Townhall - Curial Commentary and Chat

[PikeStance]

Oh sweet mercy!

[Shankbot de Bodemloze]

Interestingly I cannot find anywhere in the Constitution that now states the Curator is the Moderator of the Curia, the only references to their powers are for specific processes (organising elections, Citizenship applications etc.) or that 'The Curator is responsible for ensuring the Curia's day-to-day tasks are accomplished'.

[PikeStance]

I honestly could have sworn it was mentioned at some point in time. I have to have a look at the history as well. There are also vague references to a "Curatorial Warning" but there is no mentioned of what that is exactly.
It would be nice if we would consider a more prescribed duty of responsibilities of the Curator as well as other possible officers that can "officially" offload the some responsibilities.

[General Brewster]

Interestingly I cannot find anywhere in the Constitution that now states the Curator is the Moderator of the Curia, the only references to their powers are for specific processes (organising elections, Citizenship applications etc.) or that 'The Curator is responsible for ensuring the Curia's day-to-day tasks are accomplished'.

It's not in there indeed.

This is in the FAQ however: The Curator which is appointed by voting by citizens is the overseer of the entire curia and moderates the entire CVRIA forum. An in-depth guide to the Curia may be found here.

I honestly could have sworn it was mentioned at some point in time. I have to have a look at the history as well. There are also vague references to a "Curatorial Warning" but there is no mentioned of what that is exactly.
It would be nice if we would consider a more prescribed duty of responsibilities of the Curator as well as other possible officers that can "officially" offload the some responsibilities.

Perhaps in one of the older parts that have been removed.

[Halie Satanus]

I believe it was intentionally left ambiguous.

The curators 'moderation' powers (in this context) are a gentleman's agreement between the office and the curia, so not to give the curator any delusions of power.

In practice, the curator may moderate a thread, but if he gets it wrong, is considered to be overstepping, or biased, the citizens can call him out.

Didn't that happen to you Pike?

[Frunk]

Generally, if I ever saw anything which required moderating in the Curia, I sent a PM asking the Citizen to alter their post, to encourage self-policing and minimise any "official" action (including simple post edits). Thus, my opinion was that as Curator, I was de facto moderator of the Curia, but not de jure (as stated there is no constitutional basis for such).

For the record, I do not contest GB's action whatsoever.

[PikeStance]

I believe it was intentionally left ambiguous.

The curators 'moderation' powers (in this context) are a gentleman's agreement between the office and the curia, so not to give the curator any delusions of power.

In practice, the curator may moderate a thread, but if he gets it wrong, is considered to be overstepping, or biased, the citizens can call him out.

Didn't that happen to you Pike?

This is the sort of nonsense I am talking about. Why am I being called out? I made two posts, one was facetious pointing out that I was being beaten like Rocky and pleading for mercy. The context is obvious; I have no problem with GB's action. The second post you actually corroborated. This has nothing to do with me.

[Halie Satanus]

This is the sort of nonsense I am talking about. Why am I being called out? I made two posts, one was facetious pointing out that I was being beaten like Rocky and pleading for mercy.

Yeh, I thought that was quite witty of you.

The question was alluding to your time as curator, though my memory could be wrong. Weren't called out for over zealous moderating of the curia?, hence the context .... Am I recalling using coloured and bolded type wrongly, was that not you?.

[PikeStance]

I honestly have no idea what you are referring to. The only issue I recall with bold and color is when I was a Censor.
I still do not see how that is relevant to Shanks post regarding the prescribed or lack of prescribed powers of the Curator. I also did not take any issue with GB's action in my proposal thread.

[Halie Satanus]

I honestly have no idea what you are referring to. The only issue I recall with bold and color is when I was a Censor.

Oh that's right, it was when you were overstepping your position as censor by continuously posting in the tribunal(?) with bold and coloured text... I remember now. Thanks for the memory jog..

I still do not see how that is relevant to Shanks post regarding the prescribed or lack of prescribed powers of the Curator.

Well the context is clearly the powers of moderation the curator has in the curia, I was explaining that it's not a codified power, I also explained why it's not codified, and then asked if that had happened to you. On a forum so ingrained with the documents of history it's not a curiosity for our own history to be called upon. I had it wrong, as mentioned above, it was the overstepping as censor not curator, though the example is of a similar nature.

I also did not take any issue with GB's action in my proposal thread.

I didn't say you did.

[PikeStance]

Oh that's right, it was when you were overstepping your position as censor by continuously posting in the tribunal(?) with bold and coloured text... I remember now. Thanks for the memory jog..

Well the context is clearly the powers of moderation the curator has in the curia, I was explaining that it's not a codified power, I also explained why it's not codified, and then asked if that had happened to you. On a forum so ingrained with the documents of history it's not a curiosity for our own history to be called upon. I had it wrong, as mentioned above, it was the overstepping as censor not curator, though the example is of a similar nature.

I didn't say you did.

You really should re-read this. This is you just being obnoxious towards me for the sake of being obnoxious towards me.

Awarded for demonstrating purity of mind and spirit on TWC, in the pursuit of humour and good times for all members.

Does the Loinscloth include haranguing members as well?

[Lifthrasir]

Does the Loinscloth include haranguing members as well?

I see nothing ad personam in Halie's post. But in yours, is this not called argumentum ad hominem?

[PikeStance]

Sorry, but I feel he is. This type of behavior needs to stop. I am not taking it from anyone anymore.
I feel I am being harangued and that is it.

[Halie Satanus]

Sorry, but I feel he is. This type of behavior needs to stop. I am not taking it from anyone anymore.
I feel I am being harangued and that is it.

You previously abused your position, this is not a false accusation, it happened. When mentioned as an example of someone abusing their position you claim not to know what I'm talking about, though provide a recollection of the affair in the same sentence.

I honestly have no idea what you are referring to. The only issue I recall with bold and color is when I was a Censor.

You confound this with a personal attack and an accusation of haranguing. I could say if you hadn't abused your position in the first place you wouldn't be open to being used as an example. The irony of this while admonishing Mr_Nygren in his citizen application thread is astounding. The fact you did so and bolded 'OPPOSITION' is almost beyond belief.

I am reaffirming my OPPOSITION to this application.

So before you revert back to the 'this was years ago' defence. I will point out it seems you never learn. I will also thank you for providing a perfect example of why being reminded of your past is vindicated.

[PikeStance]

You previously abused your position, this is not a false accusation, it happened. When mentioned as an example of someone abusing their position you claim not to know what I'm talking about, though provide a recollection of the affair in the same sentence.

You confound this with a personal attack and an accusation of haranguing. I could say if you hadn't abused your position in the first place you wouldn't be open to being used as an example. The irony of this while admonishing Mr_Nygren in his citizen application thread is astounding. The fact you did so and bolded 'OPPOSITION' is almost beyond belief.

So before you revert back to the 'this was years ago' defence. I will point out it seems you never learn. I will also thank you for providing a perfect example of why being reminded of your past is vindicated.

Thank you for proving my point; you continue to harangue me for no apparent reason. The discussion is about Curators powers being prescribed in the Constitution or not.
BTW, I more often than not bold and/ or all cap my vote, but I am glad you chose to harangue me for yet something else.

[Iskar]

This has to be one of the most surreal applications ever.
Conspiracies
Intrigue
Bullying

Probably not more surreal than when a user well-known for his quasi-fascist views was proposed for citizenship and rejected with a record number of No-votes. Let's not overdramatise some personal feuds spilling out into an application discussion.

[Parafix]

Probably not more surreal than when a user well-known for his quasi-fascist views was proposed for citizenship and rejected with a record number of No-votes. Let's not overdramatise some personal feuds spilling out into an application discussion.

3 Separate mod developer team leaders reveal issues with an individual over permissions and general attitude to other mod creators, and because its something negative we run to "personal feuds". I worry for you Iskar if you ever do get into a genuine "feud", i suggest running the opposite direction the best course of action.

While on it, any time something negative arises about individuals, not just in the Curia, but TWC in general, people gotta stop running to the use of "feud", it's the most patronizing, childish nonsense to make individuals think they are on some higher ground. Because sometimes we're restricted by moderation, does not make our points mute, we'll just put them forward very carefully, with a gun at our heads, god forbid any chances of being able to make any valid points on this site to anyone. If you don't know the situation, and either side is heavily restricted in what they can and cannot say, rather jump to it must be just personality issues between the two, if you're not sure, especially on matters of the Curia, the abstain vote is their for a reason.

[Iskar]

3 Separate mod developer team leaders reveal issues with an individual over permissions and general attitude to other mod creators, and because its something negative we run to "personal feuds". I worry for you Iskar if you ever do get into a genuine "feud", i suggest running the opposite direction the best course of action.

While on it, any time something negative arises about individuals, not just in the Curia, but TWC in general, people gotta stop running to the use of "feud", it's the most patronizing, childish nonsense to make individuals think they are on some higher ground. Because sometimes we're restricted by moderation, does not make our points mute, we'll just put them forward very carefully, with a gun at our heads, god forbid any chances of being able to make any valid points on this site to anyone. If you don't know the situation, and either side is heavily restricted in what they can and cannot say, rather jump to it must be just personality issues between the two, if you're not sure, especially on matters of the Curia, the abstain vote is their for a reason.

Three separate mod developer team leaders revealed issues that should have been kept private and handled (or have actually already been handled) by Hex, as is customary for this kind of conflict. If people instead choose to effectively misuse an application to make the Curia the judge of a matter it cannot wholly assess (while holding the Curia ransom by statements of "personal integrity", so any doubts can only be had at the cost of insulting the accusers), then I think it quite appropriate to call that out as personal feuds tarnishing a Curial matter.

[PikeStance]

Probably not more surreal than when a user well-known for his quasi-fascist views was proposed for citizenship and rejected with a record number of No-votes. Let's not overdramatise some personal feuds spilling out into an application discussion.

Last time I checked a members political views is not a part of the requirements for citizenship. It is his contribution. I would say, that particular applicant has a much better attitude towards those that differ on his own opinion that the current applicant. Apparently, it is easier to overlook attitude when your contribution is mod as opposed to AARs. One positive in this is at least someone else admitted to voting based on political ideological differences than the excused given.

Plus, I didn't overdramatize anything. I am reacting to it just as you are. Drama is drama.

[Parafix]

Three separate mod developer team leaders revealed issues that should have been kept private and handled (or have actually already been handled) by Hex, as is customary for this kind of conflict. If people instead choose to effectively misuse an application to make the Curia the judge of a matter it cannot wholly assess (while holding the Curia ransom by statements of "personal integrity", so any doubts can only be had at the cost of insulting the accusers), then I think it quite appropriate to call that out as personal feuds tarnishing a Curial matter.

A member of TWC is put forward for Citizenship, his and patrons statements are focused fully on modding work, three people who have experience with his modding inform the curia of that said experience. If it were a positive response, would you be reacting the same without evidence provided? I think not. We've given as much evidence as we can give, including screenshots of the individuals views on permission rights something the mod community consider a rather important matter.

If TWC gave out positions, or awards, simply down to positive credit, ignoring negative, and ignoring the personalities of individuals, i'd be in line for hell of a lot more. However, this is not a magical community where we hold hands and dance around a rainbow, to think any different and try to act on others as if it is, is rather silly.

If i wanted to, i could insult freely for hours, i'm merely pointing out the work and attitude iv'e experienced.

I'll leave it there, the Curia has the patrons statements and those who support, and those who don't. I'm sure they can decide for themselves.

(Is this now a feud?)