Page 1 of 4 1234 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 86

Thread: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    Darsh's Avatar Maréchal de l'Empire
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    3,888

    Default Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    World leaders joined thousands of people from around the globe on Monday to celebrate the 20th anniversary of the fall of the Berlin Wall, that sombre barrier that for almost three decades symbolised the divide between the competing ideologies of East and West.

    Key political figures that were instrumental in bringing down the wall and hastening the demise of Soviet communism in Eastern Europe gathered under the capital’s grey skies and at times pouring rain. The occasion was marked with a series of events, including the symbolic crossing of Bösebrücke bridge, once a checkpoint, by German Chancellor Angela Merkel, former Polish president Lech Walesa and former Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev, who was the Kremlin’s top man when the Wall came down.

    Later in the day, a thousand oversized dominoes emblazoned with bright colours along 1.5 kilometres (0.9 miles) of the Wall's original path were toppled to symbolise the collapse of the Communist regime.


    BERLIN WALL
    FRANCE 24's special coverage of the anniversary in Berlin


    Relatively peaceful revolutions against the Soviet regime took place in one Eastern bloc nation after another, with the success of each subsequent nation inspiring its neighbours to similarly shake off the shackles of Communism.

    It all began in Poland, with the 1980 shipyard strikes led by Solidarity trade union leader Walesa, who later served as Poland’s first post-Communist president. A series of small successes -- including the Aug. 19, 1989, Pan-European picnic in the Hungarian town of Sopron, during which some 600 Easterners escaped -- followed elsewhere across the bloc, culminating in the Nov. 9, 1989, joyful dismantling of what was once the starkest symbol of the Iron Curtain.

    “One event after another throughout the ’80s led up to the fall of the Wall in 1989,” says FRANCE 24’s Damien McGuinness, reporting from Berlin.

    Fittingly, Walesa toppled the first domino, spurring loud cheers from the crowds gathered along the symbolic memorial.

    Nostalgia, ostalgia

    The end of the Wall did not bring an end to all of the Eastern bloc’s troubles. Many were to face decades of economic hardship as their nations struggled to catch up with the more affluent West.

    And even today's recollections of a world-defining moment have not entirely concealed the divisions that still exist between East and West, nor a certain longing some feel for the former East Germany that has come to be known among Germans as “ostalgia”.

    “There are still many problems to overcome,” McGuinness says. “There are still economic problems which make the lives of many former East Germans difficult, mainly high unemployment.”

    “There is a certain amount of nostalgia,” he says, although he notes that the once-divided capital in particular has come a long way to become the “vibrant, young dynamic” city it is today.

    McGuiness says it must be remembered that, quite literally, “a state vanished overnight”.

    German Chancellor Angela Merkel - who grew up in Communist East Germany - welcomed British Prime Minister Gordon Brown, French President Nicolas Sarkozy, Russian President Dmitry Medvedev and US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton for the day's festivities, including a gala reception at the Bellevue Palace.

    Angela Merkel gave the final of speech of the evening from the foot of the historic Brandenburg Gate. “Let us continue to answer the call of freedom together,” Merkel said. “We are in a position to overcome the barriers of our time, just as we did 20 years ago in 1989 in this city.”
    Merkel also said over the weekend that the Nov. 9, 1989, fall of the Wall was “the happiest day in recent Germany history”.
    http://www.france24.com/en/20091109-...wall?autoplay=

    It was more than a great day for the German unification, It was the European's day of the liberty.

    "wir sind Brüder, wir sind Berliner"

    Légion étrangčre : « Honneur et Fidélité »

  2. #2

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    How pathetic that obama couldn't manage to attend this remarkable acheivement american resolve and world leadership. Peace through strength.

  3. #3
    ShockBlast's Avatar Protector Domesticus
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    European Union , Romania , Constanta
    Posts
    4,496

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by The Devil's Sergeant View Post
    How pathetic that obama couldn't manage to attend this remarkable achievement of German and Soviet resolve and world leadership. Peace through good relations.
    There,now it is correct.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by The Devil's Sergeant View Post
    How pathetic that obama couldn't manage to attend this remarkable acheivement american resolve and world leadership. Peace through strength.
    What? This was a moment created by Germans, for Germans.

    Interesting article on the fall by Slate:
    http://www.slate.com/id/2234101/
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Too often, we see history as inevitable. What was had to be, the culmination of seemingly tectonic forces. We tend to forget that history is also defined by the logic of human messiness. Happenstance, chance, even accident always loom large in grand events. Consider the iconic image that will play and replay on our TV screens over the coming weeks: Berliners dancing atop the fallen wall, marking the end of the Cold War 20 years ago. I was there, that night to remember: Nov. 9, 1989.

    The scene was Checkpoint Charlie, the famous border crossing in the heart of divided Berlin. A heaving crowd of East Germans faced a thin line of Volkspolitzei, nervously fingering their weapons. The standoff had just entered its fourth hour. "Open up! Open up!" the people cried out. Past the police and their guard dogs, past the watchtower and barbed wire of the infamous death strip, on the other side of the grim-gray Berlin Wall, came the answering call from an equally boisterous mob of West Germans: "Come over! Come over!"
    Blazing TV lights suddenly flipped on from the West, silhouetting the wall and the guards, intensifying the eerie scene. Inside his lighted, glassed-in command post, the captain of the East German border guard, a beefy guy with a square jaw and the dark bristly air of a Doberman, stood dialing and redialing his telephone. For hours he vainly sought instructions. Certainly he was confused. Most likely he was frightened. The crowds before him had broiled out of nowhere, grown so fast, unlike anything he had ever seen, and now they pushed so close that their breath, frosting in the night, mingled with that of his increasingly anxious men.

    Similarly panicky calls flew from checkpoints up and down the wall. What was happening? What should be done? But there were no answers. No instructions came back from the Interior Ministry. Top officials had gone to the opera or to the bowers of their mistresses. As Communist East Germany entered the final, existential crisis, its leadership was AWOL.
    In his glass booth, the captain of the border guard once again put down his phone. He stood rock-still. Perhaps he had just been informed that the Bornholmerstrasse crossing to the north had moments earlier opened its barriers, besieged by some 20,000 people. Perhaps he came to his own decision. Maybe he was simply fed up. Whatever the case, at 11:17 p.m. precisely, he shrugged his shoulders, as if to say, "Why not?"

    "Alles auf!" he ordered. "Open up," and the gates swung wide. With a great roar the crowds surged forward. Among the first to cross to freedom was a woman I'd watched for hours, bobbing up and down to keep warm in a baby-blue nightgown and hair curlers. There she was one moment. The next, history literally swept her up. Carried aloft by the human tide, she turned her head and shouted to a friend, "I'll be back in 10 minutes. I just want to see if it's real!"

    Earlier that evening, just before 7 p.m., another man had shrugged. Gunter Schabowski, the portly spokesman for the ruling Politburo, installed just weeks earlier, stopped by the offices of the Communist Party boss, Egon Krenz, en route to his daily press briefing. "Anything to announce?" he asked casually. Krenz shuffled through the papers on his desk, then passed Schabowski a two-page memo. "Take this," he said with a grin. "It will do us a power of good." Schabowski scanned the memo while being driven from party headquarters. It was a short press release having to do with passports. From now on, every East German would have the right to have one—and to travel freely.

    For a nation locked so long behind the Iron Curtain, this was tremendous news. At the press conference, there was a sudden hush as Schabowski read from the memo, then a hubbub of shouting reporters. From the back of the room, as the cameras rolled, broadcasting live to the nation, the fatal question rang out: "When does it take effect?"

    Schabowski paused, looked up. "What?" he said, confused. The chorus of questions rang out again, seeking clarification. Schabowski scratched his head, mumbled to aides on either side, perched his glasses on the end of his nose, and scanned his notes, then once again he looked up … and shrugged. "Ab Sofort," he read aloud from what he saw written on the press release. Immediately. Without delay.

    At this, the room—and the world—erupted. Schabowski, we now know, didn't appreciate the full significance of his announcement. On vacation when the decision was made, he was not aware that the plans were to take effect the next day, Nov. 10, subject to all sorts of fine print. Neither were East Germans. They knew only what they had heard on radio and television. They thought they were free to go. Sofort. Right now. By the hundreds of thousands they descended on the crossings to West Berlin. Overwhelmed, receiving no instructions, East German police acted on their own. Like Schabowski, like the border guard at Checkpoint Charlie, they shrugged.

    And so the wall came down.
    Last edited by motiv-8; November 10, 2009 at 02:16 PM.
    قرطاج يجب ان تدمر

  5. #5
    Ahlerich's Avatar Praeses
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Germany, Freiburg
    Posts
    8,270

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    hehe, nobody really cares here. on the other hand there is not much to discuss about this.
    i allways liked gorby as a child already and i think it is mostly his archievement that germany was able to come together again.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Yes. Couldnt agree more.

  7. #7
    Comes Limitis
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Planet Ape
    Posts
    14,786

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Raise it up again!!!

    No srsly, My city west-Berlin went down the drain big time ever since, but it was evidently the right thing to do.

    Whats Germany without its Prussians and Saxons?
    Quote Originally Posted by snuggans View Post
    we can safely say that a % of those 130 were Houthi/Iranian militants that needed to be stopped unfortunately

  8. #8
    Comes Limitis
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Planet Ape
    Posts
    14,786

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Lets not discredit the US and its undeniable achievements.
    Quote Originally Posted by snuggans View Post
    we can safely say that a % of those 130 were Houthi/Iranian militants that needed to be stopped unfortunately

  9. #9
    ShockBlast's Avatar Protector Domesticus
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    European Union , Romania , Constanta
    Posts
    4,496

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorn777 View Post
    Lets not discredit the US and its undeniable achievements.
    Signing the unification is not a big deal.Germany with it's ostpolitik and Gorbachev made it happen.

    P.S. I'm doing my German homework.

  10. #10
    Koelkastmagneet's Avatar Vicarius
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Zuid-Holland, Netherlands
    Posts
    2,922

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by ShockBlast View Post
    Signing the unification is not a big deal.Germany with it's ostpolitik and Gorbachev made it happen.

    P.S. I'm doing my German homework.
    Agreed.

    P.S Beware of the evil umlauts and falle. (something tells me I just made a mistake concerning umlauts)
    ☻ This is a random collection of symbols. He's tired of you abusing him.
    /▌\  Don't copy-paste this if you know what's good for you.
    / \

  11. #11
    Koelkastmagneet's Avatar Vicarius
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Zuid-Holland, Netherlands
    Posts
    2,922

    Default

    Not that big news over here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorn777 View Post
    Lets not discredit the US and its undeniable achievements.
    The US had absolutely nothing to do with the wall being torn down.
    Last edited by Atterdag; November 11, 2009 at 02:05 AM.
    ☻ This is a random collection of symbols. He's tired of you abusing him.
    /▌\  Don't copy-paste this if you know what's good for you.
    / \

  12. #12
    Comes Limitis
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Planet Ape
    Posts
    14,786

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Then you don't have any idea about the full scope of events that went on. Don't try and tell a west-Berliner about the history of his city.

    The anti-Americanism ive seen lately is truly pathetic.
    Quote Originally Posted by snuggans View Post
    we can safely say that a % of those 130 were Houthi/Iranian militants that needed to be stopped unfortunately

  13. #13
    ShockBlast's Avatar Protector Domesticus
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    European Union , Romania , Constanta
    Posts
    4,496

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorn777 View Post
    Then you don't have any idea about the full scope of events that went on. Don't try and tell a west-Berliner about the history of his city.
    I'm not but US didn't do anything special,it's your doing and good will form the Soviets.

    The anti-Americanism ive seen lately is truly pathetic.
    What does good German diplomacy and a realist Soviet leadership has to do with anti-Americanism?I harbor no hatred for them,i just want a stronger EU that can do what is good for it's citizens even if that makes us look the Americans in the eye and say:Ney.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorn777 View Post
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berlin_..._Airlift_start

    Without this no west-Berlin, and it goes on from there...

    Of course there is Gorby, Brandt, Genscher and so on, and of course Reagan capitalized his role, but Americans had their fare share throughout the history of west-Berlin making this possible in the end.
    Helping Berlin survive doesn't have anything to do with the Soviets allowing RDG unite with RFG.Germany and USSR had strong ties,politically but more important economically.
    Last edited by ShockBlast; November 10, 2009 at 02:24 PM.

  14. #14
    Comes Limitis
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Planet Ape
    Posts
    14,786

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berlin_..._Airlift_start

    Without this no west-Berlin, and it goes on from there...

    Of course there is Gorby, Brandt, Genscher and so on, and of course Reagan capitalized his role, but Americans had their fare share throughout the history of west-Berlin making this possible in the end.
    Quote Originally Posted by snuggans View Post
    we can safely say that a % of those 130 were Houthi/Iranian militants that needed to be stopped unfortunately

  15. #15
    Koelkastmagneet's Avatar Vicarius
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Zuid-Holland, Netherlands
    Posts
    2,922

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorn777 View Post
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berlin_..._Airlift_start

    Without this no west-Berlin, and it goes on from there...

    Of course there is Gorby, Brandt, Genscher and so on, and of course Reagan capitalized his role, but Americans had their fare share throughout the history of west-Berlin making this possible in the end.
    But it stands, the US has absolutely nothing to do with the fall of the Berlin wall.
    ☻ This is a random collection of symbols. He's tired of you abusing him.
    /▌\  Don't copy-paste this if you know what's good for you.
    / \

  16. #16

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Agreed, the Airlift is a proud moment on its own merits, but it had no causation for the fall of the wall, which was a product of changing German politics as well as those in the greater Soviet sphere, and a little bit of an accident as well.

    I mean, you might as well keep going backwards in time and credit Napoleon for inadvertendly awakening German nationalism. Clearly responsible for the fall of the wall.
    قرطاج يجب ان تدمر

  17. #17
    Comes Limitis
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Planet Ape
    Posts
    14,786

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Why? Because you apparently denie history. It wasn't a single event making this possible, it was a strain of events, of which many where only made possible with US backing. And yes even literally keeping the city from starving, thx to GB and France to btw.

    Its very simple...of course the events right before where all about glasnost, DDR inner struggles and especially Willy Brandt and his farsighted reunification policy's.

    Thanking the US and the allies isn't misplaced at all.

    @Motiv 8

    Thats only one example, context please...
    Last edited by Thorn777; November 10, 2009 at 02:34 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by snuggans View Post
    we can safely say that a % of those 130 were Houthi/Iranian militants that needed to be stopped unfortunately

  18. #18

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Wow the complete and utter willful ignorance being displayed and bile being spewed in this thread is truly heart breaking. I guess europeans never change. They still have that remarkable ability to not learn anything from their own histories. Your continent certainly deserved all the destruction it has brought upon itself.

  19. #19
    ShockBlast's Avatar Protector Domesticus
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    European Union , Romania , Constanta
    Posts
    4,496

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by The Devil's Sergeant View Post
    Wow the complete and utter willful ignorance being displayed and bile being spewed in this thread is truly heart breaking. I guess europeans never change. They still have that remarkable ability to not learn anything from their own histories. Your continent certainly deserved all the destruction it has brought upon itself.
    Well enlighten us how did you persuade the Soviets to give East Germany to FRG.
    No one is saying that Germany's allies didn't help but to claim that you were the determining factor is laughable.Two things were instrumental:Ostpolitik and Gorbachev.

  20. #20
    Koelkastmagneet's Avatar Vicarius
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Zuid-Holland, Netherlands
    Posts
    2,922

    Default Re: Berlin marks 20 years since the fall of the Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by The Devil's Sergeant View Post
    Wow the complete and utter willful ignorance being displayed and bile being spewed in this thread is truly heart breaking. I guess europeans never change. They still have that remarkable ability to not learn anything from their own histories. Your continent certainly deserved all the destruction it has brought upon itself.
    Enlighten us with your knowledge, how exactly did the US contribute to the fall of the Berlin wall?
    ☻ This is a random collection of symbols. He's tired of you abusing him.
    /▌\  Don't copy-paste this if you know what's good for you.
    / \

Page 1 of 4 1234 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •