Javelins...whats the point? (pun intended)

[Fireright]

Anyone else disappointed by the meagre harvest of death reaped by javelin units?

The javelin guys go forward..lob their stuff at the enemy and only a handful bite the dust. 100 guys lobbing nasty pointy sticks should easily kill far more than a dozen or so.

Why so feeble a kill rate?

[MortenJessen]

Hi there.
Javelin troops are skirmishers, meant to deal with other factions skirmishers. Since they are lightly armoured and armed, skirmishers are best when fighting other skirmishers. And javelins are light weapons meant to be trown at great distance for scattering an enemy formation, not make it break, meaning that they will perform better on slow enemies like pikemen and phalanx formations, and not so well on fast, shielded enemies like legionares.
Y.S.
M. Jessen

[Genius of the Restoration]

Mmm. They're often better for flanking duties due to the shield bonus that makes all but the armour-piercing pila ineffective. The barbarian Skirmisher Warband unit is really good if you use them well. Absolute beasts for their price.

[Imperator Romani]

I know that there are uses for them, as the above have said, but I rather sub in some infantry for the same price. Velites for example cost the same as Hastasti, I don't know if the prices are indentical for other factions or not, though I do think peltasts cost the same.

[Dodge]

Put them behind an engaged phalanx and you'll see how good they are.

[King_Darius]

Put them behind an engaged phalanx and you'll see how good they are.

or....

move them BEHIND the enemy engaged phalanx and see how good they are THEN!

[Dave Strider]

or....

move them BEHIND the enemy engaged phalanx and see how good they are THEN!

...That's what he said.

[Fireright]

I remain disappointed with the feeble kill rate of javelin guys. I could see someone surviving an arrow, but a javelin, I expect a one-shot kill.

Irl too I'd sooner take my chances with an arrow than being skewered by a 6ft long javelin!!.

Arrows may or may not bounce off heavily armoured troops, but I expect a nasty pointy javelin to do the business.

Typical seige situation with the dopey enemy hanging around the wooden gates or lined up in a street.

AI lambs waiting for the slaughter ...100 javelin guys throw their stuff at them and only a handful eat dirt. I would expect at least 50% to meet their maker.

Are javelin guys garbage at hitting their target or are they hurling paper planes at the enemy?

Shoddy stuff.

[blackwatersix]

They're useless from the front, put them behind the enemy and see what havoc they bring.

[{GrailKnight}]

Try and get them to attack your enemies infantry in the rear.

[Deux]

Editing Projectile Damage

It's not hard to make them more potent as you see fit Fireright, I would try to do as others have suggested first before you make them uber-killers.

[Parzival2211]

I guess the higher the difficulty level the better (skirmishers and other missile troops are), as the h/vh bonus is counted as def skill, not armour, which doesn't make a difference when a javelin is hurled at them. Right?

[Fireright]

Thanks for the projectile link Deux I shall put my thinking cap on and see whats what.

[Deux]

I guess the higher the difficulty level the better (skirmishers and other missile troops are), as the h/vh bonus is counted as def skill, not armour, which doesn't make a difference when a javelin is hurled at them. Right?

I never thought of it like that Parzival. That's a great shout.

No problem Fireright.

[Grimmy]

Javalineers would be more useful if they did what they did irl, iirc.

Javalins were a people killer, but they were also, possibly primarily, meant as shield killers. Javs penetrating shields with a warhead that was difficult to extract often rendered the shield useless so the shield owner would simply discard that shield.

So, maybe Javs should have a bit of an armor reducing effect upon their target unit?

[Maca]

Don't javs have an AP effect already? I think they do, that's why they are so good against Elephants.

[Fireright]

Javalineers would be more useful if they did what they did irl, iirc.

Javalins were a people killer, but they were also, possibly primarily, meant as shield killers. Javs penetrating shields with a warhead that was difficult to extract often rendered the shield useless so the shield owner would simply discard that shield.

So, maybe Javs should have a bit of an armor reducing effect upon their target unit?

I'm thinking along similar lines. The first jav group should reduce the enemy armour as well as kill quite a few anyway, and therefore the second jav group should get one-shot kills and skewer far more than they currently do.

6ft long javelins should do the business everytime and not just annoy the enemy

[Parzival2211]

Normal javelins are not AP, only the pilas (of the legionaries). Skirmishers do get a bonus against elephants and chariots, but that is not related to an AP effect.

[cursedronin]

Javelins are great.

Just run em around enemy positions so they can shower their flanks/backs with javs.
Also great when put on city walls.

They seem to be even more powerful in the roma surrectum mod.
One velite group is 120 guys big and the ydo tons of damage when used correctly.

[Ciisar]

Anyone else disappointed by the meagre harvest of death reaped by javelin units?

The javelin guys go forward..lob their stuff at the enemy and only a handful bite the dust. 100 guys lobbing nasty pointy sticks should easily kill far more than a dozen or so.

Why so feeble a kill rate?

Put Javelin guys behind the infantry.