ATVTW - Trait/Ancillary Validator

[irishron]

Yes, thank you.

[gracul]

Minor gremlin - HasAncType works perfectly in EDCT.

[Squid]

How are you testing this?

[gracul]

Simple set of triggers:

Trigger Untitled_trigger
 WhenToTest CharacterTurnStart

 Condition not HasAncType dearmad_her
       and Trait Untitled = 0

 Affects Untitled 1 Chance 100

;------------------------------------------
Trigger Titled_trigger
 WhenToTest CharacterTurnStart

 Condition HasAncType dearmad_her
       and Trait Titled = 0

 Affects Titled 1 Chance 100

And it switches between the titled untitled traits (antitraits) when i transfer the ancillary.

Its not like i would say it works without testing it.

[Squid]

Assuming those are anti-traits, by the switching between them comments, then depending on the threshold level associated with the two traits it will switch between the two anyways. A condition that is not valid will always be evaluated to true by the engine, not false.

[gracul]

No Squid, that is incorrect.
Assuming what you say is correct, i can only get the Titled trait, since "not HasAncType dearmad_her" will be always false.

[Squid]

Not true, any line with an invalid condition will always be true, with a not or without it.

So if a line:

if randomthing will be true

and

if not randomthinng will be true

basically the engine will ignore the line with an invalid condition on it.

[gracul]

Invalid conditions are reported as errors.
How have you tested an "invalid condition which was not an error" and assumed it would evaluate to true? That's completely not possible!
The condition parser is used in both EDCT EDA and a lot of other files (script, advice etc), so there is no way a condition that works inside EDA won't work inside EDCT.


Now let's talk about the anti-traits system.
If i have a trait with 1 point in it, and the anti-trait gets 1 point, they will erase themselves - meaning i won't get any text description as both trait = 0 and anti-trait = 0.
So how in the world would any of the descriptions show up at all?
And what's more, they perfectly mimic the fact that i transfer the ancillaries - meaning i can stay titled for 3 turns and then when i transfer the anc out i will no longer be titled.

[Squid]

Invalid conditions are reported as errors.
How have you tested an "invalid condition which was not an error" and assumed it would evaluate to true? That's completely not possible!
The condition parser is used in both EDCT EDA and a lot of other files (script, advice etc), so there is no way a condition that works inside EDA won't work inside EDCT.

Of course there is, try and use the FactionWideAncillaryExists condition in EDCT and the condition will return an error in the log. Move the trigger, without altering it, into EDA and the error will not show up in the log. Further some events work with traits but not ancillaries, such as the adoption events. There are bunch of things that only work correctly in one file but not both.

Now let's talk about the anti-traits system.
If i have a trait with 1 point in it, and the anti-trait gets 1 point, they will erase themselves - meaning i won't get any text description as both trait = 0 and anti-trait = 0.
So how in the world would any of the descriptions show up at all?
And what's more, they perfectly mimic the fact that i transfer the ancillaries - meaning i can stay titled for 3 turns and then when i transfer the anc out i will no longer be titled.

You'd need 2 points in the anti-trait to get the anti-traits description and then 2 points in the trait to get the trait description back again. This is provided both have at least one level and the level has a threshold of 1 for both the trait and the antitrait. I'd need to see how you have the actual traits defined in addition to the triggers.

[gracul]

Although there are some file specific conditions, if you misplace them an error in the log will be shown.
HasAncType does not throw out such an error, so i don't see a point in assuming that its not working properly.

You'd need 2 points in the anti-trait to get the anti-traits description and then 2 points in the trait to get the trait description back again. This is provided both have at least one level and the level has a threshold of 1 for both the trait and the antitrait. I'd need to see how you have the actual traits defined in addition to the triggers.

I am totally aware of that, that's why once again - no text description will ever appear if these are anti-traits and both triggers always fire.

;------------------------------------------
Trait Titled
 Characters family
 AntiTraits Untitled

 Level Titled
   Description Titled_desc
   EffectsDescription Titled_effects_desc
   Threshold 1

;------------------------------------------
Trait Untitled
 Characters family
 AntiTraits Titled

 Level Untitled
   Description Untitled_desc
   EffectsDescription Untitled_effects_desc
   Threshold 1

;------------------------------------------
Trigger Untitled_trigger
 WhenToTest CharacterTurnStart

 Condition not HasAncType dearmad_her
       and Trait Untitled = 0

 Affects Untitled 1 Chance 100

;------------------------------------------
Trigger Titled_trigger
 WhenToTest CharacterTurnStart

 Condition HasAncType dearmad_her
       and Trait Titled = 0

 Affects Titled 1 Chance 100

[Live2sculpt]

This tool is awesome. But I am not really up to the mark on making use of its results.

Squid, do you have a complimentary recommendation for a Traits-Ancillaries tutorial or thread that covers the basics well?

I'm cleaning up a traits list full of old accumulations and if some of these interesting/useful trait titles your tool reports problems on aren't firing, and could be made to fire, I want to fix them.

[Ishan]

Squid, do you have a complimentary recommendation for a Traits-Ancillaries tutorial or thread that covers the basics well?

Ancillaries Tutorial.
Traits Tutorials One & Two.

[Squid]

Version 2.2.2

Changes/Fixes from v2.2.1:

• Added M2TW condition GiveSettlement
• Fixed output of conditions with not so the not is before the condition name, it had been displaying the not after the condition

Go to the first post to get the new version.

[Withwnar]

Brilliant tool, thanks Squid.

One thing: I couldn't get this to work with .NET 4.0. Works fine with 3.5. It could be my machine but if not then the "3.5 or later" is not quite true.

I don't know much about .NET but surely it's backwards compatible.

[Heeehehe]

can this tool search error in M2TW EDU?

[Ishan]

It can't.

[Heeehehe]

Owwww... ok, thank for the answer

[Minas Moth]

one quick question:

do the values in conditions like BattleOdds/PercentageOfEnemyKilled need to be in the brackets like this {14.54} or we can use them whitout those brackets?

[Ishan]

You can use them without curly brackets.

[Minas Moth]

You can use them without curly brackets.

thank you wey much kind sir...