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  1. #1
    Halbard's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Concerning Portugal

    I am an avid player of this mod, and the faction i have played most is Portugal, and, altough i like the game alot, i find some flaws in the Portuguese Faction.

    Firstly: Units.

    Jinetes aren't a very realistic unit in the Portuguese military history.
    there should be a portuguese-unique heavy cavalry named Lusitanian Knights. The Lusitano is a breed of horse, known for its exceptional bravery, agility and intelligence, and used mainly for bullfighting and war.
    Therefore, it would be heavy cavalry that would be extremely hard to rout.

    Other thing, is the javelineers. i like them, altough they should be renamed to Caçadores, its a more realistic name.

    For now, its all, i shall post new things here tomorrow (late atm)

    make your comments if you played portugal, give your opinions

  2. #2

    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    I believe it all comes down to the number of units in the game. I think I read somewhere that KK had maxed out the units and that's why some factions share things. Yes, it'd be nice to have more faction-specific units, but we are limited by the engine.
    I'm currently playing as England, and after hammering the Scots the Pope went medieval on my ass and booted me out of the God club. Next thing I know, I have dirty foreigners landing on my shores from wierd and far-flung countries. - Sargon_of_Akkad

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Quote Originally Posted by Sokar Rostau View Post
    I believe it all comes down to the number of units in the game. I think I read somewhere that KK had maxed out the units and that's why some factions share things. Yes, it'd be nice to have more faction-specific units, but we are limited by the engine.
    I meant, replace the units. i dont know much about the game engine, but couldnt it be done?

  4. #4

    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Quote Originally Posted by Halbard View Post
    I meant, replace the units. i dont know much about the game engine, but couldnt it be done?
    AFAIK it could only be done at the expense of another faction losing unique units. I may be wrong, of course, and there might still be room for more units in the game, but if I'm right, and the unit limit has already been reached, you can't just replace one unit with another without there being an impact elsewhere. Even such an apparently minor change to the roster as changing the name of Jinetes to Portuguese Jinetes is actually creating a whole new unit, even if Portuguese Jinetes are identical in every way to Jinetes, and you would have to lose a unit elsewhere, either in Portugal or another faction, to make room for them.

    EDIT: And the same goes for regions - there is a limit to how many regions there can be on the map and that limit has already been reached. In order to add a new region to Iberia you would have to lose a region somewhere else.
    I'm currently playing as England, and after hammering the Scots the Pope went medieval on my ass and booted me out of the God club. Next thing I know, I have dirty foreigners landing on my shores from wierd and far-flung countries. - Sargon_of_Akkad

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Quote Originally Posted by Sokar Rostau View Post
    AFAIK it could only be done at the expense of another faction losing unique units. I may be wrong, of course, and there might still be room for more units in the game, but if I'm right, and the unit limit has already been reached, you can't just replace one unit with another without there being an impact elsewhere. Even such an apparently minor change to the roster as changing the name of Jinetes to Portuguese Jinetes is actually creating a whole new unit, even if Portuguese Jinetes are identical in every way to Jinetes, and you would have to lose a unit elsewhere, either in Portugal or another faction, to make room for them.

    EDIT: And the same goes for regions - there is a limit to how many regions there can be on the map and that limit has already been reached. In order to add a new region to Iberia you would have to lose a region somewhere else.

    You are right. Jinetes/Ginetes are the same to Portugal/Castille and Leon/Moors, it's not a unique unit for Portugal
    Vencerei não só estes adversários mas quantos a meu Rei forem contrários

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  6. #6

    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    You'll probably think me harsh on the Portugese, but I'd advocate their removal (as they were a Spanish fief in 1100) and replacement by Sweden or Armenia...
    ...ceterum autem censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Agree. I played Portugal a lot but Castile and Aragon are enough.

  8. #8
    Halbard's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Portugal was a near independent fief since about 858.
    And if you talk about unrealistic, The Knights Templar were only created in 1129.
    Also, read this

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condado_de_Portucale
    Last edited by Halbard; October 04, 2009 at 08:11 AM.

  9. #9
    PedroL's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Quote Originally Posted by Halbard View Post
    Portugal was a near independent fief since about 858.
    And if you talk about unrealistic, The Knights Templar were only created in 1129.
    Also, read this

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condado_de_Portucale
    Portucale were a County (County of Portucale) but that's other stories.

    The templars Knights came to Portucale in 1128
    Vencerei não só estes adversários mas quantos a meu Rei forem contrários

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  10. #10

    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Quote Originally Posted by Halbard View Post
    Portugal was a near independent fief since about 858.
    And if you talk about unrealistic, The Knights Templar were only created in 1129.
    Also, read this

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condado_de_Portucale
    Quote Originally Posted by Wikipedia
    t was founded in 868, during the Reconquista (the Christian reconquest of the Iberian peninsula from Muslim and Moorish domination) as a fiefdom of the Kingdom of Asturias, by count Vímara Peres.
    I'm not keen on the Templars as a faction either, Crusader States is fine.
    ...ceterum autem censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    County Portucalense

    There must not get confused the County Portucalense concession of two territories of Inhabitant of Coimbra and of Portucale to a count D. Henry with the county of Portucale, which began to exist from the dam of Vímara Peres, extended by his descendants though not always according to a lineage completed even to the death of the last count, in the battle of Stony one, in 1071, which was trying to get bigger autonomy face to Garcia II of the Galiza, who was governing the Kingdom of the Galiza and Portugal of his father, Fernando Magno.

    BLOOD LINE

    Counts of Portucale: the house of Vímara Peres

    They were counts of the house of Vímara Peres (not always in straight line, but resorting sometimes to the succession congnática):


    Vímara Peres (c. 868-873)
    Lucídio Vimaranes (son of the precedent - 873-?)
    Onega Lucides (daughter of the precedent) ∞ Diogo Fernandes (? - before 924)
    Mumadona Day (daughter of the precedents) ∞ (926) Hermenegildo Gonçalves (also called Mendo Gonçalves, son of the count Gonçalo Afonso Betote)
    Gonçalo Mendes (son of the precedents) (c. 950-999; in 997 magnus is entitled dux portucalensium)
    Mendo Gonçalves (son [or grandson?] of the precedent) (999-1008) ∞ Tutadona Moniz
    Odd Alvito (descendant of Vímara Peres, married with the condesa Tutadona Moniz) (1008-1015)
    Ilduara Mendes (daughter of Mendo Gonçalves) ∞ Nuno Alvites (son of the precedent) (1017-1028)
    Odd Mendo (1028-1050)
    Nuno Mendes (1050-1071) - last count of the family of Vímara Peres; when Garcia da Galiza was defeated by the king in the battle of Stony one.

    HISTORY

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    COUNTY PORTUCALENSE

    There was, in the current territory of Portugal, along the process of reconquest, two Counties Portucalenses or Counties of different Portucale: a first one established by Vímara Peres after the dam of Portucale (Oporto) on 868 and incorporated in the kingdom of the Galiza in 1071, after the death of the count Nuno Mendes (and what though enjoying certain autonomy, it always constituted a dependence of the kingdom of the Astúrias/Leão/Galiza), being perceptibly equivalent to a current Douro e-Minho douro e-minho Douro e-Minho Entre-Minho). A second, constituted c. 1095 in fee of the king Afonso VI of Lion and Castela and when which vein to help it in the Reconquest of lands to the Moors, having received also the hand of his daughter Teresa de Leão was offered to Henry of Borgonha, a burguinhão. This last county was much bigger in extension, since it was comprising also the territories of the ancient county of Inhabitant of Coimbra, abolished in 1091, you leave of Them Behind The Hills and still of the South of the Galiza (chiefly of the diocese of Tui). Of noticing which County is a generic term for much bigger in extension, since it was comprising also the territories of the ancient county of Inhabitant of Coimbra, abolished in 1091, you leave of Them Behind The Hills and still of the South of the Galiza (chiefly of the diocese of Tui). Of noticing which County is a generic term to designate the Territory Portucalense, since his chiefs were alternatively entitled Committee (count), Dux (duke) or Princeps (Prince).

    For a question of comfort, to allude if - á along this article to the first county portucalense like County of Portucale, and to a second one as County Portucalense, given they been this the most established expressions.

    HISTORY

    The name of the county comes from the toponym Portucale, with which from the century IX there was designated a city situated near to the mouth of river of the Douro, designated of PORTVS CONCEAL - Cale's Oporto, which judges to be a hybrid name formed by a Latin term (PORTVS, port) and another Greek (καλός [kalós], in other words, perfection), from where any thing as Beautiful Oporto; others express others opinion what It Conceals comes from the tribe that would live in the region in the times Roman-daily pay.

    It dates so of this period the expression land portucalense or province portucalense to designate a different territory that was limited to the north on the ground bracarense, and to the south for the river Vouga, that it took as a centre and leader to village of Portucale.

    In the century I a.c. the “ Histories of Salustio ” tell one “ Conceal civitas ” located in the Gallaecia; Conceal that she would have been also conquered by Perpena; in the century IV, in the “ Itinerary of Antonino ”, talk to him about a village called of Cale or Conceal; in the century V, Idácio of Keys writes on a “ Portucale castrum ”.

    PORTUCALE

    Though the existence of the village in the mouth of river of the Douro during the Roman period is confirmed, the same thing does not happen for his right location; the Parochial Suévico of Saint Martinho de Dume, studied by Pierre David after his identification for the Prof. Avelino de Jesus of the Coast, refers, some centuries later, to a village that it was designating like PORTVCALE CASTRVM ANTIQVVM, in the left edge, and other, the PORTVCALE CASTRVM NOVVM, in the right hand.

    When of the power of the Suevos, Portucale was a stage of several events, telling to him between them the imprisonment of Requiário during the invasion of Teodorico (457), the revolt of his governor Agiulfo, who claimed to be acclaimed king and it was executed, and the last battle (585) of Andeca, last king suevo, won by Leovigildo.

    When of the Muslim invasion of the Iberian Peninsula, Portucale was already, from the second half of the century VI, the thirst of the diocese Portucalense, situated in the province of the Galécia, and taking the bishop of Shackle as a metropolitan prelate. After the invasion, the diocese did not survive, having been restored only after the reconquest of Oporto, in 868.


    COUNTS OF PORTUCALE: THE HOUSE OF VÍMARA PERES

    They were counts of the house of Vímara Peres (not always in straight line, but resorting sometimes to the succession congnática):


    Vímara Peres (c. 868-873)
    Lucídio Vimaranes (son of the precedent - 873-?)
    Onega Lucides (daughter of the precedent) ∞ Diogo Fernandes (? - before 924)
    Mumadona Day (daughter of the precedents) ∞ (926) Hermenegildo Gonçalves (also called Mendo Gonçalves, son of the count Gonçalo Afonso Betote)
    Gonçalo Mendes (son of the precedents) (c. 950-999; in 997 magnus is entitled dux portucalensium)
    Mendo Gonçalves (son [or grandson?] of the precedent) (999-1008) ∞ Tutadona Moniz
    Odd Alvito (descendant of Vímara Peres, married with the condesa Tutadona Moniz) (1008-1015)
    Ilduara Mendes (daughter of Mendo Gonçalves) ∞ Nuno Alvites (son of the precedent) (1017-1028)
    Odd Mendo (1028-1050)
    Nuno Mendes (1050-1071) - last count of the family of Vímara Peres; when Garcia da Galiza was defeated by the king in the battle of Stony one.


    COUNTY PORTUCALENSE


    It is not necessary to confuse the County Portucalense — concession of two territories of Inhabitant of Coimbra and of Portucale to a count D. Henry — with the county of Portucale, which began to exist from the dam of Vímara Peres, extended by his descendants — though not always according to a perfect lineage — even to the death of a last count, in the battle of Stony one, in 1071, which was trying to get bigger autonomy face to Garcia II of the Galiza, who was governing the Kingdom of the Galiza and Portugal of his father, Fernando Magno.

    However, the atrofiamento of the county of Inhabitant of Coimbra, created in 878, me them abolished with the conquest of the city for Almançor in the end of the century X, allowed the northern supremacy, which not even the reconstitution of an authority equivalent to that of the count — in aid of Sesnando Davides, in 1064, and extended even to his death, in 1092 — it could obstruct.

    Meantime, the ambition of Lion's Afonso VI and Castela reconstituted again the unity of the paternal States and, when Garcia died again, after prisoner, in 1091, the territories in his possession passed for the hands of Raimundo de Borgonha, married with D. Urraca. At this point, the energy of the attacks Almorávidas was recommending the distribution of the military powers, better to reinforce the territory: a command in the central zone handed to a king himself Afonso VI, other, not official practised by El Cid in Valency, and the third thing the west handed to Raimundo; last East did not manage to defend efficiently the line of the Tagus — having already lost Lisbon, which had been given up to the Leoneses by the king staff of Badajoz, together with Santarem, which was also ready falling in the hands of the Almorávidas — and this will be one of the reasons that attribute some modern historians to the decision taken for Afonso VI [2] of reinforcing still more the military western defense, dividing in two to zone attributed initially to Raimundo, handing most exposed to Henry of Borgonha.

    The count D. Henry supported by the political interests introduces clunicenses ambiciosamente in the politics of the Kingdom, conquering power next to the parliament. Seeing myself in the subordinates' condition to a king, the counts or governors had spacious administrative, judicial and military powers, and his thought was getting his bearings, naturally, for the acquisition of a complete autonomy when, in the Portuguese case, the conditions they him were favorable.

    In order to increase the population and value his territory, D. Henry gave foral and did town (it established a new village) in several lands, between them Guimarães, in which it did citizens' town, when his compatriots are attracting there, with several privileges, many francs.

    In Guimarães D. Henry fixed his dwelling, in own palaces, inside the castle that there had been built in the previous century. When the count died D. Henry (1112), it passes the widow of this D. Teresa, governing the county during the under-age status of his son Afonso Henriques.

    D. Teresa begins (1121) when « Queen « is entitled, but the conflicts with the high clergy and especially the intimacy with Fernão Peres, Galician nobleman to the one who had had handed over the government of the districts of Oporto and Inhabitant of Coimbra, they brought him the revolt of the Portucalenses and of the son himself, systematically remote, for strangers, of the management of the public business.

    To fourteen years of age (1125), the young person Afonso Henriques arms himself to you rider himself – according to the custom of the kings – becoming so an independent warrior.

    In 1128, there is locked the Battle of Saint Mamede (Guimarães) between the supporters of the prince Afonso and those of his mother. This one is won, D. Afonso Henriques takes care the county and from him it is going to do the kingdom of Portugal.

    Fighting against the Lion's Christians and Castela and the Muslims, Afonso Henriques got an important victory against the Moors in the Battle of Ourique, in 1139, and declared the independence. Afonso I de Borgonha (Afonso Henriques) was born, so, in 1139, the Kingdom of Portugal and his first dynasty, with the king.


    COUNTS PORTUCALENSES: HOUSE OF THE BORGONHA



    Henry da Borgonha (1095 - 1112)
    Teresa de Leão (1112 - 1128)
    Afonso Henriques (1128 - 1139, with the title of dux)



    Maybe now you understand.

    The county of Portucale exist in two different times.

    First with the count Vimara Peres and Second with The Count Henrique.

    The County of Portucale always aspire to be independent. They always wanted the independencia up to which they got with the reign of D. afonso Henriques.
    Portugal was always a different region from others of the Iberian Peninsula.


    FAMILY TREE OF THE COUNTY OF PORTUCALE.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 




    This is a list Chronologically of the First Couty of Portucale and the Second County of Portucale
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    First County of Portugal
    (Séc. IX to the Séc. XI)

    SEC IX

    868 the count Vímara Peres proclaims the county of Portucale (Portugal) fee of the kingdom of the Astúrias
    868 Vímara Peres establishes the town of Vimaranis (Guimarães)
    868 Vímara Peres takes Oporto to the Moors
    871 The Christians retake Inhabitant of Coimbra and Hermengildo Mendes is proclaimed count of Inhabitant of Coimbra
    873 Vímara Peres dies and his son Lucídio Vimaranes receives the title of 1st Count of Portucale
    878 inhabitant of Coimbra is annexed to the Kingdom of the Astúrias and governed by Hermenegildo Mendes
    888 civil war spreads in the whole Iberian Peninsula

    Séc. X--

    909 Afonso III of the Astúrias is dismissed and at the same time when Emperor of the Ibéria was proclaimed
    910 Afonso III dies and his three children divide the kingdom in three provinces, Astúrias, Galiza and Lion. Ordonho becomes II King of the provinces of the Galiza and Lion (910-924); Lucídio Vimaranes receives the Count's title of Portucale
    915 period of severe drought gives rise to shortage of foods in the whole Iberian Peninsula
    924 Fruela II is crowned Lion's king
    925 Sancho Ordonhes becomes a vassal of the Kingdom of the Galiza
    925 Ramiro II establishes residence in Viseu
    926 Mendo Gonçalves (when was also known as Hermenegildo Gonçalves, son of the count Gonçalo da Galiza, he marries with Mumadona Dias (daughter of Onega Lucides and Diogo Fernandes), and it receives the title of first Count of Portucale
    928 Gonçalo Moniz receives the Count's title of Inhabitant of Coimbra
    929 Afonso IV is crowned Lion's King
    930 Ramiro II is proclaimed Lion's King (930-950) and it concentrates on Viseu
    938 first written with reference Portugal and not Portucale
    946 the County of Castela becomes independent
    950 the Countess Mumadona divides his vast inheritance for his children
    950 Gonçalo Mendes receives the Count's title of Portugal
    950 Ordonho III is crowned Lion's King
    953 attack massivo from the Moors to the Galiza
    955 Ordonho III attacks Lisbon
    955 the Moors retake Inhabitant of Coimbra and oblige the retreat of the Christian army for there of the Rio I gild
    956 Sancho I is crowned Lion's King
    959 the countess Mumadona donates a vast part of his properties to the Monastery of Our Lady of the Olive tree (Guimarães)
    966 Normans' attack her Hiss
    966 revolt of Gonçalo Moniz of Inhabitant of Coimbra against Sancho I of Lion
    971 New attack Viking to the Galiza
    987 al-Mansul Ibn Abi Aamir takes Inhabitant of Coimbra and a great deal of the castles I Gild the north of the Rio. March on Santiago of Compostela and it destroys the city and the Church of Santiago
    997 Gonçalo Mendes adopts the title of Grand-Duque of Portugal and fights against Bermudo II of Lion and is defeated in the battle
    999 Mendo Gonçalves II receives the title of 2nd Count of Portugal

    Séc. XI--

    1003 the Muslim army destroys the Lion's city
    1008 Alvito Nunes receives the title of 4th Count of Portugal
    1009 the Staff of Badajoz is declared independently of Córdova and governs an area understood between Inhabitant of Coimbra and the High Alentejo
    1016 Norman invaders raise along the Rio Minho and destroiem Tuy in the Galiza
    Marriage of Ilduara Mendes with Nuno Alvites 5th Count of Portugal
    1018 the Algarve becomes a dependent county of Córdova
    1022 Lisbon becomes a county independent of Córdova, but it is posteriomente annexed the Badajoz
    1028 Mendes Nunes receives the title of 6th Count of Portugal
    1028 Alfonso V of the Astúrias and Lion does siege to Viseu and is killed by an arrow
    1034 Sancho III of Navarra entitles " Rex Hispanarum " (King of all the Espanhas)
    1034 Gonçalo Trastemires takes the Castle of Montemor
    1040 hiss it becomes a dependent kingdom of Córdova
    1042 Abu Amr Abbad Ben Mohammed is nominated Emir of Seville (1042-1068)
    1050 Nuno Mendes receives the title of 7th Count of Portugal and last in the line of succession of the House of Vímara Peres
    1051 The kingdom of the Algarve is annexed to the kingdom of Seville
    1056 I begin of the Dynasty Almorávida in Africa
    1057 Fernando I de Castela and Lion takes Lamego, Seia and Viseu
    1058 Fernando I de Castela and Lion takes Viseu
    1058 Al-Muzaffar pays al-ulcers to the Christians for leaving the kingdom of Badajoz
    1060 Ecumenical council of Santiago of Compostela (1060-1063)
    1063 the kingdom of Hiss that it is annexed to the kingdom of Seville
    1064 Fernando I de Castela and Lion takes Inhabitant of Coimbra and Sisnando Davides receives the Count's title of Inhabitant of Coimbra
    1064 the Hispanic Calendar is adopted
    1064 the Count Sisnando merge in Inhabitant of Coimbra the first official school in Portugal
    1065 Sancho II when King of Castela and Lion (1065-1072) was proclaimed
    1065 Sancho I (Ramirez) when King of Aragão (1065-1094) was proclaimed
    1065 Garcia II of the Galiza (1065-1072), proclaims the independence of the kingdom of the Galiza and Portugal
    1068 Abu l-Hasim Mohammed II is nominated Emir of Seville (1068-1091)
    1070 S. Fructuoso de Dumes is nominated Bishop of Shackle
    1070 Nuno Mendes revolts against Garcia II of the Galiza and demands the independence and the King's title of Portugal
    1071 Battle of the Stony one - The Count Nuno Mendes is defeated and killed in the battle locked with Garcia II of the Galiza
    1072 Afonso VI of Castela robs Garcia II of the Galiza of the whole his power and kingdom
    1075 The begining of the construction of the Cathedral of Santiago of Compostela



    Second County of Portugal
    (Séc. XI to the Séc. XII)


    Séc. XI--


    1077 Afonso VI of Castela autoproclama-se Emperor of " All Spain "
    1080 count Sesnando Davides of the County of Inhabitant of Coimbra takes part in an invasion to Grenada
    1085 foundation in Portugal of the Benedictine Order of Cluny (1086-1096)
    1086 battle of Zallaca - Defeat of D. Afonso IV for the Moors helped by the Almorávidas, in Badajoz
    1086 Raimundo de Borgonha comes for the first time to the Iberian Peninsula to accompany the Duke Eudo I and to help in the combat to the Moors
    1090 Raimundo de Borgonha returns to the Iberian Peninsula accompanied by his cousin Henry de Borgonha
    1091 Raimundo de Borgonha marries with Lady Urraca adopts of Afonso VI of Castela
    1093 Henry de Borgonha when governor of the County of Portucale was nominated under the suserania of D. Raimundo
    1094 Henry de Borgonha marries with Lion's D.Teresa (illegitimate child of Afonso VI)
    1094 Afonso VI grants to Henry the control of the territories of Portucale and Inhabitant of Coimbra
    1094 crab ibn Abi Bakr with the support of the strength Almorávidas captures Badajoz and Lisbon
    1095 D. Henry de Borgonha gets total autonomy for the County Portucalense
    1095 strength Almorávidas takes Santarem
    1097 Afonso IV of Castela offers the County of Portucale his daughter D.Teresa

    Séc. XII--

    1102 Diego Gemírez Bispo of Santiago of Compostela attacks Dumes and transfers the relics of S. Vitor and of S. Fructuoso for Santiago of Compostela
    1103 D. Teresa governs the county with the help of Soeiro Mendes aquando of the travels of D. Henry the Rome and Jerusalem
    1105 the tribes Almóadas and his anti Christianity were spread by the whole Penisula Ibérica
    1107 D. Raimundo de Borgonha dies and the kingdom of the Galiza is inherited by his son Afonso Raimundes
    1108 birth of Afonso Henriques to 25 of July - (son of the Count D.Henrique de Borgonha and D. Teresa de Leão)
    1109 die - daughter sweats Afonso VI of Castela D. Urraca only in the line sucessória, takes the Lion's throne and Castela and house in second nuptials with Afonso I of Aragão
    1110 the Count D. Henry does siege to Afonso de Aragão in Penafiel
    1110 D.Henrique takes the defense of the sister-in-law D. Urraca of Castela against Afonso I of Aragão
    1111 Lisbon and Santarem are taken for the Almorávidas led by Crab ibn Abi Bakr
    1111 conference of Palência - Promise of D. Urraca of Castela in distributing the States with his sister D. Teresa and the Count D. Henry
    1111 D. Henry feels betrayed by the bad faith of D. Urraca of Castela and for Afonso I of Aragão and it encloses them in Sahagún helped by the party of Afonso Raimundes
    1111 D. Henry grants a foral to Inhabitant of Coimbra who was the first one to establish the rights and obligations of the municipes
    1111 D. Henry takes Santarem to the Moors
    1111 proclamation not recognized of Afonso Raimundes of the Galiza as Afonso VII King of Castela and Lion
    1112 death of the Count D. Henry - For under-age status of the heir Afonso Henriques his mother D. Teresa de Leão assumes the government of the County Portucalense
    1114 cancellation of the marriage between D. Urraca of Castela and his cousin Afonso I de Aragão
    1114 Indepêndencia of the Staffs of Beja and Evora of the power of Seville
    1116 Teresa de Leão and Portugal enters at war against D. Urraca of Castela
    1117 inhabitant of Coimbra is taken for the Almorávidas led by Emir Ali ibn Yusuf
    1120 Afonso Henriques disposes of the support of the Bishop Shackle against his mother Teresa and the Count Fernando Peres of Restraint of the Galiza
    1121 The army of Afonso Raimundes of the Galiza is with it of his mother D. Urraca of Castela in Portugal and they capture D.Teresa in Lanhoso - free it after this one brings into line what the County of Portucale was turning for the suserania of the Lion's Kingdom
    1124 Afonso Henriques to 14 years arms himself Rider in the Cathedral of Zamora
    1126 for death of D. Urraca of Castela his son Afonso Raimundes da Galiza is proclaimed king Afonso VII of Castela and Lion
    1127 D. Teresa donates the Willow to the Order of Cluny
    1127 Afonso VII of Castela invades Portugal and enclose Guimarães - The rider Egas Moniz de Ribadouro convinces Afonso VII of the loyalty of Afonso Henriques for with the kingdoms of Castela and Lion
    1128 it battles of S. Mamede - Afonso Henriques defeats the army of his mother to 24 of July and and takes the total control of the County and is acclaimed by the subjects like Duke of Portugal
    1128 foundation in Portugal of the religious and military order of the Templários


    I hope this will help.
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  12. #12

    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Quote Originally Posted by Halbard View Post
    And if you talk about unrealistic, The Knights Templar were only created in 1129.
    that's strange because even after than date, it will still never offer me chapter houses

  13. #13
    PedroL's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Quote Originally Posted by Badg3r View Post
    that's strange because even after than date, it will still never offer me chapter houses
    In SS, Portugal and Castille and Leon the only Military Orders is the Order of Santiago.
    For the Aragon is the Order of Montesa.
    Last edited by PedroL; October 04, 2009 at 03:38 PM.
    Vencerei não só estes adversários mas quantos a meu Rei forem contrários

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  14. #14
    PedroL's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Quote Originally Posted by M.P.C.U. View Post
    You'll probably think me harsh on the Portugese, but I'd advocate their removal (as they were a Spanish fief in 1100) and replacement by Sweden or Armenia...
    Sorry but you dont know anything about Portugal History, and the importance to the Europe and to the world, but that's another story.

    MAPS of Iberia (some of them I have a lot)
    Portugal were a County until they became a Kingdom) and they always were a vassal until they the county was gibven to the dauther of the King Of Castille (the daughter was the mother of our firts King) D. Afonso Henriques I (King of Portugal).
    If you people want I can give a full History of IBERIA.

    MAP
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 






    1190



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  15. #15
    PedroL's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Quote Originally Posted by Halbard View Post
    I am an avid player of this mod, and the faction i have played most is Portugal, and, altough i like the game alot, i find some flaws in the Portuguese Faction.

    Firstly: Units.

    Jinetes aren't a very realistic unit in the Portuguese military history.
    there should be a portuguese-unique heavy cavalry named Lusitanian Knights. The Lusitano is a breed of horse, known for its exceptional bravery, agility and intelligence, and used mainly for bullfighting and war.
    Therefore, it would be heavy cavalry that would be extremely hard to rout.

    Other thing, is the javelineers. i like them, altough they should be renamed to Caçadores, its a more realistic name.

    For now, its all, i shall post new things here tomorrow (late atm)

    make your comments if you played portugal, give your opinions
    Sorry but the jinetes (portuguese name) or Ginetes (spanish name) were part of Portuguese Army. Just like they were part of the Castillian/Leon and the Moorish, but not Aragon.

    The other unit that belong to the Portuguese army were the Vilan Knights (Cavaleiros Vilões)/Militia Knight.

    Here this is an example of the Portuguese Roster that i made to FTW. the time line is 1080-1385

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Infantary:

    -Militia Lancers or Militia Spearmen (Light "leather" armor and Spear) - In City's/Villages/Castles/Forts

    -Lancers (Armor, spear and sword) - In Castles/Forts
    (Sergeant Spearmen)

    -Armoured Lancers (Armor (+), spear and shield) - In Castles and Cities
    (Armoured Sergeant Spearmen can make shield wall)

    -Militia Halberdiers (light Armor)

    -Portuguese Pikemen (Heavy Infantary - Armor and Pike)
    Can make a solid rectangular Phalanx Formation

    -Dismounted Portuguese Knight (light infantary - Armor, shield and mace or sword)

    - Militia Swordsman


    -Aventuros “Portuguese Unit” -
    Elite (Heavy Infantary- Armor "Plate", Pike, Shield, Sword) - Require Exploration Guild (only in Africa) "they were the veterans of the Wars in Africa" Can make a solid rectangular Phalanx Formation

    -Dismouted Knigth Templars -
    Elite (Heavy Infantary - Armor, Shield and Sword)
    Portuguese Templars since 1128 until 1319

    -Dismouted Knight of Christ “Portuguese Unit
    - Military Order of Christ” (replace the templer order in 15 March of 1319) - Elite (Heavy Infantary - Armor and Axe and Shield) – Require Guild of the Naval Order of Christ
    History
    Founded in 1318, the Military Order of Christ (previously Real Ordem dos Cavaleiros de Nosso Senhor Jesus Cristo) was the heritage of the Knights Templar in Portugal, after the suppression of the Templars in 1312.

    -Dismouted Knights of Avis - Elite (Heavy Infantary - Armor, Shield, and mace or War hammer or War Axe) - 1162

    - Dismounted Knight of Santiago - 1171


    Shooters:

    -Militia Archers

    -Mercenary English Longbowman (The longest and Old alliance) - Require Some Kind of Diplomatic Guild, only when Portugal and England be allied

    England had the most and best ones, longbowmen who could shoot armor-piercing arrows a long distance, while ordinary bowmen neither had the range nor armor-piercing power of a longbow. The combined arms organization of longbowmen (who could plant stakes to deter cavalry charges)

    -Militia Crossbowman
    (Light Armor, Crossbow)
    Citys/Villages

    -Militia Crossbowman (Light Armor, Crossbow and dagger)
    Castle/Forts

    -Besteiros de Conto – Elite "portuguese Unit" (Armor, Crossbow and sword)

    - Pavesse Crossbow


    Cavalary:

    -Jinetes or Ginetes - Light Cavalary (light armor, Javelins, sword and shield)

    - Vilan Knight (portuguese 'cavaleiro vilão') or Militia Knights (Armor, Shield, Lance and sword)

    - Feudal Knights

    - Portuguese Knights
    “Veterans knights” (Heavy Armor “Plate”, Lance, Shield, Sword)

    - Besteiros Reais
    (King Royal Mounted Crossbow Guard) – Elite (Armor “plate”, Crossbow, and sword)

    - Knights Templar – Elite (Heavy Armor, Lance, Sword, Shield) - (1128-1319)

    - Knigth of Avis – Elite “Portuguese Unit” (Heavy Armor, Lance, shield and War Axe) - 1162

    - Knights of Christ “Portuguese Unit” (replace the templer order in 15 March of 1319) - Elite (Heavy Armor, lance, Sword and shield) –Require Guild of the Naval Order of Christ

    - knights of Santiago – Elite (Heavy Armor, lance, sword and shield). - 1171


    Auxilary Troops

    - Almughavars (Mercenary Javelinman)

    - Mercenary Man-at-arms

    - Muslim Archers


    -Galician Mercenary Crosbowman

    -Mozarabex Cristian Soldiers

    - Crusader Knights

    - Crusader Sergeant Spearmen

    - Crusader Crossbowmen



    Vencerei não só estes adversários mas quantos a meu Rei forem contrários

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  16. #16
    Halbard's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    nice list there. i was going to make one, but was going through my books first, to see if something useful would come up.
    i like the idea of the longbowmen.
    Maybe change the name of Portuguese Pikeman to Portugese Infantes, would sound better, in my opinion.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Quote Originally Posted by PedroL View Post
    Sorry but the jinetes (portuguese name) or Ginetes (spanish name)

    Pedro in spanish is "Jinete" too xDDD the same!
    "TU REGERE IMPERIO FLUCTUS HISPANE MEMENTO"

    -Recuerda España, que tú registe el imperio de los mares.

  18. #18
    PedroL's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Quote Originally Posted by Conquistador_88 View Post
    Pedro in spanish is "Jinete" too xDDD the same!
    sorry is the other way
    Portuguese ginetes
    Spanish Jinetes
    Sorry and thanks
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  19. #19

    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    I'm not disrespecting Portugal, I just think there are other, more important factions, that don't have a slot at the moment.
    ...ceterum autem censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

  20. #20
    Halbard's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: Concerning Portugal

    Quote Originally Posted by M.P.C.U. View Post
    I'm not disrespecting Portugal, I just think there are other, more important factions, that don't have a slot at the moment.
    You say Sweden or Armenia are more important than portugal?

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