Stack spamming by the evil factions

[poetic totalwar]

Yes, I know that orcs and goblins are supposed to spam because their strength comes in numbers...BUT...I'm finding it somewhat tedious to have to swing my axe through countless hordes of orc necks.


It's like if every single battle is a Thermopylae battle. My 200 dwarves against 5000 orcs. Of course, I win, but it's not much fun when this happens every single battle.


Is there some way to rectify this issue? Is there a way to make the evil stacks smaller/keep the evil factions from spammin? I would much prefer fights where the numbers are closer together. Thermopylae battles are fun, but they get old after a while.

[Hijack5oh]

i know where you are coming from
for me it is when i play gondor mordor will have six stacks outside of Cair andros and every turn i defend against 5000 orcs and win then they siege again in the same turn

they really only way to combat this is to build an army and continually defeate multiple stacks per turn.
Cripple enemies resources and armies so they are fourced to defend rather than attack

I did this with silvian elves and it really decreased the number of full stacks i faced when fighting Isengard

after a few turns i found more half stacks evening out the number of men i would face but i faced more elite units as i killed all of the Snagas off

[poetic totalwar]

hmmm

Do orcs and goblins have 0-turn recruitment? If they do, then I imagine that this is a major reason why this spamming happens. Is there a way to increase the 0-turn recruitment?

[King Canute]

if larger battles that you can easily win are boring wouldnt smaller battles that you can crush the enemy without a doubt how is that more fun?

[Hijack5oh]

if larger battles that you can easily win are boring wouldnt smaller battles that you can crush the enemy without a doubt how is that more fun?

When isengard pumps out its Highly Armoured infantry they are a much more harder unit to kill and balences out the number of men required for both sides

Same with mordor when the Trolls and Uruks come into play when a full stack of elite units for mordor and isengard approch the battles become more close

the point of my method is too make them create their Elite Units quicker and dispoase of their normal spamming armies

not so much about smaller battles but about creating an army for yourself that makes large battles with elite units more funn

[poetic totalwar]

if larger battles that you can easily win are boring wouldnt smaller battles that you can crush the enemy without a doubt how is that more fun?

The ideal would be smaller battles against tougher enemies.

I would prefer a way to make the A.I. invest in more quality rather than quantity (spamming weak units).

P.S. It seems like Hijack5oh and I have similar ideas

[Hijack5oh]

P.S. It seems like Hijack5oh and I have similar ideas

YAY!! now i have one person who under stands me

And the evil factions need to spam more elite units so they can acually beat me for once XP

I would like to lose at least a few battles playing on the VH dificulty makes the game more strategically sound

[Myshkin]

if larger battles that you can easily win are boring wouldnt smaller battles that you can crush the enemy without a doubt how is that more fun?

I absolutely agree here.

Where I would like to see a difference is the frequency of battles. As it is we have a constant battle spam, hence you feel oh well... I do this 500 vs 5000 ten times every turn anyway.

For example increasing the cost of all units, while keeping the balance between AI and human would be a way reduce the battle spam...

[poetic totalwar]

No responses?

Does this imply that there is absolutely no way to edit the 0-turn recruitment?

There must be some way to encourage the A.I. to focus on quality units as opposed to spamming weak units. Any ideas are welcome. I'm willing to edit and experiment with the data folder myself, but I need ideas from more experienced people.

Please.

[OfficerJohn]

The ideal would be smaller battles against tougher enemies.

In that case you should fight as for example Mordor.
Gondor got all those small armies that makes you flee the field when you see them... eventually...

No responses?

Does this imply that there is absolutely no way to edit the 0-turn recruitment?

There is no 0-turn recruitment... at least for Mordor...

[Misha97]

I do not understand your theory. Since my economy for each faction is a piece of trash I do not understand how the less-spamming theory would work. I used 1 army of Militia units ( cavalary,archers,swordsmen ) to defeat about 6-7 stacks of weak orc units. But since I didn't have any money, I couldn't do anything. I ended up facing huge armies of trolls and uruks against my tiny militia army. How do you have enough money rather than like 500g-1000g per turn to actually make quality units?

I strongly agree with poetic totalwar, enemy armies apear in thin air. Its as if they can recruit 10 units each turn in the settlment and suddenly have armies pop up. It really annoys me how they have great military and great econemy while I struggle with my Att. 7 Def. 8 trashy units against Uruks and Gondorian Spearmen.

[poetic totalwar]

I do not understand your theory. Since my economy for each faction is a piece of trash I do not understand how the less-spamming theory would work. I used 1 army of Militia units ( cavalary,archers,swordsmen ) to defeat about 6-7 stacks of weak orc units. But since I didn't have any money, I couldn't do anything. I ended up facing huge armies of trolls and uruks against my tiny militia army. How do you have enough money rather than like 500g-1000g per turn to actually make quality units?

This seems to be a separate issue. You're saying here that you don't have enough money to make quality units of your own. I guess this depends on the faction, but I've never really had trouble with gold. I always play as dwarves though, and dwarves are known for their riches

I'm talking about finding a way to encourage the enemy A.I. to recruit smaller numbers of high quality units instead of spamming large numbers of cheap, weak snaga orcs.

[Hijack5oh]

I do not understand your theory. Since my economy for each faction is a piece of trash I do not understand how the less-spamming theory would work. I used 1 army of Militia units ( cavalary,archers,swordsmen ) to defeat about 6-7 stacks of weak orc units. But since I didn't have any money, I couldn't do anything. I ended up facing huge armies of trolls and uruks against my tiny militia army. How do you have enough money rather than like 500g-1000g per turn to actually make quality units?

This is really a great tactic for my silvian evles because the archers pick off 2000-3000 of the 5000k+ armies i face so the rest is left to my cavalry units who run down routed enemies and my 5-6 infantry units that route the rest of their army my archers have 5 exp or higher and my calvalry is maxed because of capturing so many orcs and i only have 3 units of cavalry. Elven units all have great stats even for mele with archers so resorting to hand to hand agaist mindless orcs insnt a problem. The big thing is i hardly have any other military besides this and ive iliminated OotMM in like 15 turns by killing their faction leader. This kinda upset me so i turned to isegard and im facing full stacks of elite isengard units at turn 58 and it makes fighting them more funn. the expense thing is all about taxing, building population buildings and establishing mass trade with everyone you can

[C.Maximus]

This is really a great tactic for my silvian evles because the archers pick off 2000-3000 of the 5000k+ armies i face so the rest is left to my cavalry units who run down routed enemies and my 5-6 infantry units that route the rest of their army my archers have 5 exp or higher and my calvalry is maxed because of capturing so many orcs and i only have 3 units of cavalry. Elven units all have great stats even for mele with archers so resorting to hand to hand agaist mindless orcs insnt a problem. The big thing is i hardly have any other military besides this and ive iliminated OotMM in like 15 turns by killing their faction leader. This kinda upset me so i turned to isegard and im facing full stacks of elite isengard units at turn 58 and it makes fighting them more funn. the expense thing is all about taxing, building population buildings and establishing mass trade with everyone you can

Before 1.2... before the silivan even had ENTS... I took over all of middle earth with the Siliven elves... easily almost with my archers... simply becaues I would take out half the army with archers then pick off the rest with horse archers and light infantry.... was not too fun.. but I did take over middle earth with a bright green color... *shrugs* my 1 HALF STACK of bowmen could hold the gates of mordor for countless turns as i moved full stacks into their territory... ONLY thing that gave me .. were the big trolls... other then that... well pin cusioned orcs.

[DeliCiousTZM]

Look its just a boredom issue. it gets repedative to keep fight 2-5 big battles every turn sometimes you wanna rest. have a fight free turn. I know what you mean thats the reason i dont play Gondor or Mordor anymore take a smaller faction relax be cool build a tavern you know what i mean cause the hordes my friend... They never stop coming. Never got that issue as dwarfs thou.

[Misha97]

So everyone plays for the dwarves to have a nice easy campaign. The problem is that dwarf cavalary and archers are rare. So all you do is ram infantry vs. infantry.

[Point Blank]

In terms of RR/RC I am aware of this issue, particularly in regards to Mordor, which is caused by several reasons (AI cash bonus, bonus recruitment slots at some settlements for evil factions, reduced cost for some evil units etc), and which will be looked into for next update.

[poetic totalwar]

In terms of RR/RC I am aware of this issue, particularly in regards to Mordor, which is caused by several reasons (AI cash bonus, bonus recruitment slots at some settlements for evil factions, reduced cost for some evil units etc), and which will be looked into for next update.

I see. Wow, I'm so glad that a real modder is looking into this. I probably would have blown up my pc if I did the editting myself.

[Point Blank]

Well, as you have seen, being a 'real' modder just means I have the knowledge to screw the game up in a much more specific fashion than a 'non-modder' does...

[Aikanár]

Well, as you have seen, being a 'real' modder just means I have the knowledge to screw the game up in a much more specific fashion than a 'non-modder' does...

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

The whole point is that you stop caring about heroic victories. Getting a heroic victory should feel awesome. It should mean that you've done some real damage to an opponent and that you've had an exceptional fight.

In TATW, heroic victories are normal ... and there are way too many of them. As far as battles go, heroic victories are even a necessity. Also, slaughtering an enemy stack to the last man with a couple of hundred troops means absolutely nothing ... after all, 3482675 more stacks will be inbound within a couple of turns.

Isn't fighting countless battles the essence of any Total War game?