"First Age: Total War" (Gondolin preview)

**Vhaelor** · May 24, 2011, 07:04 AM

Originally Posted by Ixor_Drakar

Those shields are beautiful, very good detail.

And it is for this (see reaction in the quote) reason why we hold the Hithlum-preview back.

For us a more finished product is more important than a rushed product *cough Dragon Age II cough*

regards,
First Age Team

**paradamed** · May 27, 2011, 06:04 PM

Originally Posted by Aruthiel

And it is for this (see reaction in the quote) reason why we hold the Hithlum-preview back.

For us a more finished product is more important than a rushed product *cough Dragon Age II cough*

regards,
First Age Team

I totally agree and support you.

**fd7s** · May 24, 2011, 07:53 AM

cant wait, nice shields

**Hrobatos** · May 26, 2011, 02:55 AM

Tolkien didnt made clear whats origin of Orcs... Uruk-hai in some way certainly have human blood, stated by Gandalf
now, we dont have details what Saruman did, but as you said yourself there are also Men-Orcs, and Orc-Men, all stated as different groups...

**Commander Ruunu** · May 26, 2011, 03:28 AM

Still following. It's going to be best FATW mod out there.

**christof139** · May 27, 2011, 07:44 PM

Originally Posted by Hrobatos

Tolkien didnt made clear whats origin of Orcs... Uruk-hai in some way certainly have human blood, stated by Gandalf
now, we dont have details what Saruman did, but as you said yourself there are also Men-Orcs, and Orc-Men, all stated as different groups...

There are 12 books about ME written by JRR's son Christopher Tolkien, & C. Tolkien has published previously unpublished notes, stories, etc. of JRR, & JRR Tolkien specifically states that he meant to have orcs created from men & not elves, & it was an error on his part to publish the opposite.

Uruk-hai are first mentioned when the orca & nazgul of Sauron assultl & take the Gondorian city of Minas Ithil, & this predates Saurman's use of Uruk-hai & man-orcs by a good amount of time. However, it may still be a matter of dispute to some people for whatever reason as to who created Uruk-hai first. It is stated that Uruk-hai were first unleashed by Sauron during the capture of Minas Ithil, later named Minas Morgul.

It's also possible that men were used to help create Uruk-hai & this is hinted at but who knows, & it is not a fact that men were used to create Uruk-hai. What is a fact is that Man-orcs are mentioned as being a seperate type of creature than the Uruk-hai in Saurman's army, but this point is still fuzzy, vague & questionable. It was armored Man-orcs with axes that killed King Theoden's son at the 1st or 2nd Battle of the Fords of Isen (I forget but think it was the 1st - I'm not going to check). IMHO I believe there were both Uruk-hai & Man-orcs since Saurman was an experimenter etc.

**Hrobatos** · May 28, 2011, 03:51 AM

The Two Towers are refering only to Saruman's Uruk-hai, and stating that Saruman is probably mixing Man and Orcs
Mordor Uruk-hai are a lot older and their creation is not explained

The Uruk-hai, described as very large black orcs of great strength, first appeared from Mordor about the year 2475 of the Third Age, when they briefly took Ithilien and the city of Osgiliath. These original Uruks were of Sauron's breeding, but Saruman bred his own, making further changes, such as resistance to sunlight and more upright stature. All Uruks were larger and stronger than other breeds of orc and consequently looked down upon and often bullied them.
In The Two Towers, Aragorn observes that the fallen Uruk-hai at Amon Hen were not like any breed of orc he has seen before. Treebeard speculates that Saruman had crossbred Orcs and Men.[2] These orcs, who named themselves "the fighting Uruk-hai", made up a large part of Saruman's army, together with the Dunlendings and other human enemies of Rohan.[3][4] They were faster, stronger, and larger than normal orcs, and could travel during the day without being weakened, although they still did not like it.[2] Saruman fed them with human flesh.[5] Saruman's Uruk-hai fought against the Rohirrim at the Battles of the Fords of Isen, at the first of which King Théoden's son Théodred was killed, and at the Battle of the Hornburg, where the vast majority of the Uruks were defeated and destroyed.[4]

**christof139** · June 01, 2011, 11:05 PM

Originally Posted by Hrobatos

The Two Towers are refering only to Saruman's Uruk-hai, and stating that Saruman is probably mixing Man and Orcs
Mordor Uruk-hai are a lot older and their creation is not explained

Mordor Uruk-hai are explained simply in the fact that they were created by Sauron before Saurman, & there is no mention of men being used to breed them. In the Two Towers & Tolien's originally unpublished work on the 2 Battles of the Isen River etc., it is specifically stated that Man-orcs wielding azes killed Theoden's son, & that Saurman's Uruk-hai bore pikes, thus making a distinction between the 2 types of orcs & most people realize this & agree there very well may have been a difference between man-orcs & uruk-hai. In the Fellowship & later in The Scouring of the Shire in The Retun of the King orc-like men are mentioned (Saurman's thugs). So, Saurman appears t have been experimenting quite a bit.

**Conqistador** · May 28, 2011, 11:16 AM

The gondolin preview is mazing! Ecellent work team!

**Vhaelor** · May 28, 2011, 05:46 PM

Originally Posted by Conqistador

The gondolin preview is mazing! Ecellent work team!

We thank you

Currently I'm re-working the textures of an entire faction by myself, and I'm half-done so I hope the next preview won't be too far off in the future

**reefervonkush** · May 28, 2011, 05:50 PM

is this off the silmarillion?

**Vhaelor** · May 28, 2011, 06:04 PM

Originally Posted by reefervonkush

is this off the silmarillion?

Aye, that it is.

**Hrobatos** · June 02, 2011, 04:26 AM

I have never said that Saron used Men to create his Uruk-hai, as for Orc-men check my post 504 on this page, you will see I alredy mentioned them

and I agree that Orc-Men are showing that Saruman made few types of Orc and Men breeds

**christof139** · June 22, 2011, 11:03 PM

Originally Posted by Hrobatos

I have never said that Saron used Men to create his Uruk-hai, as for Orc-men check my post 504 on this page, you will see I alredy mentioned them

and I agree that Orc-Men are showing that Saruman made few types of Orc and Men breeds

Yes, I've read the books many times, including the originally unpublished ones. Saurman was an experimenter & it seems that he may have created some Orc-men/Man-Orcs of varying types before he successfully created those axe-wielding brutes that slew Theoden's son, Theodred the Second Marshal of the Mark. Those Man-Orcs may of may not have been the same type as the sunlight resistant Uruk-hai that chased the Fellowship. Some or all of Saurman's thugs in the Shire may have been lesser orc-like examples of his experimenting. I think JRR left some room for specualtion about all this purposefully to add some mystery to Saurmane & his experimenting as he does with many similar situations in the books, or he simply just didn't want to go into anymore detail. It's a bit of a mess to some degree & it is left up to the reader to come to their own interpretation.

**Highwayman** · June 03, 2011, 08:41 AM

An excellent looking mod guys cant wait to give it a blast

those models look sweet!

**Highwayman** · June 03, 2011, 08:44 AM

I have the silmarillion around here somewhere i should go back over my Tolkien lore i have forgotten a lot of it

**Nelduin** · June 03, 2011, 11:38 AM

Splendid preview, those units are awesome

**Vhaelor** · June 04, 2011, 05:08 AM

Here's a variation of our Balrog, a small teaser for what we're working on currently along with a heavy spearman for Thangorodrim:

Compliments of PaHer on our team for the artwork