Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 44

Thread: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    Imperator Romani's Avatar Campidoctor
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    North Mississippi
    Posts
    1,819

    Default 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    http://finance.yahoo.com/insurance/a...surance-health

    More than $1.2 trillion spent on health care each year is a waste of money. Members of the medical community identify the leading causes.
    Down the drain: $1.2 trillion.
    That's half of the $2.2 trillion the United States spends on health care each year, according to the most recent data from accounting firm PricewaterhouseCoopers' Health Research Institute.
    What counts as waste? The report identified 16 different areas in which health care dollars are squandered. But in talking to doctors, nurses, hospital groups and patient advocacy groups, six areas totaling nearly $500 billion stood out as issues to be dealt with in the health care reform debate.
    Too Many Tests


    Doctors ordering tests or procedures not based on need but concern over liability or increasing their income is the biggest waste of health care dollars, costing the system at least $210 billion a year, according to the report. The problem is called "defensive medicine."
    "Sometimes the motivation is to avoid malpractice suits, or to make more money because they are compensated more for doing more," said Dr. Arthur Garson, provost of the University of Virginia and former dean of its medical school. "Many are also convinced that doing more tests is the right thing to do."
    "But any money that is spent on a patient that doesn't improve the outcome is a waste," said Garson.
    Some conservatives have suggested that capping malpractice awards would help solve the problem.
    President Obama doesn't agree; instead, his reform proposal encourages doctors to practice "evidence-based" guidelines as a way to scale back on unnecessary tests.
    Those Annoying Claim Forms
    Inefficient claims processing is the second-biggest area of wasteful expenditure, costing as much as $210 billion annually, the PricewaterhouseCoopers report said.


    "We spend a lot of time and money trying to get paid by insurers," said Dr. Terry McGenney, a Kansas City, Mo.-based family physician.
    "Every insurance company has its own forms," McGenney said. "Some practices spend 40% of their revenue filling out paperwork that has nothing to do with patient care. So much of this could be automated."
    Dr. Jason Dees, a family doctor in a private practice based in New Albany, Miss., said his office often resubmits claims that have been "magically denied."
    "That adds to our administrative fees, extends the payment cycle and hurts our cash flow," he said.
    Dees also spends a lot of time getting "pre-certification" from insurers to approve higher-priced procedures such as MRIs. "We're already operating on paper-thin margins and this takes times away from our patients," he said.
    Susan Pisano, spokeswoman for America's Health Insurance Plans, said "hundreds of billions" of dollars can be saved by standardizing procedures and using technology -- something the White House has mentioned as a key to health care reform.

    "For that to happen, we need the technology," she said. "Doctors and hospitals must adopt the technology, and we have to develop rules for exchanging of information between doctors, hospitals and health plans."
    Pisano said the industry is launching a pilot program later this year that will allow physicians to communicate with all health plans using a standardized process.
    Using the ER as a Clinic
    More insured and uninsured consumers are getting their primary care in emergency rooms, wasting $14 billion every year in health care spending.
    "This is an inappropriate use of the ER," said Dee Swanson, president of the American Academy of Nurse Practitioners. "You don't go to the ER for strep throat."
    Since emergency rooms are legally obligated to treat all patients, Swanson said providers ultimately find ways to pass on the cost for treating the uninsured to other patients, such as to those who pay out-of-pocket for their medical care.
    Dees also took issue with consumers who don't get primary care for their diabetes or blood pressure on a timely basis, hence finding themselves in the ER.
    "Going to the doctor for strep throat would cost $65-$70. In the ER, it's $600 to $800," he said.
    The $787 billion stimulus bill signed passed by President Obama earlier this year includes allocates $1 billion for a wellness and prevention fund, including $300 million for immunizations and $650 million for prevention programs to combat the rapid growth in chronic diseases such as obesity and diabetes.
    Medical "Oops"
    Medical errors are costing the industry $17 billion a year in wasted expenses, something that makes patient advocacy groups irate.
    "Do we have a good health IT system in place to prevent this?" asked Kim Bailey, senior health policy analyst with consumer advocacy group Families USA.
    Bailey suggested that processes such as computerized order entry for drugs and use of electronic health records (EHR) could help ensure that patients get the correct dosage of medications in hospitals.
    The stimulus bill calls for the government to take a leading role in developing standards by 2010 to facilitate the adoption of health information exchanges across the system, including patient electronic health records by 2014.
    Obama has repeatedly said that the use of technology in the health sector will help boost savings, enhance the coordination of care and reduce medical errors and unnecessary procedures.
    Going Back to the Hospital
    Bailey suggested that processes such as computerized order entry for drugs and use of electronic health records (EHR) could help ensure that patients get the correct dosage of medications in hospitals. Discharging patients too soon is a "huge waste of money," said Swanson.
    "This happens a lot with elderly patients who are discharged prematurely because of insurance, bed unavailability or ageism," she said.
    Many times, patients also don't follow instructions for care after discharge. "So complications arise and they are readmitted in a week," Swanson said.
    PricewaterhouseCoopers estimates the cost of preventable hospital readmissions at $25 billion annually.
    Among the reform plans, one proposal being considered is for Medicare to potentially penalize hospitals who readmit patients within 30 days of discharge.
    You Forgot to Wash Your Hands!
    Those ubiquitous dispensers of hand sanitizer are in hospitals for a reason: PricewaterhouseCoopers estimates that about $3 billion is wasted every year as a result of infections acquired during hospital stays.
    "The general belief is that hospitals are getting much better in managing this than they have in the past," said Richard Clarke, CEO of Healthcare Financial Management Association, whose members include hospitals and managed care organizations.
    Something as simple as hand-washing often can reduce the problem.
    "Sometimes doctors are the most difficult people to convince to do this," said Clarke. "The challenge here is that patients sometimes come in with infections which then spread in the hospital."
    The stimulus bill signed by Obama earlier this year includes $50 million for reducing health care-associated infections.
    Other areas of waste identified in the PricewaterhouseCoopers report included up to $493 billion related to risky behavior such as smoking, obesity and alcohol abuse, $21 billion in staffing turnover, $4 billion in prescriptions written on paper, and $1 billion in the over-prescribing of antibiotics.

    Copyrighted, CNNMoney. All Rights Reserved

    Thoughts?

  2. #2

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Too Many Tests
    Ordered to protect the doctor against lawsuits, at behest of insurance companies. Then, the basturds refuse to pay out for the exams they insisted you have...reason being "beyond the specific needs of your individual case" or some other crap.
    Those Annoying Claim Forms

    ...at behest of insurance companies.
    Using the ER as a Clinic

    poor people with medical ailments and no insurance wait until the ER is the only remaining option.
    Medical "Oops"

    I interact with nursing & pre-med students. No surprise here...
    Going Back to the Hospital

    "Make Room! Make Room! That old lady in 211 is just taking up space!" It's a business. What do you expect?
    You Forgot to Wash Your Hands!

    ...and that's why the best way to stay healthy is to stay the hell away from hospitals.
    Giving tax breaks to the wealthy, is like giving free dessert coupons to the morbidly obese.

    IDIOT BASTARD SON of MAVERICK

  3. #3
    Angrychris's Avatar Primicerius
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    3,478

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Need to look to the canadians and french for examples as said on HBO last weekend.

    Leave it to the modder to perfect the works of the paid developers for no profit at all.

  4. #4
    Imperator Romani's Avatar Campidoctor
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    North Mississippi
    Posts
    1,819

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Yes, but the point is that can this be fixed?

  5. #5

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Quote Originally Posted by PureInfantryWins View Post
    Yes, but the point is that can this be fixed?
    Yes, by supporting Obama's Health Care!


    "When one person suffers from a delusion it is called insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion it is called religion." -- Robert Pirsig

    "Feminists are silent when the bills arrive." -- Aetius

    "Women have made a pact with the devil — in return for the promise of exquisite beauty, their window to this world of lavish male attention is woefully brief." -- Some Guy

  6. #6
    Imperator Romani's Avatar Campidoctor
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    North Mississippi
    Posts
    1,819

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Quote Originally Posted by jankren View Post
    Yes, by supporting Obama's Health Care!
    Tell me how that would fix the problems in bold. Elaborate.

  7. #7

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Dear Christ, is American healthcare, private or not, that bad?
    Quote Originally Posted by A.J.P. Taylor
    Peaceful agreement and government by consent are possible only on the basis of ideas common to all parties; and these ideas must spring from habit and from history. Once reason is introduced, every man, every class, every nation becomes a law unto itself; and the only right which reason understands is the right of the stronger. Reason formulates universal principles and is therefore intolerant: there can be only one rational society, one rational nation, ultimately one rational man. Decisions between rival reasons can be made only by force.





    Quote Originally Posted by H.L Spieghel
    Is het niet hogelijk te verwonderen, en een recht beklaaglijke zaak, Heren, dat alhoewel onze algemene Dietse taal een onvermengde, sierlijke en verstandelijke spraak is, die zich ook zo wijd als enige talen des werelds verspreidt, en die in haar bevang veel rijken, vorstendommen en landen bevat, welke dagelijks zeer veel kloeke en hooggeleerde verstanden uitleveren, dat ze nochtans zo zwakkelijk opgeholpen en zo weinig met geleerdheid verrijkt en versiert wordt, tot een jammerlijk hinder en nadeel des volks?
    Quote Originally Posted by Miel Cools
    Als ik oud ben wil ik zingen,
    Oud ben maar nog niet verrot.
    Zoals oude bomen zingen,
    Voor Jan Lul of voor hun god.
    Ook een oude boom wil reizen,
    Bij een bries of bij een storm.
    Zelfs al zit zijn kruin vol luizen,
    Zelfs al zit zijn voet vol worm.
    Als ik oud ben wil ik zingen.

    Cò am Fear am measg ant-sluaigh,
    A mhaireas buan gu bràth?
    Chan eil sinn uileadh ach air chuart,
    Mar dhìthein buaile fàs,
    Bheir siantannan na bliadhna sìos,
    'S nach tog a' ghrian an àird.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jörg Friedrich
    When do I stop being a justified warrior? When I've killed a million bad civilians? When I've killed three million bad civilians? According to a warsimulation by the Pentagon in 1953 the entire area of Russia would've been reduced to ruins with 60 million casualties. All bad Russians. 60 million bad guys. By how many million ''bad'' casualties do I stop being a knight of justice? Isn't that the question those knights must ask themselves? If there's no-one left, and I remain as the only just one,

    Then I'm God.
    Quote Originally Posted by Louis Napoleon III, Des Idees Napoleoniennes
    Governments have been established to aid society to overcome the obstacles which impede its march. Their forms have been varied according to the problems they have been called to cure, and according to character of the people they have ruled over. Their task never has been, and never will be easy, because the two contrary elements, of which our existence and the nature of society is composed, demand the employment of different means. In view of our divine essence, we need only liberty and work; in view of our mortal nature, we need for our direction a guide and a support. A government is not then, as a distinguished economist has said, a necessary ulcer; it is rather the beneficent motive power of all social organisation.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfgang Held
    I walked into those baracks [of Buchenwald concentrationcamp], in which there were people on the three-layered bunkbeds. But only their eyes were alive. Emaciated, skinny figures, nothing more but skin and bones. One thinks that they are dead, because they did not move. Only the eyes. I started to cry. And then one of the prisoners came, stood by me for a while, put a hand on my shoulder and said to me, something that I will never forget: ''Tränen sind denn nicht genug, mein Junge,
    Tränen sind denn nicht genug.''

    Jajem ssoref is m'n korew
    E goochem mit e wenk, e nar mit e shtomp
    Wer niks is, hot kawsones

  8. #8

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Dear Christ, is American healthcare, private or not, that bad?
    "Wasteful" is a better word. And yes, knowing people who actually work in the industry and supporting industries (which is ~1/6 of our economy), these critiques are quite true. Even as an engineer who designs hosiptals, I am tangentially aware of the mass of money floating around; the most overlly complex and expensive projects are always hospitals.

  9. #9
    .......................
    Civitate

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    33,982

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Since when has the Federal government actually competently managed something well? This is not news. Sorry.

  10. #10

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Quote Originally Posted by Яome kb8 View Post
    Since when has the Federal government actually competently managed something well? This is not news. Sorry.
    This isn't government management, this is government subsidization.

    Solution: Abolish medicare and medicaid. Phase out social security, introduce a state administered health-care option, administered locally rather than federally. Problem solved. Spending goes down anywhere from 5% - 25% and everyone is covered in the system.
    Heir to Noble Savage in the Imperial House of Wilpuri

  11. #11

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Quote Originally Posted by Яome kb8 View Post
    Since when has the Federal government actually competently managed something well? This is not news. Sorry.
    National defense.

  12. #12

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Quote Originally Posted by Chukada1 View Post
    National defense.

    Quote Originally Posted by A.J.P. Taylor
    Peaceful agreement and government by consent are possible only on the basis of ideas common to all parties; and these ideas must spring from habit and from history. Once reason is introduced, every man, every class, every nation becomes a law unto itself; and the only right which reason understands is the right of the stronger. Reason formulates universal principles and is therefore intolerant: there can be only one rational society, one rational nation, ultimately one rational man. Decisions between rival reasons can be made only by force.





    Quote Originally Posted by H.L Spieghel
    Is het niet hogelijk te verwonderen, en een recht beklaaglijke zaak, Heren, dat alhoewel onze algemene Dietse taal een onvermengde, sierlijke en verstandelijke spraak is, die zich ook zo wijd als enige talen des werelds verspreidt, en die in haar bevang veel rijken, vorstendommen en landen bevat, welke dagelijks zeer veel kloeke en hooggeleerde verstanden uitleveren, dat ze nochtans zo zwakkelijk opgeholpen en zo weinig met geleerdheid verrijkt en versiert wordt, tot een jammerlijk hinder en nadeel des volks?
    Quote Originally Posted by Miel Cools
    Als ik oud ben wil ik zingen,
    Oud ben maar nog niet verrot.
    Zoals oude bomen zingen,
    Voor Jan Lul of voor hun god.
    Ook een oude boom wil reizen,
    Bij een bries of bij een storm.
    Zelfs al zit zijn kruin vol luizen,
    Zelfs al zit zijn voet vol worm.
    Als ik oud ben wil ik zingen.

    Cò am Fear am measg ant-sluaigh,
    A mhaireas buan gu bràth?
    Chan eil sinn uileadh ach air chuart,
    Mar dhìthein buaile fàs,
    Bheir siantannan na bliadhna sìos,
    'S nach tog a' ghrian an àird.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jörg Friedrich
    When do I stop being a justified warrior? When I've killed a million bad civilians? When I've killed three million bad civilians? According to a warsimulation by the Pentagon in 1953 the entire area of Russia would've been reduced to ruins with 60 million casualties. All bad Russians. 60 million bad guys. By how many million ''bad'' casualties do I stop being a knight of justice? Isn't that the question those knights must ask themselves? If there's no-one left, and I remain as the only just one,

    Then I'm God.
    Quote Originally Posted by Louis Napoleon III, Des Idees Napoleoniennes
    Governments have been established to aid society to overcome the obstacles which impede its march. Their forms have been varied according to the problems they have been called to cure, and according to character of the people they have ruled over. Their task never has been, and never will be easy, because the two contrary elements, of which our existence and the nature of society is composed, demand the employment of different means. In view of our divine essence, we need only liberty and work; in view of our mortal nature, we need for our direction a guide and a support. A government is not then, as a distinguished economist has said, a necessary ulcer; it is rather the beneficent motive power of all social organisation.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfgang Held
    I walked into those baracks [of Buchenwald concentrationcamp], in which there were people on the three-layered bunkbeds. But only their eyes were alive. Emaciated, skinny figures, nothing more but skin and bones. One thinks that they are dead, because they did not move. Only the eyes. I started to cry. And then one of the prisoners came, stood by me for a while, put a hand on my shoulder and said to me, something that I will never forget: ''Tränen sind denn nicht genug, mein Junge,
    Tränen sind denn nicht genug.''

    Jajem ssoref is m'n korew
    E goochem mit e wenk, e nar mit e shtomp
    Wer niks is, hot kawsones

  13. #13
    Last Roman's Avatar ron :wub:in swanson
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Minnesota, US
    Posts
    16,270

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Quote Originally Posted by Яome kb8 View Post
    Since when has the Federal government actually competently managed something well? This is not news. Sorry.
    um, this is about the current private health care system we have
    house of Rububula, under the patronage of Nihil, patron of Hotspur, David Deas, Freddie, Askthepizzaguy and Ketchfoop
    Go to Heaven for the climate, Hell for the company
    -Mark Twain

  14. #14

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Quote Originally Posted by Яome kb8 View Post
    Since when has the Federal government actually competently managed something well? This is not news. Sorry.

    this is the private sector, not the fed.

  15. #15
    Imperator Romani's Avatar Campidoctor
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    North Mississippi
    Posts
    1,819

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Just thought it was interesting.

  16. #16

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Tell me how that would fix the problems in bold. Elaborate.
    Too Many Tests
    Each bill addresses this a little differently. Most of the creation of "evidence-based" guidelines, but really theres no teeth behind that. A public option could have the power to use more results-based billing to break up the insentives to perfom uneccisary procedures.


    Those Annoying Claim Forms
    Every bill has a simular section with regulations of insurance industry that includes billing standardization, getting rid of pre-existing condition nonsense, and other avenues of denying claims that, while profitable for the insurance industry to persue, puts more money in administration than actual care.

    Using the ER as a Clinic
    Obviously getting 95% of people covered (which is the CBO's estimate for the Bacchus bill), will work to get more people in the Doctors office for 1/10 of the price (as it will be "free") instead of going to the ER which is currently "free" to the user (even if it everyone else has to pay for it at ten times the cost.)

    Medical "Oops"
    The investments and insentives for electronic medical records should mitigate this. I am not sure how this is addressed in the different bills. There are big bucks in the stimulus for it.

    Going Back to the Hospital
    Only thing I know about is already in the article ...
    "Among the reform plans, one proposal being considered is for Medicare to potentially penalize hospitals who readmit patients within 30 days of discharge."

    You Forgot to Wash Your Hands!
    3 Billion a year? Thats .001% of healthcare spending, not worth the effort. Focus on the 30-40% that goes to administration.

    What's coming out of the Senate seems to be getting high marks from the CBO, which dumped on the House Bills. The senate seems to be developing a Public/Private hybrid option instead of a straight public option. In any event, something needs to be done and despite their best efforts, I think congress is on a path to a solution.

    Well, thats my attempt to get this argument back to the merits of what is actually in the proposed bills, and away from ideological squabbles.

  17. #17
    Imperator Romani's Avatar Campidoctor
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    North Mississippi
    Posts
    1,819

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Quote Originally Posted by Sphere View Post
    Too Many Tests
    Each bill addresses this a little differently. Most of the creation of "evidence-based" guidelines, but really theres no teeth behind that. A public option could have the power to use more results-based billing to break up the insentives to perfom uneccisary procedures.


    Those Annoying Claim Forms
    Every bill has a simular section with regulations of insurance industry that includes billing standardization, getting rid of pre-existing condition nonsense, and other avenues of denying claims that, while profitable for the insurance industry to persue, puts more money in administration than actual care.

    Using the ER as a Clinic
    Obviously getting 95% of people covered (which is the CBO's estimate for the Bacchus bill), will work to get more people in the Doctors office for 1/10 of the price (as it will be "free") instead of going to the ER which is currently "free" to the user (even if it everyone else has to pay for it at ten times the cost.)

    Medical "Oops"
    The investments and insentives for electronic medical records should mitigate this. I am not sure how this is addressed in the different bills. There are big bucks in the stimulus for it.

    Going Back to the Hospital
    Only thing I know about is already in the article ...
    "Among the reform plans, one proposal being considered is for Medicare to potentially penalize hospitals who readmit patients within 30 days of discharge."

    You Forgot to Wash Your Hands!
    3 Billion a year? Thats .001% of healthcare spending, not worth the effort. Focus on the 30-40% that goes to administration.

    What's coming out of the Senate seems to be getting high marks from the CBO, which dumped on the House Bills. The senate seems to be developing a Public/Private hybrid option instead of a straight public option. In any event, something needs to be done and despite their best efforts, I think congress is on a path to a solution.

    Well, thats my attempt to get this argument back to the merits of what is actually in the proposed bills, and away from ideological squabbles.
    It sounds nice, except for the fact that someone's gotta pay for it. Mainly the wealthy people. Which leads to a whole nother debate.

  18. #18

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Obama yeah!


    "When one person suffers from a delusion it is called insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion it is called religion." -- Robert Pirsig

    "Feminists are silent when the bills arrive." -- Aetius

    "Women have made a pact with the devil — in return for the promise of exquisite beauty, their window to this world of lavish male attention is woefully brief." -- Some Guy

  19. #19

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Brought to you by the pulling it out of your ass institute.
    "When I die, I want to die peacefully in my sleep, like Fidel Castro, not screaming in terror, like his victims."

    My shameful truth.

  20. #20
    Trey's Avatar Primicerius
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Land of the Evergreens
    Posts
    3,886

    Default Re: 1.2 trillion wasted on healthcare

    Quote Originally Posted by jankren View Post
    Obama yeah!
    Get on topic.
    for-profit death machine.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •