Curia Hostilia: Consulate of Celsus and Barba

[Celsius]

"So, we are suppose to go to war based on your whim correct? You are willing to sacrifice hundreds, perhaps even thousands of Roman lives just because you have 2 letters that are probably false? I am sorry Aventinus. But this Senate thinks before it acts."

[chaplain118]

This Senate seemed more content on sending men charging into Pyrrhus' men without second thought, more content to embrace a dubious state as an ally, and even more willing to sacrifice men to protect that state? For whom does this Senate work for, Romans or Calabrians?

Or shall this question be more direct, Felix? For whom do YOU work for, Romans or Calabrians?

Pallas walked closer to Felix before turning back to the Senate floor.

You have heard him, Senators. You all have heard this man. He has called the evidence I presented to you dubious. Fine, let him do that. There is much reason for you to believe that of me, a man having been exiled from Rome for five years. But here he is, licking the boots of Camillus, agreeing that we should test the resolves of the Calabrians by sending OUR men to fight for them. Why, Felix, should we send our men to fight Pyrrhus on behalf of Cannae? Why should Roman blood be spilt unneccesarily? Why do you call for our legions, who are first and foremost loyal and duty-bound to Rome, to go to the aid of Cannae when Pyrrhus has returned to Italy?

You say that I argue for the conquering of Cannae. Did I argue that? I merely said that we can ill trust the Calabrians. I affirmed that they are no reliable members of aid. You twist my words, senator. And believe me, when the truth of your lying ways are exposed, you will regret it.

[Celsius]

I work for Rome and its people. It is my job to look after there welfare and protect them.

Felix stood and addressed the Senate

Aventinus. You say we have a rather untrustworthy ally? These untrustworthy people as you say they are, have done nothing to signify that they will turn their backs on Rome. These people are scared to death of Phrryus. They look to Rome to help them. Rome will help them. As Senator Camillus has stated in his plan, we will test them to see if they truly are trustworthy, and we will save them from utter destruction.

[Xavier Dragnesi]

You have heard him, Senators. You all have heard this man. He has called the evidence I presented to you dubious. Fine, let him do that. There is much reason for you to believe that of me, a man having been exiled from Rome for five years. But here he is, licking the boots of Camillus, agreeing that we should test the resolves of the Calabrians by sending OUR men to fight for them. Why, Felix, should we send our men to fight Pyrrhus on behalf of Cannae? Why should Roman blood be spilt unneccesarily? Why do you call for our legions, who are first and foremost loyal and duty-bound to Rome, to go to the aid of Cannae when Pyrrhus has returned to Italy?

"I shall answer some of your queries, Aventinus, as it is my plan that Felix is supporting, and therefore my plan you are aiming your words at.

"Firstly, we are not fighting merely on behalf of Cannae. Pyrrhus instigated this war, and is both we and Cannae who were jointly threatened. To aid Cannae is to also protect ourselves, as it is undoubted that if Pyrrhus were to take Cannae, Rome would be his next objective. Secondly, it is not guaranteed that your plan may work. Once he discovers his ruse does not work, Pyrrhus will not merely just continue on to Rome, he will call upon the troops of Cannae to aid him in marching to Rome which would make our job all the harder, if your theory of their treachery is correct. If it is incorrect, I doubt Cannae could muster enough troops to beat off Pyrrhus' attack, which is why the asked for our aid in the first place. They have looked up to us, and to forsake that respect they have for us would not make a good wider impression. It is almost certain that some Roman blood will be spilt, no matter what course we choose to take.

"I believe with my plan we can both determine the sentiments of Cannae and defeat Pyrrhus with the least amount of Roman blood shed and with the least need for speculation."

[Raglan]

Senators, it comes down to a matter of trust. Who do we trust more, a man that was once banished from Rome. For reasons that i have no need to remind you of. Or men who have asked us for help, men that are in need of that help.

I know that it will be said that i am simply in the employ of Cannae, but i know which i trust more. I trust not this man. If any other had brought us these letters, i should have found greater faith in them. But him? A man for whom compared to his last crimes, faking letters to lead us to betray allies is no great leap.

[Celsius]

"Aventinus. You have a bad record when it comes to the Senate. I do not know about my fellow senators, but I for one do not believe a word you say. Our of the blue, you come with documents that cannot be proven real. If they are real, why didnt Cannae aid Phrryus in the Battle against us? It does not add up, and any Senator who believes needs to be crucified."

[Captain Blackadder]

Cruicified how dare you Felix you would suggest that againest your fellow romans that is completly unforigivable even in jest. My fellow Romans we need to focus on the Greeks to attack our allies over some fake letters is not acceptable we need to end this threat from the Greeks for ever we need to attack their homelands and see how they like it when they are threatened with the forces of war.

[Stildawn]

Manius stood....

"I agree Senators.... We should attack their homelands and directly punish them... I propose we enter a temporary state of massive Military growth... It should only be short to drive them both out of Italy and conquer their homelands...."

[Celsius]

"A man that comes in here without any regard to our Soldier's lives is no true Roman. Are you aware Pulcher that what you say may seem easy, it is difficult. The Republic needs to boot the Greeks off of our own Peninsula before we head across the Ionian Sea. You want to take action before you think of the toll it would take.

Rome is not a warmongering state. We are not Gauls. We can expand peacfully. But to march into Greece is a bad idea to the farthest extent. Greeks hate Romans like Romans hate Greeks. They will resist us until we leave. Focus on the homeland before you focus on expansion Pulcher."

[Stildawn]

"I say that we hide behind our soldiers no longer.... I say that we stop being weak timid undecisive old men... I say we bring forth Roman civilization onto the world... We stand and we fight and we will win... I have faith that the Gods favour the bold, and that they will guide us to victory... We have been pushed around by inferior nations for too long... IT IS TIME THAT THE WORLD SEES WHAT ROMANS CAN DO!!!" Manius said in a victorious voice...

[Captain Blackadder]

"A man that comes in here without any regard to our Soldier's lives is no true Roman. Are you aware Pulcher that what you say may seem easy, it is difficult. The Republic needs to boot the Greeks off of our own Peninsula before we head across the Ionian Sea. You want to take action before you think of the toll it would take.

Rome is not a warmongering state. We are not Gauls. We can expand peacfully. But to march into Greece is a bad idea to the farthest extent. Greeks hate Romans like Romans hate Greeks. They will resist us until we leave. Focus on the homeland before you focus on expansion Pulcher."

Do not call me Pulcher you have not earned the right to do so. We must stop the greek threat once and for all they will come back time and time again we must kick them of our lands and take their lands otherwise they will be a constant threat to our safety and thje safety of all romans and with this\ defeat of his army there has never being a greater moment to destroy the Greeks forever.

[Celsius]

"I would harldey call it a right. If I wanted to call you Antripazix from Gaul I will. If you think even for a second that you are superior than me, then you are sorely mistaken.
Felix returns to the matter at hand
So we are to turn a right into a wrong? If we do what they do, we are no better. Its that radical thinking that will lead Rome into the darkness."

[Captain Blackadder]

And then you would be mistaken as you are to call me Pulcher you are no friend of mine so do not act like you are. So what would you have us do. Allow the Greeks tov rebuild and attack us time and time again is that the Felix way? To be a coward and allow our enemies to attack with impunity. My fellow Romans what the world needs to learn is that to attack a Roman is to invite disaster on your country. To touch a single hair on thr head of a Roman means that you shall die. To hit a Roman in anger means you and your entire people shall face the might and fury of Rome. We need to let the world know that Rome is not to be pushed around and if we make an example of these greeks then other people like the Gauls shall think twice before crossing the rubicon the Carthagians shall think twice before meanicing us and our traders. We need to strike and strike hard.

[Celsius]

"I am not your friend. I was pretty sure it was clear that I wasnt and I do not intend on trying to be. If you have been listening at all Senator, you would know of Senator Camillus' plan in which I fully support. Phrryus must be killed and his army removed from the peninsula. But sending an army to Greece at this time would bring more trouble than its worth. Let's take care of Phrryus first, then rebuild our forces to push into Greece. But first, we must get back on the subject at hand. Cannae."
Felix rubbed his head
"Rome should not be pushed around, but should it strike fear in the world? Fear inspires hatred Pulcher. Hatred inspires war. War inspires death. Personally, I do not enjoy hearing of the casualties we face on the battlefields. Roman soldiers are men. They are people, not a resource which just comes and goes."

[Captain Blackadder]

I am not saying that it should be done now but is a future course of events. As for your idea what you think Rome will get far talking to the Greeks and Gauls. Weakness breeds contempt, contempt leads to war, war leads to death. We need to show power otherwise we are finished strenght is the only langauge that barbarians listen to and that is the one we need to school them in Felix and call me by my name Claudius do not use my nickname in this house.

[Celsius]

"I did not say once that we should talk to the Greeks or Gauls. You either have misunderstood or not have payed attention to me. HAve you even read Senator Camillus' plan? If you havent, you shood. I also have not called you by your nickname. I am calling you by your last name, as I have everyone in this house. For me to call you by anything but that would directly insult you."

[chaplain118]

Pallas stood once again, clapping as he walked to the center of the Curia. His falcon grey eyes unblinking as he mockingly clapped. As he began speaking, Pallas took a pedantic and almost lilting tone in his speech. It seemed airy and calm.

Bravo, Senators, bravo. I see that my presence here has spurred at least a semblance of life within the rabbled mess before me today. I am sorely disappointed, however, at the lack of foresight I see in those of you here, especially in you, Senator Felix. You seem to have no independent thinking about you. Instead, you play the part of a true politician. You back a winning horse, or in this case, a winning argument. You then take that stance and flow with it. Would you have raised your voice of anger against me had this Pleb Statius not raised his? Would you have came up with the plan of Camillus had he not proposed it? Would you be now taking up a voice of conservatism had the votes you plan on taking not been dependent upon it?

I say again, bravo. You have played this game well and have done so in such a convincing manner that this house would become united if only to oppose me. But will the Calabrians play the same game you are? Here is a simpler solution to this conundrum about Cannae:

We leave our legion within sight of Cannae and the coming Epirote forces. Let them attempt to create that mock siege that they so desperately want us to intervene in. But believe me, it is then that the true colors of the Calabrians will be shown. You will see that they do not intend to bend to the will of the Republic, but easily swayed by promise of kingship by Epirus. They will fall upon our legions, who had been sent there to protect them, like vultures upon a rotten carcass. And then, only then, will all voice of foolishness and opposition cease and you will have realized your mistake.

Pallas suddenly turned to Felix. His voice no longer light. Instead, it grew in strength and intensity until the words seemed to be shot out from a pent up bow. Gripping his toga by its fringes, Pallas advanced towards Felix, coming closer and closer.

Do you dare oppose this plan? Does this not satisfy your vilified desire to see the true nature of the Calabrians? Does this not let you place our legions in the field to witness the so called antipathy between Cannae and Epirus? Does this not placate your unholy rage against my warnings? Do you oppose it? Do you support it? Can you come up with one that would be more definitive of proving the hearts of men that we have never once interacted with?

After all, the crossing into Epirus territory must be made, no? We must take Tarentum and Croton to enforce Italy as a fortress, no? Epirus and Greece must forever remain at the other end of the Adriatic, no? But let me ask you now. If we are to unify Italy under a single banner, why must we leave a port so close to Epirus outside of our Republic's control? If we wish to cross into Epirote territory, why must we do so through a nation whose sincerity and trustworthiness is doubtful? If we must forever keep Greece and Epirus at the other end of the sea, why must we leave a city that could open its gates to the invading forces and let them flood into Italy like the raging Tiber during the summer storms?

Answer me, Felix! Are you capable of such thoughts? Can you even begin to fathom the implications of the words you utter? Are you able to sway my opinion upon this matter, to turn my mind to your side, to make my vision as myopic as yours? Have you an answer for this august body or will you merely wait for your superiors to make the first argument and then following them so obediently like the lapdog that you are?

Pallas' voice rang in the curia, bouncing off the marbled floor and the raised windows. He waited patiently for the response.

OOC: can we start putting names in the sig. It's really hard to keep track of them when they're not there. Also, Roman naming system is different from our own. The three name system is divided up into praenomen, nomen, cognomen. The praenomen is a personal name relative to the person given at birth. It is effectively the "first name". The nomen is one's family, or gens, name, making it the "last name". The cognomen is an additional descriptor of the particular branch of the gens and sometimes can be used as an adjective of the person. It's like having two John Smith, but one is from New York and the other Boston. In this case, "of New York" or "of Boston" is the cognomen and "Smith" is the nomen.

[Raglan]

Aulus listened carefully to the debate that had errupted, he wasn't suprised to hear Rutulus mention him in derission, and fully expected to hear it said the same way again. But even so he knew that he couldn't let Rutulus' seemingly moderate suggestion stand, it was to provocative, to agressive and would produce exactly the result Rutulus' wanted

Senator Rutulus, you say we should stand a legion outside their city. How long should it stand their for? What makes you think that they would be willing to let us? I know what you are thinking, if they do not like it, that it will merely prove their guilt. But senators, think, how willing would we be to have an army of Cannae stand on the bridges of the Tiber?

How long would we endure that before our goodwill erroded, and we became angry at the insult? If we follow Rutulus' seemingly moderate suggestion, it will lead to exactly the result he is warning us of.

Instead i have a suggestion, an option that has not been thought of as of yet. Unity, we could have unity. Why not make an offer, a suggestion that they join with us, that they would sit in this chamber, and that we will together forge Rome's, and Italy's future. They are not fools, they know they cannot stand alone, the option of joining us will seem atractive, it will secure the city that Rutulus is so worried about, and bring their armys and our own together in a way that conquest will not.

[Stildawn]

Manius simply sighed and shook his head.... Its seems that these senators were doomed to undecisiveness and eventually failure...

[chaplain118]

So, Statius, you seem to have a fine understanding of the psyche of the Calabrians. How does one ascertain such an acumen for understanding a nation whose customs and cognition are so inherently different from ours? How, Statius, does one gain such an understanding when he has spent his entire life in Rome.

Now be assured that I am not questioning your loyalties to Rome nor am I questioning your possible involvement with the Calabrians as a spy. All I am questioning is your understanding of the minds of a foreign government that is so different from Rome's.