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  1. #1
    B5C's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    White House Move to Collect 'Fishy' Info May Be Illegal, Critics Say

    The White House strategy of turning supporters into snitches when they see "fishy" information about the health care debate may run afoul of the law, legal experts say.

    "The White House is in bit of a conundrum because of this privacy statute that prohibits the White House from collecting data and storing it on people who disagree with it," Judge Andrew Napolitano, a FOX News analyst, said Friday.

    "There's also a statute that requires the White House to retain all communications that it receives. It can't try to rewrite history by pretending it didn't receive anything," he said.

    "If the White House deletes anything, it violates one statute. If the White House collects data on the free speech, it violates another statute."

    Napolitano was referring to the Privacy Act of 1974, which was passed after the Nixon administration used federal agencies to illegally investigate individuals for political purposes. Enacted after Richard Nixon's resignation in the Watergate scandal, the statute generally prohibits any federal agency from maintaining records on individuals exercising their right to free speech.

    The White House has been under fire since it posted a blog on Tuesday that asked supporters to e-mail any "fishy" information seen on the Web or received electronically to flag@whitehouse.gov.

    "There is a lot of disinformation about health insurance reform out there," the blog said, adding that "since we can't keep track of all of them here at the White House, we're asking for your help."

    The blog was posted partly in response to a video posted on the Web that claimed to show Obama explaining how his health care reform plans eventually will eliminate private insurance.

    The video, featured on the Drudge Report, strung together selected Obama statements that the White House said were taken out of context.

    The White House said it wanted to be made aware of "fishy" comments about its health care plan because it wants to set the record straight. But critics called White House move an Orwellian tactic designed to control the health care debate.

    "This is a very troubling attempt to stifle the free speech of Americans who have the constitutional right to express their opinion and concerns about health care," said Jay Sekulow, chief counsel of the American Center for Law and Justice. He called on Obama to repudiate his blog.

    "This move is an attempt to intimidate those who have legitimate concerns about the health care plan," Sekulow said. "And, worse, it turns the White House into some sort of self-appointed 'speech police.' This new White House reporting program strikes at the heart of the First Amendment and has no place in this important debate about health care."

    Sekulow said he imagines that opponents of mandatory abortion coverage are engaging in what the White House considers "fishy" speech and should be reported.

    "What the White House is touting is absurd," he said.

    But Napolitano said the White House probably cannot be sued because of sovereign immunity, unless someone was harmed by what the government did with the records. But that's unlikely, he said, because the person would probably be unaware of the harm.

    "That's a silent violation of your right to privacy," he said.

    The ACLU said in a statement to FOXNews.com that the White House blog is a "bad idea that could send a troublesome message."

    But the organization added, "While it is unclear at this point what the government is doing with the information it is collecting, critics of the administration's health care proposal should not fear that their names will end up in some government database that could be used to chill their right to free speech."

    The White House Thursday denied that it was playing "Big Brother."

    "Nobody is collecting names," White House spokesman Robert Gibbs said. "We have seen, and as I've discussed from this podium, a lot of misinformation around health care reform, a lot of it spread, I think, purposefully."

    Texas Sen. John Cornyn, who has called on Obama to end the program, rejected the White House explanation.

    "Of course the White House is collecting names," he said, arguing that anyone with access to the e-mail account has access to private information.

    "The question is not what the White House is doing, but how and why," he said. "How are they purging names and e-mail addresses from this account to protect privacy? Why do they need the forwarded e-mails, names, and 'casual conversations' sent to them instead of just the arguments that they want to rebut?

    Asked by FOX News whether the White House was using the blog post as a way to expand the e-mail list for the administration and Obama's political arm, Organizing for America, Gibbs said the two are "not in any way connected" and repeated that the White House is not collecting names.

    Pressed about the program's goal, Gibbs said it was to clarify for everybody what the misinformation is, adding that's not a new tactic.

    "When you make a mistake in your report, sometimes I e-mail you," Gibbs said to FOX News' Major Garrett. "Occasionally, I call. Sometimes I just throw something against the wall. Occasionally, it's all three."

    Garrett asked why it's necessary to ask so many people to e-mail the White House.

    "All we're asking people to do is, if they're confused about what health care reform is going to mean to them, we're happy to help clear that up for them. Nobody's keeping anybody's names. I do have your e-mail. ...Maybe that's because I assume future mistakes. But I'm not going to say that," Gibbs said, drawing laughter.

    "But nobody's collecting information," he added. "Everybody is trying to give people only the facts around what we all understand is a very complicated issue."

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009...l-critics-say/
    Looks like this program should end or my name could be on his list.

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  2. #2

    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    "Critics say".

    Critics say that Obama is illegal as a President because he wasn't born in the United States. Don't take these things hook, line and sinker.

  3. #3
    B5C's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    The birthers are not the same critics. DO you think its kinda wrong that Obama is asking people too report info of other people who are saying "bad" things about his healthcare.

    “Nothing could be more dangerous to the existence of this Republic than to introduce religion into politics”

  4. #4

    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    I don't know the actual story, all you have is a FOX interpretation.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ferrets54 View Post
    I don't know the actual story, all you have is a FOX interpretation.
    Here:

    http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/Facts...ubborn-Things/

    Scary chain emails and videos are starting to percolate on the internet, breathlessly claiming, for example, to "uncover" the truth about the President’s health insurance reform positions.
    There is a lot of disinformation about health insurance reform out there, spanning from control of personal finances to end of life care. These rumors often travel just below the surface via chain emails or through casual conversation. Since we can’t keep track of all of them here at the White House, we’re asking for your help. If you get an email or see something on the web about health insurance reform that seems fishy, send it to flag@whitehouse.gov.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    I think the president needs to do more things that are illegal...

    Trust me...if we're going to fix things from the current state they are in...i have a feeling some laws are going to need to be broken or all out changed...

    I wanna lie, lie to myself, myself and someone else. Cause it’s the lying that hurts, and it’s the hurt that lets me know I’m alive.”

  7. #7

    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hippolord View Post
    I think the president needs to do more things that are illegal...

    Trust me...if we're going to fix things from the current state they are in...i have a feeling some laws are going to need to be broken or all out changed...
    No, I don't trust you.

    Doing stupid things to get a very badly constructed health care 'reform' is hardly going to be fixing anything.
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  8. #8

    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/Facts...ubborn-Things/
    There is a lot of disinformation about health insurance reform out there, spanning from control of personal finances to end of life care. These rumors often travel just below the surface via chain emails or through casual conversation. Since we can’t keep track of all of them here at the White House, we’re asking for your help. If you get an email or see something on the web about health insurance reform that seems fishy, send it to flag@whitehouse.gov.
    Wait...you guys think this is a request for personal information?

    What the ffff....?

    Dudes. Basic grammar...

    Key sentence:

    If you get an email or see something on the web about health insurance reform that seems fishy, send it to flag@whitehouse.gov.
    Send something to whitehouse.gove you say? Send what? Personal information? Let's scan the request and see if it asks for anything personal. I see 'email', and 'something on the web'. Both are specified down to 'about health insurance reform'. I see nothing that approaches 'send us their names'. It's certainly not a request asking for info on 'people talking about health insurance reform'.

    I think there's a reason Fox seems to be the only one going off the walls about this.
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  9. #9

    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidin View Post


    I think there's a reason Fox seems to be the only one going off the walls about this.
    I agree but I think that reason would be lost on many
    "When I die, I want to die peacefully in my sleep, like Fidel Castro, not screaming in terror, like his victims."

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  10. #10
    Myxlpltx's Avatar Libertus
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    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Phier View Post
    I agree but I think that reason would be lost on many
    Really? Because I find it pretty easy to notice their right- wing bias.

    As for "illegal info gathering," it looks to me like this is nothing more than a very poorly worded way of saying "If you have any questions about healthcare reform, we'd like to hear them."

  11. #11

    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    Isn't it just: "Send us anything fishy that you hear about health care, and we'll correct it for you", rather than: "Snitch on your neighbors and give us their names."?

    Although you wouldn't really call misinformation that you're hoping to correct - "fishy"...
    Last edited by Alba gu Brath; August 08, 2009 at 11:45 AM.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    You know I didn't post anything thing about it, because I wanted to see how long it took for anyone on the left to be outraged.

    Oddly they weren't.
    "When I die, I want to die peacefully in my sleep, like Fidel Castro, not screaming in terror, like his victims."

    My shameful truth.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    It could be because Nixon couldn't flim/ collect data on the anti-war protesters... Obama cannot collect information on people who disagree with his healthcare plan even if it what Gibbs says is true- that they want to correctly inform people. I believe he called it "misinformation"

    If Obama has collected any "data" it would also be illegal for him to um press "delete"



    To be honest IDK what to believe - it all sounds rather "fishy"

  14. #14
    Last Roman's Avatar ron :wub:in swanson
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    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    Quote Originally Posted by WrathofTulkas View Post
    To be honest IDK what to believe - it all sounds rather "fishy"
    This. I mean, it could be an honest attempt to correct disinformation, but given our govt's history with this type of stuff...
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  15. #15

    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    if it just passes on the (mis)information thats ok by me, if it passes on names thats a different thing entirely.

  16. #16
    Darth Red's Avatar It's treason, then
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    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    It does sound a bit insecure for Obama's part. I feel instead of taking names, perhaps the White House could explain why these are gross allegations. Tell the people what the details are of the bill. I disagree with the ACLU because if this were a matter of national security, and it clearly isn't, I personally wouldn't mind the move, and could find in the Constitution why that would appropriate. I don't think you could call socilized public heathcare naysayers an enemy of the State.
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  17. #17

    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Red View Post
    It does sound a bit insecure for Obama's part. I feel instead of taking names, perhaps the White House could explain why these are gross allegations. Tell the people what the details are of the bill. I disagree with the ACLU because if this were a matter of national security, and it clearly isn't, I personally wouldn't mind the move, and could find in the Constitution why that would appropriate. I don't think you could call socilized public heathcare naysayers an enemy of the State.

    If all it is doing is gathering the arguements so that they can be rebuffed fine, if it goes further than that, thats bad.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    So basically we are saying that Obama's propaganda people can't use google to find and counter these 'fishy' arguments?

    There is so much stupid with this is hard to contemplate.
    "When I die, I want to die peacefully in my sleep, like Fidel Castro, not screaming in terror, like his victims."

    My shameful truth.

  19. #19
    Comes Domesticorum
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    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    "Guys, tell us what people are saying about healthcare so we can inform them if they are misinformed."

    Nineteen-Eighty-Four right there, son.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Obama's move to collect "fishy" info maybe illegal.

    this is very important, WHY has the media not torn him a fourth ?
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