Why is "Dale" a faction?

**Warmaster Tibs** · August 20, 2009, 05:56 PM

I was wondering about Dale earlier. I was wondering why the men of the East( non Rhun but "Dale") are called Dale instead of Esgorath. Dale was destroyed by Smaug right? So even after a couple years to rebuild how would Dale get its population back and rival Esgoroth's? Bard was from Esgorath so why would he become king of Dale instead of being king of Esgorath and have Dale as a provance? Why is Dale so much more important then Esgorath when it was destroyed and had to be rebuilt?

Also what are the other towns Dale starts with? Where they just neighboring citys who joined "Dale"?

**Confederate Jeb** · August 20, 2009, 08:44 PM

Esgaroth is the capital in game, I believe.

**Theseus1234** · August 20, 2009, 08:49 PM

Originally Posted by Confederate Jeb

Esgaroth is the capital in game, I believe.

No, Dale is the capital, but Esgaroth is the second biggest city (...of the 4)

**Warmaster Tibs** · August 20, 2009, 09:18 PM

I havent changed the capital and Esgorath is the captial. Why is Dale the name of faction instead of Esgoroth?

**Louis Lux** · August 20, 2009, 09:18 PM

Esgaroth also had to be rebuilt after Smaug's attack and it was a small settlement. Dale I believe was a larger settlement and had more chance to grow and thrive because it was closer to the Dwarves.

**maxi90** · August 20, 2009, 09:33 PM

Dale was the clasic kingdom of the region.. and i think that it is said in the books that Bard became king of Dale. you could see it as a way of legitimise his position as the new ruler of the region:
"ok the dwarves have returned, and now i, being only heir of the old royal familly, will reconstruct the city of Dale, the ancien capital, and become the king", or something like that

it is something like what Aragorn did when he became King: he transfered the capital from Minas-Tirith to that old Numenorean city that he had resently rebuilt and which name i cannot recal

**Scorpion** · August 20, 2009, 10:04 PM

From the history of the Great War of the One Ring:

On March 17 of the year 3019 in the Third Age, Sauron sent a host of Easterlings to attack Dale. The combined forces of the Kingdom of Dale under King Brand and the Dwarves of the Lonely Mountain under King Dáin Ironfoot marched out to meet the Easterlings in battle. Sauron's forces were probably more numerous, though the armies of Dale and Erebor would have possessed an advantage due to their superior Dwarven-made weaponry. After three days of heavy close-quarters fighting, Brand and Dáin were forced to retreat to the Lonely Mountain. A few sturdy warriors led by Brand and Dáin fought bravely before the Gate of Erebor, which was not taken. Dáin was killed as he stood defending the body of his ally Brand. The defenders of the Mountain were now under siege.

The forces of Gondor and Rohan defeated the main power of Sauron in the southern theatre on March 25 and this caused the northern Easterling army to lose heart. Seeing the morale of their foes sapped the Army of Dale under the new Kings — Bard II and Thorin III Stonehelm — managed to lift the siege on March 27 and drove the Easterlings out of Dale.

As you can see, the title is King of Dale.

**Markgraf von Schellenberg** · August 20, 2009, 11:37 PM

kaBLAMo!
yes, King of Dale is correct. Its like the Kingdom of Italy kicking out the Pope so that it could have its capital at Rome: tradition, history, legitimacy, etc.

**Muffer Nl** · August 21, 2009, 01:40 AM

I was wondering about Dale earlier. I was wondering why the men of the East( non Rhun but "Dale") are called Dale instead of Esgorath. Dale was destroyed by Smaug right? So even after a couple years to rebuild how would Dale get its population back and rival Esgoroth's? Bard was from Esgorath so why would he become king of Dale instead of being king of Esgorath and have Dale as a provance? Why is Dale so much more important then Esgorath when it was destroyed and had to be rebuilt?

Also what are the other towns Dale starts with? Where they just neighboring citys who joined "Dale"?

When they speak in the council at Rivendell they talk about Dale and they say that it is a large kingdom in the North. The city's probably joined when Bard became king again./ Also when Dale was going to be rebuild a lot of people from Esgargoth left for Dale.

**Big Pacha** · August 21, 2009, 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by muffer

When they speak in the council at Rivendell they talk about Dale and they say that it is a large kingdom in the North. The city's probably joined when Bard became king again./ Also when Dale was going to be rebuild a lot of people from Esgargoth left for Dale.

Right!

+ Even if Dale itself & Laketown were destroyed, the kingdom is referred as Dale (Dimrhill Dale exactly) I think not because of the town but because his "king" is Bard of Dale. (a.k.a. Bard the Bowman). Like Eriador It's more a confederacy of free towns & rural communities than an "absolutist" Kingdom like Gondor, Rohan, or Mordor.

By the time of the council Dale was rebuilt. Warmaster is also right because the country was known as Esgaroth.

Semantic details.

**George Maniaces** · August 21, 2009, 04:52 PM

I think it went something like this. There was once the Kingdom of Dale, centered on the town of Dale. Smaug came, ravaged the city of Dale, brought the Kingdom of Dale tor ruin. Some of the survivors founded Esgaroth-on-Long Lake in order to somewhat protect themselves from Smaug, but the rulers of this city were the merchants. Then after Smaug was destroyed, the city of Dale could be reinhabited and the Kingdom of Dale restored.