Good starting date for a high era campaign?

[Zombimode]

I figured this is the part of the forum where people with historic knowledge will probaly look into, so I will put my question in here.

I'm about to set up my personal MTW2 modification for an high era campaign. Now Im searching an interesting starting date + information about the terretorial holds of the represented factions (read: political maps).

The starting date should provide the typical Total War situation: a world full of tension and possibilities, factions at the brink of war. No period of peace, not a world with a few major powers supressing all others. I think you know the deal.

Your comments and suggestions are welcome

[hellheaven1987]

1066?? High Medieval era generally hints by the collapse of central government and the increasing power of local lords, which was around 900s~1000s.

[Zombimode]

Ah, I forgot to mention I mean the Total War definition of "high era", read: something in the 12xxths

[MaximiIian]

1066?? High Medieval era generally hints by the collapse of central government and the increasing power of local lords, which was around 900s~1000s.

High Middle Ages was 1066 to 1356-ish.
You're thinking of the Early Middle Ages, about 800 to 1066.

[MathiasOfAthens]

http://www.shadowedrealm.com/maps/political/page3 Take a look here, lots of very well drawn maps with cities and borders of nearly every nation.

[konny]

I would start at some point between 1310 and 1337:

- England and France about the same strong and short before the outbreak of the HYW
- The HRE collapsed, should be displayed by the lands held by the houses of Habsburg and/or Luxemburg
- The Reconquista in Spain nearly completed with three about equally strong kingdoms holding the peninsula.
- Italy controled by various smaller to medium sized states. In the south an uneasy peace between Aragon and Anjou
- The Byzantine empire seriously reduced, but with the Ottomans still not to strong to not be dealt with
- The Mongol empire already broken up into various chanats
- The Teutonic Order already sitting on the Baltics with strong ties into northern Germany (Hanse), but opposed by other strong states around.


The exact starting date and factions would depend on the map, of course.

[Zombimode]

http://www.shadowedrealm.com/maps/political/page3 Take a look here, lots of very well drawn maps with cities and borders of nearly every nation.

Wow, this is a very nice fundus of map It will certainly prove helpful, thanks.

@konny

Thanks for your suggestion. I like it, but its pretty close to my late era campaign which starts at 1371. There are gameplay reasons why I would like to set the date a bit earlier (dont want to have widespread gunpowder use for a good while, just for a change of pace, since Im already playing at the moment a gunpowder era campgaign).

[konny]

That's difficult because much earlyer you might have a rather strong Mongol faction dominating the east. Maybe starting 1214 would be an option:

- A counter king in Germany makes the HRE (faction HRE would be Otto IV, faction Sicily would be Friedrich II) rather weak
- England is still present on the Continent but France should be set up stronger
- The Seljuks of Rum were still not conquered by the Mongols (but threatened)
- the ERE was reduced to some outlying provinces while the core lands were held by the Latin Empire (could use the already extinct Kingdom of Jerusalem from Crusades).
- Antiochia and Tripolis would still exsist as Crusader States

The Teutonic Order might start as a horde faction in the Baltics. The conquest started in the 1230s.

[Zombimode]

Yes, that sounds good
I will point the starting date to 1215 though, after the battle of bouvines, for gameplay reasons.

Now, I have questions concerning the Latin Empire.

1. Is there a strong independent italian city state besides Venice (Fiorenza, Pisa, Genua, Milano...) at this time?
2. What would be more appropriate: puting the Latin Empire under venice control (making it part of the venice faction) or using an own faction for it (I could use the Milan faction if it has no place in Italy)?

[konny]

I would keep Milan because it is needed for the struggle between Friedrich II and the Italian city states. Otherwise you would need to give N-Italy to the Papal States.

Giving the Latin Empire to Venice could be an idea. Otherwise, if you wish to limit yourself to the factions available in Vanilla M2TW, use the "Saxon" faction slot and make it a "Crusader" faction in possession of Constantinopolis, Greece, Antiochia, Cyprus and Tripolis (is Tripolis on the Vanilla map? I can't remember).