except 3: world, anim... and worldcolis..
    Last edited by Mr.Jox; January 08, 2014 at 02:30 AM.

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