New factions in BC?

[wudang_clown]

I would like to open a thread in which honourable BC players could post their ideas on what factions they would like to see in next BC releases and why, and discuss them. It would be nice if devs had lurked here sometimes and approve or deny the ideas.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Please, everyone, keep the original cultural scope of Broken Crescent - no Middle Earth or Norway here, please.

And there is what to talk about: the factions limit is 31. Currently there are 19 factions in BC, playable and unplayable. Also, AFAIK, there are ~400 units that we can use on the battlefield. And there is the limit of 500 in M2TW. So, there is a big reserve to fill. Let's fill it then with our, players, opinions and ideas in the particular matter - that's what we can do. The rest depends on venerable devs.

So, recently we have had Atabeg of Azerbaijan and Shirvan Shahdom on the carpet. What about Zengids, Artuqids and Alania? These are examples of what factions could be implemented, IMO. Next, a month or two ago someone (I'm sorry, I don't remember, who) have opted for Yemen.

What's your ideas, friends?

[knight of virtue and valor]

the rus or one of the subkindoms thereof? I mean, the units if Russicha are kick ass. they really arent to far from the map.

[Nakharar]

I agree

The areas that are most empty(eg: you can expect 20 turns fight rebels only) are Oman and Kypchaks so why not fix them up?

I think India is too packed, however Central Asia.. the land between Khwarezm, Seljuks and Ghazni and Oman is a bit empty.

But i am in support of a Russian Faction in kiev or Novogrod(expanding north) and also a similar Kpychak faction like Alania as you said.

Aswell as Yemen. But if i had to choose 1 i would say

Russian Faction

then

Alania

then

Yemen.

I always regarded Arabia and the North as empty spots, Oman never had a huge effect on anyone, and Arabia never did either. The North was always empty Kypchaks never became the Seljuks of the North and playing them is incredibly boring for the first fewturns and the only option is to advance south...

[Borgoroth]

Would be fun to have a faction that has 1 city, surrounded by as little rebels as possible, preferably other factions only and starting with few troops. I'm no expert in factions in this area but I think Zingids (or is it Zengids as you wrote?) was around the Mosul area, though surrounded by rebel settlements it would put them in the middle of everything and prove a real challange.

I'd love the challange of such a weak faction and I'm sure many would aswell.

[wudang_clown]

Would be fun to have a faction that has 1 city, surrounded by as little rebels as possible, preferably other factions only and starting with few troops. I'm no expert in factions in this area but I think Zingids (or is it Zengids as you wrote?) was around the Mosul area, though surrounded by rebel settlements it would put them in the middle of everything and prove a real challange.

I'd love the challange of such a weak faction and I'm sure many would aswell.

That's what I'm thinking about! A faction with one or two settlements, few garrison troops and full field stack of decent companies with upkeep so high that it is necessary to go on war with someone, and early fighting with other faction inevitable.

[Nakharar]

you must remember BC wasnt made for a challenge, its not like there arent just as many chalenging mods... A Zingid faction could be done by man as a submod, adding a faction then, giving them units etc etc

[wudang_clown]

I guess you know that submods for BC are disallowed. I'm not sure I understand you saying that BC wasn't created for a challenge. Then what for? I play for challenge and I find it in BC. You don't want a challenge, you play on easy or medium. There's no problem at all. And I don't think it could be an argument against introducing a new, small and challenging, or small and boring, faction.

[Borgoroth]

Agreed in fully, two reasons I gave up vanilla and googled for mods in the first place, 1: where's the horse archers?! 2: where's the challange?!

[ALFAJI]

i see that you make the Bani Hilal tribe as an horde faction or let's call it the badoo tribes
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taghribat_Bani_Hilal
or the Tibet is an good idea
but i wish that bc work to do this map

[wudang_clown]

but i wish that bc work to do this map

Well, I guess it would be 'Broken Mod' then instead of 'Broken Crescent'.

[ALFAJI]

Well, I guess it would be 'Broken Mod' then instead of 'Broken Crescent'.

no it won't be a broken mod and this map i but'ed it becuse we want to play the alndaluse faction's not the the europens
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=227269

[Kavhan Isbul]

I would also love to see the map expanded to include the Mediterranean all the way to Al Andalus, but I know it will not happen, ever.

Instead, it is still not unreasonable to hope for a small extennsion of the map to the North, and the break up of the giant steppe provinces into more regions. If this is done, then I would love to see Kievan Rus, maybe Ryazan as well, along with Volga Bulgaria and Kara Khitai.

This will not only add some important factions to the strategic map, but it will also finally make the unification of the steppes a difficult task, worthy of the reward. A Kievan Rus faction may also bring some much needed pressure on the ERE from the North, even if the two start with cordial relations in the beginning. Right now, the Kypchak expansion almost always goes through the Caucasus, with very little danger to Constantinople, and it would be nice to see this changed.

[Borgoroth]

@ALFAJI
Imagine playing some faction located at the Ivory coast, half way through the campaign a messenger runs up to you and with horror in his eyes you listen to the words: "Another faction is about to achieve world domination. The Khwarezem Shah."

[ALFAJI]

@ALFAJI
Imagine playing some faction located at the Ivory coast, half way through the campaign a messenger runs up to you and with horror in his eyes you listen to the words: "Another faction is about to achieve world domination. The Khwarezem Shah."

ya it would be cool

[Captain_Aramsham]

Another Crusader state(s).

Principality of Antioch and/or County of Tripoli.

Although you'd have to make sure it was sufficiently dissimilar to KoJ to make sure it didn't just feel like playing the same faction in a slightly different starting position (like Portugal/Spain in vanilla )

[Kavhan Isbul]

I was thinking about splitting the Seljuks in 3: Shirvanshah, Seljukids of Hamadan and Seljukids of Kerman. It can be potentially beneficial for the following reasons:
- It would be historically realistic, because these factions existed at the beginning of the mod time frame.
- The Seljuks will be a little weakened, to prevent them from being way too powerful for a fragmented Empire in decline, as they are now.
- The large and mostly empty Khorasan area will have a small power in it, to at least give a fight to its neighbors, as opposed to just rebels.

The downsides might be that the various Seljukids may be too weakened, allowing the Abbasids to turn into a superpower easily, which may mean that by fixing one problem, another one is created. And also, while Shirvanshah can have its own, somewaht unique Azeri roster, the other two Seljukids will be quite similar, plus the total number of Seljukid factions will now become 4, all of them having some recurring units. The Turcoman HAs Regular Bowmen come to mind or the Eastern Turcoman Horse Archers.

The question is, from a gaming standpoint, do the positives outweigh the negatives?

[The Noble Lord]

Very good idea my friend Wudang. The factions I would like to be included in BC are:

• County of Edessa
• Principality of Tripoli
• Kingdom of Antioch
• Seljuk Sultanate of Rum
• The Delhi Sultanate
• The Golden Horde
• The Mameluke Sultanate

[wudang_clown]

Very good idea my friend Wudang.

Thanks, Noble Lord!

I was thinking about splitting the Seljuks in 3: Shirvanshah, Seljukids of Hamadan and Seljukids of Kerman.

I totally support the idea. I was thinking about that, too. I wouldn't care for weakening the Seljuks, as they usually conquer much of the map, which is quite annoying and repeatable. Those new Seljukid states could have their money scripts when controlled by the AI to help them a bit to survive. Also, there could be some garrison script for them, so they couldn't be overwhelmed easily.

But foremost, to 'help' Seljukids and tame the Abbasids, I would additionally opt for making the Zengid faction with Mosul, Aleppo (taken by Salah ad-Din in 1183, so it could definitely be a Zengid settlement). and Edessa (it was conquered by Imad ad-Din Zengi in 1144, so it is rather impossible to include County of Edessa in BC, Noble Lord). Also, it is impossible to include Atruqids (what I've been proposing earlier). As an argument for Zengid faction I would say that it would be very justly to have a faction led by famous Nur ad-Din! I know he would live for two years only in the mod, but his state didn't collapsed by a day. Zengids ruled the Mosul until 1234 (funny date, BTW).

Also, what I was thinking was that it would be great to modify the victory conditions a bit. F.e. the main task for the Seljukids, including Sultanate of Rum, would be to unify again the lands of former Seljuk Empire. Accomplishing the task could trigger some great bonuses - but it is just general idea of mine, I'm not sure what those bonuses could be, as unification in itself would mean that the player came into power by taking many lands and became extremely rich because of the income alone...

Also, what do you think on introduction of Ottoman state, guys? I mean: Ottomans could appear after some conditions had been met by the Turkish Sultanate. We have still many faction slots for disposal, so maybe it would be beneficial for the gameplay to have Ottomans and janissaries later in game?

And what do you think on changing the current faction's names on native ones? Khwārezmšhāḥīān instead of The Khwarezm Shah, Imāmat ʿUmān instead of Imamate of Oman, Saljūqiyān-e Rūm (I'm not sure if it's the right name) instead of Turkish Sultanate, etc.?

[Atanamir]

Also, what do you think on introduction of Ottoman state, guys? I mean: Ottomans could appear after some conditions had been met by the Turkish Sultanate. We have still many faction slots for disposal, so maybe it would be beneficial for the gameplay to have Ottomans and janissaries later in game?

And what do you think on changing the current faction's names on native ones? Khwārezmšhāḥīān instead of The Khwarezm Shah, Imāmat ʿUmān instead of Imamate of Oman, Saljūqiyān-e Rūm (I'm not sure if it's the right name) instead of Turkish Sultanate, etc.?

Good ideas...like them..

[Boyar'sNephew]

And what do you think on changing the current faction's names on native ones? Khwārezmšhāḥīān instead of The Khwarezm Shah, Imāmat ʿUmān instead of Imamate of Oman, Saljūqiyān-e Rūm (I'm not sure if it's the right name) instead of Turkish Sultanate, etc.?

I prefer the names in English. Thats just me, but I like to actually be able to read the word out loud, instead of looking at it like its some sort of pictograph.

That is especially the case with unit names. I think the native names of factions and units (and their pronounciations) are great in the faction/unit descriptions, but not in the regular play. Thats just the opinion of an infrequent BC commentator, though. Take it as you will.