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Thread: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

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    AqD's Avatar 。◕‿◕。
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    Default [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    New Bactrian Kingdom


    Part I: Bactrian Greeks

    Baktrioi Agema (Hoplitai) - Bactrian Royal Guards

    The Bactrian royal guards are the King's foot companions, numbered 500 in the Indo-Greek kingdom, as cited in "Malinda Panha". Those soldiers are depicted very clearly on archaeology remains - as spearmen, with greek swords and apis shield which may be considered outdated in 240BC. There is no battle account but they're probably just like the royal Hypaspists in other successor kingdoms.
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    Ionikoi Machairophoroi - Ionian Swordsmen

    The Ionian swordsmen were mentioned in Indian sources, as mercenary soldiers who helped Chandragupta Maurya, founder of the Maurya Empire, to establish his power in India. They're dated before Alexander's conquest - when Persians forcefully moved troublesome greeks from Ionia to there, some of them made themselves mercenaries, and became quite successful - they're hired even as far as Sri Lanka. These soldiers would have the usual hoplite equipments, but changed to swords as primary weapon. From the remains they seem to be better armoured compared to the original hoplites, for instance their skirts are reinforced with two rows of metal plates.

    PS: The Indians and other people there called all greeks there as "Yavanas" (= Ionian / Ionikoi), who were the first greeks to settle in Bactria, though later greek migrants came from different sources


    Baktrioi Pezoi - Bactrian Pikemen
    They are Macedonian-style Phalangites in Bactria kingdom. There was actually no remain or depiction of those soldiers to be found. However, there were once Macedonian garrisons in Bactria before the revolt, it's likely Bactrians still had some of soldiers trained that way.


    Baktrioi Thorakitai - Bactrian Medium Infantry
    Thureos-armed infantry according to a terracotta figure dated 2nd century BC. The thureos reached middle-east at arond 2nd century BC, just the time when this figure was made. They would assume the role of Thureophori/Thorakitai, act either as primary infantry or to protect the flanks of phalanx (if there is one).


    Baktrioi Hippeis - Bactrian Medium Cavalry
    A hydrid of native Bactrians and Greek cavalry in the army. The native Bactrian poeple are similiar to Persians, with a tradition of horse riding and archery, and have been known in battles since Achaemenid days. It appears they have lower status - there was no reserved position to them like Iranian Agema in Seleucid. Here they assume the role of medium/heavy cavalry - they can be lancers or used to counter enemy heavy cavalry, which they're very good at (p: Gaugamela).
    PS: the unit should really belong to Indo-Greeks part and not here. Back in Bactrian kingdom the distinction between local nobles and greeks are very clear - they don't mix together.


    Baktrioi Hippotoxotai - Bactrian Horse-Archers
    This unit is inspired by EB's unit of the same name, there isn't other source except for a coin which shows quiver/bow on cavalrymen. Nevertheless, according to Milinda Panha, the king said himself was trained in archery, so it's likely their elite cavalrymen can act as HA as well. The unit should represent a fraction of Greek cavalrymen (which is itself small and most are depicted with xyston) - as archers they're no better than common steppe riders who grow up on horseback, but their close-combat capability and heavy armour are essential in countering nomadic factions, for other cavalrymen are either too light or too heavy, or lack in ranged weaponary. You'd also find them useful to support


    Hetairoi Kataphraktoi - Companion Cataphracts (General's bodyguards)



    The Peltastai, Elite Phalanx, Hoplites, Archers and Elephants from RTR remain in the unit roster; Part II: Indo-Greeks and Saka is postponed due to time constraint (the mod must be released before Aug ) The campaign of Bactrian kingdom will be the easiest to play with!


    Credit: thanks Halie Satanus for his ring-pommel sword, and our historian Confederate Jeb and friend Keravnos for invaluable historical information! Details here
    Last edited by AqD; October 11, 2016 at 01:15 PM.

  2. #2

    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    Really love where you are going with this. Well done!
    Go Minerwars Go! A 6DOF game of space mining and shooting. SAKA Co-FC, Koinon Hellenon FC, Epeiros FC. RS Hellenistic Historian K.I.S.S.




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    AqD's Avatar 。◕‿◕。
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    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    Thanks! Now I'll prepare the release

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    Lanjane's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    Quote Originally Posted by aqd
    The campaign of Bactrian kingdom will be the easiest to play with!
    And the Seleucid campaign will be bloody nightmare only for most firm veterans, anyway.

    Royal Guards, Machairophoroi and cataphract horses left tremendous impression. Perhaps the finest units you've ever created! And there will be the most detailed Bactria in history of RTW modding, when you finish your work on them
    Don't run too far, you will have to return the same distance.
    - Biblical Proverb
    Nobody will try to figure it out if you are made of glass or of metal. They'll treat you the same way.
    When you show your strength, you'll find a company of those who want to steal it from you, but your weakness, you'll be all alone with it.

    - Winter Voices

    Lanjane's Barbarian Empires * Barbarian Empires: Hellenistic Legacy * Extended Cultures V * Rome - Total Realism 8 * Lanjane's Mini-Workshop * Rome: Total Music


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    AqD's Avatar 。◕‿◕。
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    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    Quote Originally Posted by Lanjane View Post
    And the Seleucid campaign will be bloody nightmare only for most firm veterans, anyway.
    You just need a bit more confidence! The seleucid military machine is unbeatable!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lanjane View Post
    Royal Guards, Machairophoroi and cataphract horses left tremendous impression. Perhaps the finest units you've ever created! And there will be the most detailed Bactria in history of RTW modding, when you finish your work on them
    that'll be left for next version

  6. #6

    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    I will never play Seleucids again... their empire is like a patchwork trampoline - looks bad, weird shapes and collapses under pressure

  7. #7

    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    Ooh cool, I've been promoted again

  8. #8

    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    Bactria will be much better after the merger though

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    AqD's Avatar 。◕‿◕。
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    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    merge with Grand Campaign will be ....... I hope it's not 2 years from now, but so far I haven't heard anything about the grand campaign

  10. #10

    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    Out of curiosity, what are the heavily armored bactrian horse archers based on? Besides eb I mean.

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    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    I freakin love them, aqd.

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    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    Quote Originally Posted by florin80 View Post
    Out of curiosity, what are the heavily armored bactrian horse archers based on? Besides eb I mean.
    (provided by Keravnos)


    bows + scythian longswords (note the pommel, a scythian design - not greek)

  13. #13

    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    Yes, I know those, but to me it looks like a regular noble which has a bow in the good tradition of the area. But does that mean that he`s a horse archer in the rtw sense of the term? What about the hetairoi then? Are they recruited from a different class? Is there any mention of heavy horse archers being a separate corp and used in that sense? I think you may be able to make some heavy horse archers for Pontus too by this logic.
    Last edited by florin80; July 26, 2009 at 10:50 PM.

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    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    Quote Originally Posted by florin80 View Post
    Yes, I know those, but to me it looks like a regular noble which has a bow in the good tradition of the area. But does that mean that he`s a horse archer in the rtw sense of the term? What about the hetairoi then? Are they recruited from a different class? Is there any mention of heavy horse archers being a separate corp and used in that sense? I think you may be able to make some heavy horse archers for Pontus too by this logic.
    That's a good point! In fact many parthian cataphracts were armed that way but they were not supposed to use bows in battles. But I'm just trying to make some differences between factions you know

    It's not for Pontus, though - I dunno why but they don't seem to practice horse archery there (as opposed to their Bosporan neightbors). They're quite hellenized and sometimes I wonder their claim of persian bloodline is just a fake

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    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    From Chinese contact,there was mention of greeks,Dai Yuan,great ionians in ferghana valley,taken over by the horse nomads. A merge of cultures-greek & scythian type archers? Don't know all specifics,but I see a mix in ALEX which I use in TE Mod.

    Units here are beautiful. I did not know about the 'zodiac' like ornaments,found in museums for Baktria,at the time I saw your units,so thought them funny..heh. Oopsie. Excellent work here!!!


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    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    Zodiac-like ornaments are not as funny as little hearts on Bactrioi Hippeis horses' harnesses
    Don't run too far, you will have to return the same distance.
    - Biblical Proverb
    Nobody will try to figure it out if you are made of glass or of metal. They'll treat you the same way.
    When you show your strength, you'll find a company of those who want to steal it from you, but your weakness, you'll be all alone with it.

    - Winter Voices

    Lanjane's Barbarian Empires * Barbarian Empires: Hellenistic Legacy * Extended Cultures V * Rome - Total Realism 8 * Lanjane's Mini-Workshop * Rome: Total Music


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    AqD's Avatar 。◕‿◕。
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    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    Oh Lanjane but I don't think it's a bug... the texture means it
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    There is actually another bug about gloss, which I fixed already but too lazy to update the pics (it would take hours..)


    PS: I'll send you the RC (release candidate) soon, if you have time to do some final check for me

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    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    Quote Originally Posted by aqd
    PS: I'll send you the RC (release candidate) soon, if you have time to do some final check for me
    Yes, of course) BTW, at present I'm still trying to hold out against ptolemaic, parthian, pontic and bactrian hordes in beta3
    Don't run too far, you will have to return the same distance.
    - Biblical Proverb
    Nobody will try to figure it out if you are made of glass or of metal. They'll treat you the same way.
    When you show your strength, you'll find a company of those who want to steal it from you, but your weakness, you'll be all alone with it.

    - Winter Voices

    Lanjane's Barbarian Empires * Barbarian Empires: Hellenistic Legacy * Extended Cultures V * Rome - Total Realism 8 * Lanjane's Mini-Workshop * Rome: Total Music


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    AqD's Avatar 。◕‿◕。
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    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    but but .... it won't be save-game compatible because I re-ordered the faction slots to make Roman playable again, and sort factions by cultures (the original order is a mess)


    Why are you holding against Bactrians? You didn't give up the 3 cities?

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    Default Re: [Preview] new Bactrian Kingdom, part I

    aqd
    I left these cities for rebels when I had played previous beta, so why to repeat predictable actions again? None of Seleucid plots of land to enemies until last seleucid soldier gone!
    Last edited by Lanjane; July 27, 2009 at 12:30 PM.
    Don't run too far, you will have to return the same distance.
    - Biblical Proverb
    Nobody will try to figure it out if you are made of glass or of metal. They'll treat you the same way.
    When you show your strength, you'll find a company of those who want to steal it from you, but your weakness, you'll be all alone with it.

    - Winter Voices

    Lanjane's Barbarian Empires * Barbarian Empires: Hellenistic Legacy * Extended Cultures V * Rome - Total Realism 8 * Lanjane's Mini-Workshop * Rome: Total Music


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