David Cameron, statesman or salesman?

[I Heart Romans]

David Cameron's speech at the Conservative Party Conference, were you impressed? What does TWC think of David Cameron as a leader?

And try to refrain from Gordon Brown bashing, this is a topic about David Cameron's abilities after all!

[Poach]

As much as I want to refrain from attacking Brown, much of Cameron's popularity comes from the fact that he isn't Gordon Brown! He's better at public speaking and appealing to the masses than Clegg (plus Tories are the traditional opposition to Labour) and thus he's likely to win.

I do agree though, he does know how to play the popularity game...

[I Heart Romans]

He plays the popularity game too much, I think he may be damaging his chances some what by been tight lipped on some issues.

True that, but Clegg had a pretty good conference, shame no one can remember it...

[Poach]

His chances may indeed be hurt by remaining tight lipped on certain issues, but remember that the issues he refuses to be definite on are largely the same issues that neither Clegg nor Brown are willing to be definite on. Politicians play a delicate game, they're extremely carful never to commit themselves too solidly to an idea that may not prove feasible or prudent when they end up in power... Few politicians ever give straight answers!

[I Heart Romans]

His chances may indeed be hurt by remaining tight lipped on certain issues, but remember that the issues he refuses to be definite on are largely the same issues that neither Clegg nor Brown are willing to be definite on. Politicians play a delicate game, they're extremely carful never to commit themselves too solidly to an idea that may not prove feasible or prudent when they end up in power... Few politicians ever give straight answers!

But he doesn't seem to be radical enough in opposition, he isn't setting himself up to make major changes - as odd as that sounds.
I understand that, but a politician in his position really needs to show the electorate what he is a bout, and what his party is about, and whilst we have had a lot of rhetoric, we haven't really had anything solid come out of the conference, other then Boris Johnson can be a twonk when he wants to be!

considering the last good tory pm was churchill, don't hold out much hope for cameron being anything more than yet another corporate puppet.

Dinner for David Cameron does set you back £50 000, and I wonder who would attend those dinners...?

[tonymurphy1888]

Nothing good or productive ever comes from the Torries only reason there doing so well is because the world collapsed on top of labour. I'm from Scotland and he has promised nothing but cuts and nessassary savings for me not very appealing

[justicar5]

considering the last good tory pm was churchill, don't hold out much hope for cameron being anything more than yet another corporate puppet.

[Rt. Hon. Gentleman]

I am tempted to say salesman, but since that implies a degree of competence, I won't.

[I Heart Romans]

I am tempted to say salesman, but since that implies a degree of competence, I won't.

Haha, he does have a degree of competence (all be it a tiny degree), but yes, in my opinion he is much more of an opposition leader then leader, it seems like he only functions well when given a target to attack, and hold himself up to in comparison. I think the conference shed some light on that fact.

[Amry]

I thought all politicians are salesmen (oh all right, salesperson), in a sense that they will have to make a sales pitch in order to have voters "spend" their votes on them rather than their rivals. Which by itself is a neutral (i.e., not good or bad) quality in itself.

[I Heart Romans]

I thought all politicians are salesmen (oh all right, salesperson), in a sense that they will have to make a sales pitch in order to have voters "spend" their votes on them rather than their rivals. Which by itself is a neutral (i.e., not good or bad) quality in itself.

During election time yes. When they are not fighting an election, no.

[Poach]

I think we Brits can agree upon one thing: We have no good politicians. The country isn't going to get an exceptional leader any time soon!

Though a Tory government gives Alex Salmond a better position to cause trouble up here, he's even starting to demand he be included in election debates with the big 3! Needless to say, I hope Cameron treats Scotland well. I don't want to have to move to England but if it comes to it I will!

[I Heart Romans]

I think we Brits can agree upon one thing: We have no good politicians. The country isn't going to get an exceptional leader any time soon!

Though a Tory government gives Alex Salmond a better position to cause trouble up here, he's even starting to demand he be included in election debates with the big 3! Needless to say, I hope Cameron treats Scotland well. I don't want to have to move to England but if it comes to it I will!

He snubbed Alex Salmond on that one...I don't have any idea on how the Tories would treat Scotland, but I couldn't see them doing anything that drastic.

Hopefully!

[Poach]

He snubbed Alex Salmond on that one...I don't have any idea on how the Tories would treat Scotland, but I couldn't see them doing anything that drastic.

Hopefully!

Current thinking north of the border is that a Tory government will give the SNP more power. Scotland has always voted Labour and dislikes the Tories (I believe we have one Tory MP up here, just one!). As a result, Tories in Westminster will give Alex Salmond more ammunition for pushing through his independence proposal.

So the thinking goes. I pray he never gets the chance, if he does I pray my fellow Scots will turn him down.

[S.L.I.G]

David Cameron's speech at the Conservative Party Conference, were you impressed? What does TWC think of David Cameron as a leader?

And try to refrain from Gordon Brown bashing, this is a topic about David Cameron's abilities after all!

A statesmen is a salesmen, period. But I guess hes better than the alternative, so I dont mind him- for a politician.

[Pielstick]

David Cameron is simply the Tory incarnation of Tony Blair, and he's doing exactly the same thing Blair did in the 90's - take a shambles of a party and "modernise" it.

I can see lots of parallels now between Brown vs Cameron and Major vs Blair - an unpopular PM, lacking charisma and poor at public speaking, taking a sustained battering in the media and facing a younger, more charismatic and popular moderniser.

Unfortunately Tony Blair turned out to be a horrible PM who led a government that did an awful lot of damage to the country. I fear David Cameron will turn out the same.

As has been said above, politics in the UK is in a very sorry state. We lack good leaders with a clear vision and the balls to stand up and tell us what that vision is. Instead we get these media-centric figures who try to be everything to everyone, and nothing good gets done and the country spirals downward ever further.

[I Heart Romans]

A statesmen is a salesmen, period.

I think you are missing the point.

David Cameron is simply the Tory incarnation of Tony Blair, and he's doing exactly the same thing Blair did in the 90's - take a shambles of a party and "modernise" it.

I can see lots of parallels now between Brown vs Cameron and Major vs Blair - an unpopular PM, lacking charisma and poor at public speaking, taking a sustained battering in the media and facing a younger, more charismatic and popular moderniser.

Unfortunately Tony Blair turned out to be a horrible PM who led a government that did an awful lot of damage to the country. I fear David Cameron will turn out the same.

As has been said above, politics in the UK is in a very sorry state. We lack good leaders with a clear vision and the balls to stand up and tell us what that vision is. Instead we get these media-centric figures who try to be everything to everyone, and nothing good gets done and the country spirals downward ever further.

Pretty much the same, barring Tony Blair was a bit more radical and forward thinking.
A lot of what you said is debatable though, Tony Blair did not necessarily mess up the country, he did a whole lot of good, barring of course the Afghan and Iraqi Wars.

Bang on about how media-centric politicians are, but it is inevitable with modern technology and news coverage. Clement Atlee was incredibly boring and uncharismatic, he used cricket metaphors for Christ sake! Yet is regarded as one of the best Prime Ministers Britain has ever had. Ever since the dawn of television politicians have increasingly used sound bites, one liners and rhetoric over substance to get there point across, and this has had an adverse effect on politics - but I wouldn't say it has created a climate of poor leadership within Westminister.
And unfortunetly, parties have become more centrist in ideology, but that's what happens in a two party system, its big tent politics.

[S.L.I.G]

I think you are missing the point.

No...No I am not missing the point.

[I Heart Romans]

No...No I am not missing the point.

If by debating the linguistic meaning of this threads title instead of the actual topic of the thread itself, then yes, It would appear as if you are posting off topic.

[S.L.I.G]

If by debating the linguistic meaning of this threads title instead of the actual topic of the thread itself, then yes, It would appear as if you are posting off topic.

I'm debating the linguistic meaning of the threads title? I'm correcting the OP in his errant belief that it is even conceivably possible for a politician to be anything other than a "salesmen". A statesmen is a salesmen by the nature of his career. They all lie, their promises are always hollow, etc etc. Absolutely on topic, I just didn't find it interesting enough to elaborate on [what I see as] an obvious answer.