IWTE - World editing - (General Discussion)

[Nelduin]

If it is possible to use vegetation models from vanilla, do you think it would be possible to import models from RS 2 environments ?

[wilddog]

If it is possible to use vegetation models from vanilla, do you think it would be possible to import models from RS 2 environments

Sorry don't understand the abbreviated environment you are talking about?

[Arandir Tur-Anion de Bodemloze]

Rome Surrectum 2. It is a mod for RTW, with perhaps the best envirronement ever seen.

Here is a link for the mod : http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...ink-for-RS-2-5

[wilddog]

Hi
Ok, didn't recognise it from the abbreviation.

Basically RTW uses a different model and sprite setup versus MTW2.

If I recall correctly the models are grouped in groups of either 2 or 3. I think the IWTE tool at the moment will open the first of those but not all. That's something that could be easily fixed.
Then the main difference is tied to the sprite setup. I think the MTW2 texture sizes are twice the scale so they need to be reset. Also the sprites used a different version of a 'norm' file although the IWTE tool will now generate that for you.

So all in all some models are probably doable but IWTE would need to have some fixes (mostly to the model extraction) to really allow conversion of RTW models. If a full environment was needed it would need to be a manual process.

I think we posted some bits on this a couple of years back. I addded a link to a tutorial Mak wrote in the post a couple above this. Earlier info i think was posted in this thread but would be from about 2 years ago and I'm not 100% sure on that... Mak may remember.

[makanyane]

It'd be theoretically possible to transfer the RS2 stuff into M2TW, I was going to try it at one stage (mid 2011) but it'd be quite a long process. I gave up at that stage because the lighting in RTW is different and they didn't look very good converted with the conversion method we had at that time & attempting to use adapted RTW sprites. The cas files were included in their release and the 'specials' 'read strat cas' 'write strat cas to ms3d' looks like it works on them... I'd tried a much longer winded route before of regenerating RTW vege files off the individual .cas's and then converting them, but that was partly because we thought we needed rome's sprites)

Wilddog's conversion method (from ms3d to vege_model and the sprite writing thing) is now much better, I think the sprite generating process is pretty amazing! But it'd need their models processed so they're double sided and with vertexes welded together*... model reduced to one group if there are multiple ones and probably texture path corrected...

* I need to add this to that veg tutorial and update a few other things.

there's a better way of getting the smoothing to work now - basically;
create any flat planes as single sided planes in milkshape - duplicate them - reverse the vertex order on the duplicate (so you now have a two sided version) - 'weld all' in milkshape and use the "From ms3d/Create normals" button to create the vegemodel... that sorts some of the lighting problems.

The sprite type is totally different from RTW and needs creating from scratch for each model, the sprite process also requires a convert tga to dds to texture stage, and sometimes needs a bit of manual editing of the tga's. The RS veg wouldn't be direct replacements for M2 trees so you'd need to figure out from scratch what goes where... enter the new names of everything into the veg db and assign them to the climates.

[Nelduin]

Thanks for taking the time to answer me, Mak and wilddog .

[evenmov]

I have made a japaniese city and the japan is in culture eastern_european in my mod
but I can't test it in custom battle how to make the eastern_european show in custom battle?

[makanyane]

What have you got as a .worldpkgdesc for it so far? If your pkg has 'japan' in the faction line try making a .worldpkgdesc for that city that just has 'eastern_european' as the culture and doesn't use the faction line... see if EE then turns up in the menu when you select that size of city in the custom battle menu.

However I suspect that probably won't work due to it's hardcoded default for EE to use northern_european stuff. If so you need to change the name of the 'eastern_european' culture to something else... that's not particularly hard but does need a lot of careful text editing as the culture name appears in lots of files, like EDB, traits, ancillaries etc... refering to the 'how to add culture' tutorials should help.

When you're got your new named culture working you'd need to make a new set of .worldpkgdesc for all the settlement levels and for any techtree buildings that you want to turn up.

[leo.civil.uefs]

this chinese mod seems cool.

[makanyane]

this chinese mod seems cool.

You fixed the textures then

(Email notification)

[leo.civil.uefs]

yes... I was about to replace the previous message with "nevermind" but then I saw the images...

[leo.civil.uefs]

mak... I was on the street today and started looking at some buildings and it came immediately the images of milkshape 3D on my mind, how I would model them and then implement them via IWTE... Im not kidding...

is that normal? Do you even feel that some times?

I think it is time for retirement...

[xHolyCrusader]

mak... I was on the street today and started looking at some buildings and it came immediately the images of milkshape 3D on my mind, how I would model them and then implement them via IWTE...

That would probably explain KK's absence

[evenmov]

thanks for you guys reply me
I had a old question , I made a Japaniese wall which can't be destory
the AI who have cannon will attack it and not use ladder until the cannon been killed
HOW TO MAKE A WALL THE AI WON'T USE CANNON TO ATTACK IT ,BUT USE LADDER AT FIRST

[leo.civil.uefs]

Mak I almost forgot, our previous bug hunting maraton was not over yet.

I was dealing with 4 bugs:

the first one was the assigning main objects, Wild Dog fixed it.
The second one... erm... I dont remember well but I hink something related with structures, Wild Dog also already fixed it.
The third one was the vanilla bug that makes gates to not close when you leave no units inside the third perimeter... this one is vanilla anyway.

Now the the fourth one, wich I want to fix, I just forgot to mention,my last problem with walls was because the mesh file was a southern eu. one but the wall model was actually northern, so that caused a animation bug. Something similar is happening to the gate, my gate animations are bugged, I cant say if it is related with the meshes, as the files are really messed up here.

Could you please make a simple test? Its when the gates closes. here is the file.

thanks for you guys reply me
I had a old question , I made a Japaniese wall which can't be destory
the AI who have cannon will attack it and not use ladder until the cannon been killed
HOW TO MAKE A WALL THE AI WON'T USE CANNON TO ATTACK IT ,BUT USE LADDER AT FIRST

If you name the object as a "main object" "wall", the AI will attack it with projectiles, so if your wall has no damage levels the AI will simply spend all the ammunition from siege engines on the wall and it will not get destroyed, I guess this is something you dont want to happen.

IWTE allows you to add siege docking points (for ladders or rams) if the object is a gate or a wall.

You could try making a wall with the 6 levels of damage but no animation/breach, so the AI would attack and hit it until the damage reaches 100% even if the wall would not sufer anything, but I dont think the AI would then know what to do after this. You might test.

[makanyane]

Leo your link doesn't work...

You could try making a wall with the 6 levels of damage but no animation/breach, so the AI would attack and hit it until the damage reaches 100% even if the wall would not sufer anything

don't make a wall without a breach (no animation is fine) if it doesn't have a breach and the wall is destroyed the game will CTD!

you can make a wall with a breach - but have the breach blocked, using 'edit path values' either when you first make the breach, or by 'change object breach'... trouble is the AI will still use ammunition firing at the wall and then not be able to get through it. Stone Fort C has a 'wall' section that is blocked like that, which uses number "32" instead of "96" as the attribute - that stopped the AI targetting it with artillery... unfortunately it also seemed to stop the AI seeing it as a wall at all so it didn't use ladders on it either!

Earlier versions of IWTE 13_06 ish... let you select breach type 'blocked' which is the 32 ref one, or 'normal'... that seems to have gotten lost in latest version, probably at the point WD fixed the problems with no default objects - have mentioned to him and will be back in next fix.


anyway that 'blocked' breach didn't help a lot - I did try hiding a 'normal' breach wall, slightly inside a 'blocked' breach wall, so the AI would hopefully see the docking points for the normal wall, but not be able to hit it with artillery - got slightly erratic results and gave up...


on walls generally have noticed that the AI will only use ladders on one wall section per deployment block. So if you have a long are of deployment block that has multiple 'wall' sections, the ai will only use ladders on one of the sections, even if it has lots of spare troops and ladders. The vanilla settlements have the deployment blocks split up by the towers, so the ai does attack multiple sections.

[wilddog]

Earlier versions of IWTE 13_06 ish... let you select breach type 'blocked' which is the 32 ref one, or 'normal'... that seems to have gotten lost in latest version, probably at the point WD fixed the problems with no default objects - have mentioned to him and will be back in next fix.

Yep, I think I tidied up something and left the button hidden. I've also corrected so the stone fort C retains the attribute on its wall. Those fixes will be in the next release.

Hoping to get the next release completed this month. Issue is speed of a culling routine I need to get the lighting correct as its a per vertex per triangle check. I'll likely release without the culling routine if needs be to resolve the milkshape shading issue that's present in the 13_12_A version.

[leo.civil.uefs]

Mak, does custom tiles accept effects like waterfall or torches?

Yep, I think I tidied up something and left the button hidden. I've also corrected so the stone fort C retains the attribute on its wall. Those fixes will be in the next release.

Hoping to get the next release completed this month. Issue is speed of a culling routine I need to get the lighting correct as its a per vertex per triangle check. I'll likely release without the culling routine if needs be to resolve the milkshape shading issue that's present in the 13_12_A version.

wilddog please consider making the light stuff not just working but also as friendly as posible to IWTE users, like no need to crack the settlement in different compelxes or such things... I dont know anything about this but as I said, please try to make it as friendly as possible.

[makanyane]

Mak, does custom tiles accept effects like waterfall or torches?

I think so ambients like the 'hamlets' have fires and things, and custom tiles with buildings on normally work similarly to ambients.

Leo the files you sent include the wall animations, but I thought you said the problem was with the gates - did you mean to send me your gate anims?

[leo.civil.uefs]

It will likely be just a button to press or not press. The complex thing is how the game handles effects and complexes. Basically the maximum effects assigned to a complex is 69 so only the first 69 will get used. If there are more assigned to a complex they have no effect. Assignment to a vertex will be based on order of assignment to the complex.
In your case where you opted not to split complexes down its pretty simple in that 69 is your limit. Unfortunately the process is equally long on your settlements (or longer) though as I can't cut down the vertexes quickly by eliminating those from other complexes which aren't in range.

I will wait for the next IWTE so I can really understand what are you talking about.

I think so ambients like the 'hamlets' have fires and things, and custom tiles with buildings on normally work similarly to ambients.

Leo the files you sent include the wall animations, but I thought you said the problem was with the gates - did you mean to send me your gate anims?

Forget about the wall animations. Let it be.

Im talking about the gate ones, wich are vanilla ones...
you will not see any textures on the gate animations as I use a custom one.
But you can notice the animation bug when they are closing.