Eastern Euro. factions have very bad early units.

**SturmChurro** · October 23, 2009, 09:01 AM

Really don't the eastern Euro. Factions have trash early units, such as Woodsmen from Russia PURE TRASH they only have 1 defence and when you get more armor on it its defence is 2 PURE TRASH, sure they may have good attack but if they get shot down before they attack they are worthless, then spear militia they just suck no matter what. Only good early units I can think of early on would have to be the missile cavalry THAT IS ALL.

**Goofy** · October 23, 2009, 12:47 PM

In my opinion Russia has good enough early units. And they're supremely powerful in late period. Woodsmen have high charge bonus and attack, they're not useless like many people think.
The pity is that eastern spear militia don't have "bonus fighting cavalry" attribute... although it is easy to add.

**Shrigs** · October 23, 2009, 12:59 PM

Originally Posted by FinnKing

In my opinion Russia has good enough early units. And they're supremely powerful in late period. Woodsmen have high charge bonus and attack, they're not useless like many people think.
The pity is that eastern spear militia don't have "bonus fighting cavalry" attribute... although it is easy to add.

I'd agree on Russia. Their early troops aren't the best by any means, but like you said, they make up for it. Woodsmen are cheap, and moderately effective, I'd say. They're not necessarily going to win you the "war" per-se, but they can win you the "battle". The best way I would suggest using Eastern European factions early troops, is to use them like Russia is notorious for. Attack them with numbers, overwhelm them with your manpower. If you encircle a division with Woodsmen, they'll still get the job done because of their attack. Even if you lose a lot of them. Just gotta be careful to not let them rout.

**Viking Prince** · October 23, 2009, 06:24 PM

Woodsmen are just a better form of peasant. Cheap, plentiful, good ram pushers, and great general killers. Don't leave home without them.

**Mega Tortas de Bodemloze** · October 23, 2009, 06:45 PM

The Generals are your finest hour. Stackem high, get those rebel settle ments then settle them in as city builders. If you leave them as city builders that will teleport you to the higher level units.

**{GrailKnight}** · October 23, 2009, 08:19 PM

Russia has good early units, and against the dumb A.I. anyone can use them to good effectiveness.

**RollingWave** · October 24, 2009, 02:12 AM

Any faction that gets horse archers right off the bat would be as far away from suck as humanly possible.

**Callawyn** · October 25, 2009, 01:42 PM

On the plus side, they're extra cheap. Also, there are VERY cheap mercenaries available in Eastern Europe / Balkans, both infantry and archers, that really help with early expansion. Often, to keep your initial expansion rolling, you just need bodies, and bodies will do, and cheap really helps.

**Old_Scratch** · October 25, 2009, 06:32 PM

Russia has great early units, Druzina are great cavalry with an AP axe. Their infantry is actually decent, if a little expensive, but you can always fill in the gaps with cheap woodsmen. Eastern European factions are good early too. Poland gets mounted crossbowmen (!) early along with a bunch of other good cav, and Hungary gets Hungarian Nobles which are decent horse archers and their Croat Axemen are actually entirely worth it for the price.

**RollingWave** · October 28, 2009, 12:58 AM

no, essentially all you really need is Druzina + Kazaks, even a small band should be more than enough to handle anything in the field if you have a clue on how to properly utilize those units. only use infantry for defensive purpose, (even siege just starve them out with horse units.)

If you can hoard HAs, you should basically never bring any infantry to the field.

**Thalassocrat** · October 28, 2009, 03:25 AM

I feel their armies are offence oriented, so it will be vastly different to W.European units with their heavily armoured infantry.

As for woodsmen, loved them in MTW, love em more in M2TW

**G-Megas-Doux** · October 30, 2009, 10:48 PM

Originally Posted by UCMENOMOR

Really don't the eastern Euro. Factions have trash early units, such as Woodsmen from Russia PURE TRASH they only have 1 defence and when you get more armor on it its defence is 2 PURE TRASH, sure they may have good attack but if they get shot down before they attack they are worthless, then spear militia they just suck no matter what. Only good early units I can think of early on would have to be the missile cavalry THAT IS ALL.

I think you are missing the point. In RTW you can win the game with the Numidians and their roster is designed as filler as no one was supposed to campaign with them. In MIITWl you can play as an faction outside of mesoamerican, mongel, papacy and timirid. All the eastern units are designed to give you a chance. The units you describe would be brilliant in an open battle. Just use militia spear men as front line holding. Use your cavalry to shoot from distance wearing down the opposition when they come in pin with the militia attack from the side withe the woodsmen who will destroy the enemy. The Cavalry will hold the flank of the woodsmen. If besieging you could win any battle being attacked with the same tactics and if you want to take the town then there realy is no problem use your horse archers to drive away troops from the gates break open with the spear send them in to hold the gate bring the woodsmen and cavalry in and you practicly have the town. On higher settlements storm the walls with ladders for the spear militia you only need one then send the woodsmen up after they will make short work of the walls defenses use other troops to open the gate and send in the cavalry to take the centry with infantry support.

You control the units not the other way round. They are only useless if you can not find a use for them.

**SturmChurro** · October 31, 2009, 08:48 AM

I failed to include on this post early Eastern Euro. infantry sure they have horse archers which are great in open field battle but there infantry lose in the small battles I put them in.

**G-Megas-Doux** · October 31, 2009, 03:56 PM

Try mixing the units so that they are shared arround your stacks this will help level the problems.

**ZeroChrome** · November 02, 2009, 10:31 PM

Originally Posted by UCMENOMOR

Really don't the eastern Euro. Factions have trash early units, such as Woodsmen from Russia PURE TRASH they only have 1 defence and when you get more armor on it its defence is 2 PURE TRASH, sure they may have good attack but if they get shot down before they attack they are worthless, then spear militia they just suck no matter what. Only good early units I can think of early on would have to be the missile cavalry THAT IS ALL.

of course they dont have good infantry, since they are supposed to use missile cavalry. Anyways Polish Nobles are excellent units and u can get them right off the bat iirc (I know that they are missile cav, but they can mix it up with all early game cav and win)

**Viking Prince** · November 08, 2009, 10:11 PM

It is easy as any Eastern faction to quickly achieve a strategic advantage over the other Eastern factions. The challange comes when making the transition to the Italians and Western Europeans. Their population base is better and they will have a better level of castle unit available. Fortunately -- the lower level cavalry units have a pretty long life in the scheme of things -- for example the Polish horse archer is good enough until the final citadel stages of the game and that is the first level stable unit.

EDIT:

for example: I have a saved Polish campaign about 1130 (Lands to Conquor-Gold) -- just about the time that the Kracow walls are to be upgraded Poland needs to go to the aid of their ally HRE against Hungary (HRE has recently lost Vienna). Bran and Sofia fall quickly to a single stack about 1/3 woodsmen, 1/3 horse archer, 1/3 mercenary/slavic spearmen (the partial loss units were hived off to garrison and to eventually recruit replacements). This is more than adequate to tackle the Hungarians and the Russians this early in the game, but the Poles would be outclassed against the HRE or even the Danes on a stack for stack basis. Bran is now the best castle but only has about 7800 population. The fortress is still a long ways off and that means the Woodsmen are as good as you can recruit as castle based infantry for a spell still.

The file is attached for what ever value it holds. Hungary is ready to deal for a ceasefire, but they are bankrupt and hold Vienna from the HRE (ally) Byzantium (ally as well) is fighting a two front war with Hungary/Venice to the west and the Turks to the east. They may be at their high water mark at the moment though. They still old Naples, all of the southern Balkans, and pieces west of Kiev.

**Nazgûl Killer** · November 09, 2009, 02:18 AM

I actually love the Woodsmen. Armor stats aren't everything in this game, the fact is that they have an amazing armor piercing ability - As such they are very deadly to any armored unit and especially generals.
I wouldn't dismiss any unit as 'trash' as every unit has its uses.

**HeroSK** · November 09, 2009, 03:48 AM

I dont thinks so. Eastern Factions have greatest begining units : horse archers.

**KnightOfPortugal** · November 10, 2009, 01:05 PM

Horse archers are great early units, Their bows aren't armor piercing, so they'll become nearly useless in the late game, but poland has those special crossbow cavalry, and russia had mounted gunners iirc.

**RollingWave** · November 10, 2009, 08:35 PM

Not really, horse archers are basically the be all and end all units, a lot of the better versions have armor peircing melee capacity anyway (like the Mongols)