Royal Navy accused of firing at the Spanish flag off Gibraltar

[Ebusitanus]

I mean...lol

http://www.typicallyspanish.com/news...le_24003.shtml

By h.b. - Nov 20, 2009 - 7:08 AM

El Mundo reports on an incident last Tuesday

El Mundo reports that tensions between Gibraltar and Spain are rising after the Guardia Civil came across a British Navy patrol which, the paper says, was carrying out firing practice last Tuesday on a buoy on which the Spanish flag was printed.

El Mundo reports that the British cleared away their exercise when they noted the presence of the Guardia Civil, but the paper highlights that they had been firing at the Spanish flag.

The paper says that incidents between the Guardia Civil and the British Navy patrols around The Rock are ever more common.

Spain believes such incidents only benefit the smugglers in the area and the Spanish Government indicated over the summer that they want to reach a new agreement with Britain on the joint control of the waters around Gibraltar.

[Tiberios]

So, the spanish continue to whine about Gibraltar. Nothing new.

[Erik]

So, the spanish continue to whine about Gibraltar. Nothing new.

It's the Brits who seem obsessed with it.

The Spanish just don't want their property damaged and ask the Brits to focus on drug smugglers instead.

[Azog 150]

It's the Brits who seem obsessed with it.

The Spanish just don't want their property damaged and ask the Brits to focus on drug smugglers instead.

Not really. It hasn't been mentioned at all in the British media (Not even the Tabloids) but apparently Spain's second biggest paper (apprently becuase it sells lots it makes it a trustworthy paper) believes it deserves a mention and the Spanish government have been demanding apologies.

[Erik]

Not really. It hasn't been mentioned at all in the British media

I meant the Royal Navy sailors seem obsessed with it.

They are the ones who decided evil Spanish buoys must be destroyed in name of the Queen.

[M D]

I meant the Royal Navy sailors seem obsessed with it.

They are the ones who decided evil Spanish buoys must be destroyed in name of the Queen.

|It was obviously a regular training exercise, due to water territorial limits, the buoy probably used to be Spanish and was consequently British. So the British shot a printed flag? Who cares about a flag which no one had removed since the water territorial changes.

On another point, just because it is the second biggets seller does not make it reliable! The sun sells the most here and people buy just to look at tits... I believe El Mundo may be the same..

[Ebusitanus]

LOL...Have you even read what this article is about before saying something that ignorant?

[Tiberios]

LOL...Have you even read what this article is about before saying something that ignorant?

Yeah. some spanish newspaper claims brits shot at a spanish falg painted on a buoy.

[Ebusitanus]

Yeah. some spanish newspaper claims brits shot at a spanish falg painted on a buoy.

Very good...

[Tiberios]

Very good...

and, then the Spanish continue to reach a new treaty about joint control of the waters around Gibraltar. In my mind a sign that they still can't accept that they gave this area up a long time ago.

[Ebusitanus]

Sigh....

The thread is actually about British soldiers getting caught red-handed by the Spanish shooting up a national flag for practice and thats all you manage to utter? LOL

In regards to sea control...again...Spain is just asking to have the controls increased since..oh surprise..the rock works as a smugling cave by organitzed bands that take advantage of the lax british controls to smugle drugs to nearby Spanish beaches. This drug then makes its way to the rest of the EU. Of course you would not care about that since its coolers to dwell on the ETW mentality of the importance of that stupid rock.

[Tiberios]

Sigh....

The thread is actually about British soldiers getting caught red-handed by the Spanish shooting up a national flag for practice and thats all you manage to utter? LOL

Yeah.

In regards to sea control...again...Spain is just asking to have the controls increased since..oh surprise..the rock works as a smugling cave by organitzed bands that take advantage of the lax british controls to smugle drugs to nearby Spanish beaches. This drug then makes its way to the rest of the EU. Of course you would not care about that since its coolers to dwell on the ETW mentality of the importance of that stupid rock.

Of course Britain should do something about it.

[Yuiis]

"El Mundo"...that just says it all. There's no other ultranationalist newspaper that could give importance to such a stupid event. I've heard nothing on the radio or on "La Vanguardia".

[Azog 150]

Sigh....

The thread is actually about British soldiers getting caught red-handed by the Spanish shooting up a national flag for practice and thats all you manage to utter? LOL

In regards to sea control...again...Spain is just asking to have the controls increased since..oh surprise..the rock works as a smugling cave by organitzed bands that take advantage of the lax british controls to smugle drugs to nearby Spanish beaches. This drug then makes its way to the rest of the EU. Of course you would not care about that since its coolers to dwell on the ETW mentality of the importance of that stupid rock.

Aside from no reliable Spanish papers having reported this, I don't think anyone in Britain really gives a flying about what Spain thinks of Gibraltar. In fact when I read the Royal Navy were shooting at a Spanish flag I laughed.

As for smugglers, thats our problem and we will deal with it in our own way. Its again a case of not giving a what Spain thinks as Gibraltar has nothing to do with them and hasn't done for the last 300 years. The problem of drugs going into Europe effects us just as much as Spain and if we consider it a big problem we will deal with it. If they think they are going to get a treaty for joint control of Gibraltars waters they are very wrong.

[Carach]

Sigh....

The thread is actually about British soldiers getting caught red-handed by the Spanish shooting up a national flag for practice and thats all you manage to utter? LOL

caught red handed because a sensationalist paper in spain claims it to be so? where are the videos, pictures? why didnt ur boys go pick them up and arrest them for offending the proud nation of Spain

just how big was this flag? is it merely a tiny flag on the thing to represent where the buoy was made or whatever? Its a ing buoy at the end of the day does it matter at all? Buoys are used all the time for target practise (i guess we could always fire upon spanish forts ala Napoleonic war era right!?)

trying to big up the patrols too is lols when its known for a fact that both the RN and the 'guarda civil' dont have the assets to step up 'patrols' in the first place.

How a firing excercise can benefit smugglers when these patrols are there in the first place largely due to spain's inability to stop illegal immigrants getting across the straights (and all that entails) has left me perplexed.

To come to a conclusion: this is a completely pointless thread. But i enjoy ur spanish tears over something u handed over hundreds of years ago - where the population have absolutely no wish to become spaniards.

to give people an idea of what these 'patrols' are;

the ships used would either be http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archer_class_patrol_vessel

or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/River_class_patrol_vessel

god forbid one of these titans of the naval world fire a machine gun (or a worst a 20mm cannon) at a buoy in the straits...


amazes me how ing petty some of the continentals remain to this very day. Spain's already been partly responsible for this ongoing falklands debacle, now we have to deal with them crying over a buoy with a spanish flag on it being destroyed during shooting excercises...

Do our ambassadors have 'guidance councillor to Spain' on their job description? We should ignore the calls for 'talks' on such a pathetic issue.

And apparently receiving them too.

and we'll take ur word for that, despite there being absolutely no evidence, outside of a couple of spanish sensationalist papers, of this event even taking place.

Are you even aware on how this started? Gibraltar had a set treaty defined amount of soberanity over the water surrounding the rock. Gibraltar thought it was not enough given the modern times and the traffic that goes to that fiscal paradise and choose to increase it on it own. Spain did object and still does...This is what brought the troubles..not a Spanish action.
This is very much the same as with the crap about their airport. Gibraltar had not enough land to build it and did so taking Spanish land. Spain politely asked to at least get to share the installation to the benefit of everyone in that touristic area. Gibraltar said no.

Spain has of course been completely blameless in the breakdown of relations...its not like franco was a , that successive governments after him - to present day funnily enough - have whined and made petty little actions to irritate the folks of gibralter and the British government......nooooooo spain are entirely innocent

[Mr. Scott]

Sigh....

The thread is actually about British soldiers getting caught red-handed by the Spanish shooting up a national flag for practice and thats all you manage to utter? LOL

In regards to sea control...again...Spain is just asking to have the controls increased since..oh surprise..the rock works as a smugling cave by organitzed bands that take advantage of the lax british controls to smugle drugs to nearby Spanish beaches. This drug then makes its way to the rest of the EU. Of course you would not care about that since its coolers to dwell on the ETW mentality of the importance of that stupid rock.

Yeah, and dozens of countries burn american flags as celebration, but I don't hear american newspapers getting all over those nations.

[Ebusitanus]

Aside from no reliable Spanish papers having reported this

LOL...Only the second most sold newpaper in Spain.

http://www.elmundo.es/elmundo/2009/1...258719817.html

Spain has now called the British Embassador to talk about this incident. Apparently the Spanish goverment is not a reliable source either. LOL
Paxman has actually even already apologized.

As for smugglers, thats our problem and we will deal with it in our own way.

False...We both belong to the European Union still...Criminals using the lax gibraltar police as a way to use that rock to smuggle stuff into Spain is very much a Spanish problem too. It has been actually the self proclaimed rules by Gibraltar that have brought forward these problems. Gibraltar, on its own acord chose to increase the sea area they claim have a right upon. All this against the specific points of the Treaty that binds both sides. This is why they keep having problems with the Spanish Coast guard.

@Luis: El Mundo is as much a "ultranationalist newspaper" as the Vanguardia or the Pais are Bolshevik rags. That is, not at all. Of course extreme leftists and independentist rabble like to claim this for their own sake. You can not have the whole media giving you oral service in democracy, you know? I hear in Cuba it is more to your taste.

[Phier]

LOL...Only the second most sold newpaper in Spain.

I recall some Brit member saying the Daily Mail was the most sold paper in the UK.

Just saying.

Edit: Looked it up, its the second biggest selling paper. Just saying...

[Yuiis]

@Luis: El Mundo is as much a "ultranationalist newspaper" as the Vanguardia or the Pais are Bolshevik rags. That is, not at all. Of course extreme leftists and independentist rabble like to claim this for their own sake. You can not have the whole media giving you oral service in democracy, you know? I hear in Cuba it is more to your taste.

What are you talking about? El Mundo is perfectly comparable to what The Sun in the UK would be. An ultranationalist sensationalist pamflet, everyone knows it, even the ones who read it know it, and they read it because they like reading things like these. The fact that its the second most sold newspaper in the spanish state just describes how the spanish population is . Who else could care about a stupidity like this, and make such a fuss about it than "El Mundo"? I never claimed it was a false information, I claimed the stupidity of puting it as a headline in a widely sold "newspaper".


*On a side note, you are quite a romantic person if you think that newspapers are totally or even generally objective. Just like what "El Mundo" is to the spanish nationalist right, El Pais is heavily biased twards the left, L'Avui is heavily biased twards catalan nationalism and La Vanguardia is like a lump of all of these put together and mixed up (Which sometimes gives as a result the highest degree of objectiveness achieved). It's sad but its just the way it is.

[Markas]

I'm shocked and appalled. Bullets cost money, damnit!

They were probably bored and decided to shoot a bouy that happened to have the Spanish flag printed on it. They didn't shoot a flag on a flagpole or anything.