Anti-intellectualism in Politics and Culture

[tullyccro]

A few comments and posts at twcenter made me consider starting a discussion on this topic. To be honest, so did the 4 Budweisers I just drank.

Je suis American so I'm going to stick with my naive American perceptions of how this phenomenon works in the world. Forgive me my arrogant provincialisms.

It seems to me that the French have a very lively public intellectual tradition, possibly spanning back to the salon days but I'm not certain. At any rate, it seems that intellectuals on the continent and especially in France are in the public eye more often and are able to get platforms for their ideas. It also seems they aren't immediately met with mistrust, hatred and envy, but again, I'm inherently a bigoted American I suppose by virtue of my limited cultural radar this could be absolutely wrong. (Foucalt comes to mind though, or the tabloids stalking Sartre)

In Britain, it seems to me that great men and women of science and education are placed next to war heroes as national heroes, assets, and so on. Take Isaac Newton for example or Francis Bacon. Britain has a great university tradition at least, both theological and otherwise. So to me it seems that in part this kind of valuing of intellectual activity isn't limited to continental Europe but extends to England and the British Isles as well. Same goes for fine art.

But, a few thousand miles over the ocean and we hate intellectuals. Hate them. I suppose I should define my terms here first.

By "intellectual" I don't mean someone who is intelligent, well-spoken or even inventive. I've encountered just as many intelligent farmers, stone-masons, and construction workers as I have professors, academics and so-called "professionals" like lawyers, architects and CEO's.

I'm saying that in America at least, there is no reverence for thought in itself, speculative or intuitive thought or reasoning, philosophizing, and if anything there is hatred for any kind of thought, ideas, actions, that seem to fly in the face of utilitarianism. Things must have uses. "Real-world" applications. Assembly-line strategies.

We hate intellectualism and we hate intellectuals even more. Stephen Hawking interests us only because he appears to be some kind of P.T. Barnum-esque curiosity, not for his ideas.

I think our credo in terms of science, philosophy or thinking is intimately tied in with turning these things towards making a buck in the end or a product, perhaps. Everything else is superfluous. Hence the hatred of refinement, whether in philosophy or the arts.

I guess a few of my questions for posters would be, does this mentality seem to be gaining ground elsewhere? Is it truly an American phenomenon? Is it tied in with religiosity?

Also, in America we have special euphemisms to discourage thinking. We say things like "it's common sense" or in the case of George Bush II we learned that he "goes from the gut." If anything, we have a great tradition of misquoting Thomas Paine pamphlets (an Englishmen, the irony never ends) in regards to common sense especially.

Are there other cultural equivalents of American "common sense?"

Cheers,

[Phier]

Je suis American so I'm going to stick with my naive American perceptions of how this phenomenon works in the world. Forgive me my arrogant provincialisms.

You know it would have been a lot shorter to write, "I'm left wing"

Anyways, I think you misinterpretation a bit of the concept of being anti-intellectual. Americans love smart people, but smart people who DO things.

My father told me years ago something that stuck with me. The problem with people who read all the time is they never DO anything. Many "intellectuals" fall into this.

Just being smart and talking about how smart you are and how you, who are so smart, have a plan that will make it all better for us, who are not so smart, just doesn't work.

[nopasties]

I could be totally off the mark, Europe had a long tradition of aristocratic intellectuals. The US never really established that self regarded class. Many of the American wealthy were self made. The American tradition relied on accomplishments and not a leisurely pursuit of knowledge such as inherited wealth brings.

Intellectuals have a place in society and are underappreciated in America. We certainly have our intellectuals but respect is something they don't get for being an intellectual.

[Phier]

I could be totally off the mark, Europe had a long tradition of aristocratic intellectuals. The US never really established that self regarded class. Many of the American wealthy were self made. The American tradition relied on accomplishments and not a leisurely pursuit of knowledge such as inherited wealth brings.

Intellectuals have a place in society and are underappreciated in America. We certainly have our intellectuals but respect is something they don't get for being an intellectual.

This is a good observation, the lack of the aristocratic elite in the US has removed that sort of privileged class which even today is looked down on by both the self made rich and the poor in the US today.

Where I fail to see is what place such a person has or how they can be under appreciated. Smart people can be amazingly stupid when it comes to humanity as a whole and that tends to be where some elements of society lament the lack of intellectualism, in other words politics.

[nopasties]

Where I fail to see is what place such a person has or how they can be under appreciated. Smart people can be amazingly stupid when it comes to humanity as a whole and that tends to be where some elements of society lament the lack of intellectualism, in other words politics.

I generally look at intellectuals as digesting and disseminating knowledge. Too much intellectualism breeds crazy stuff like pure communists but the US IMO needs more people to think deeply about the world, life, the country and where we are going. A lot of stuff coming from intellectual circles is annoying but it really is up to society to absorb and experiment with the theorectical ideas intellectuals synthesize. The rest of society is the 'common sense' for intellectual answers. Sometimes the problems in the world need a more dynamic and deep answer.

This is a good observation, the lack of the aristocratic elite in the US has removed that sort of privileged class which even today is looked down on by both the self made rich and the poor in the US today.

Shows like MTV cribs and the celebrity cultism I believe is our version of respecting elites. I see this as our failure, culturally the European aristocracy had a sense of responsibility and intellectualism was a respectable way to use their priviledged leisure.

[Phier]

I generally look at intellectuals as digesting and disseminating knowledge. Too much intellectualism breeds crazy stuff like pure communists but the US IMO needs more people to think deeply about the world, life, the country and where we are going. A lot of stuff coming from intellectual circles is annoying but it really is up to society to absorb and experiment with the theorectical ideas intellectuals synthesize. The rest of society is the 'common sense' for intellectual answers. Sometimes the problems in the world need a more dynamic and deep answer.

I don't see any answers for society as a whole coming from those who are really a step removed from society. The problem with most 'pure' intellectuals is they lack real life experiences. Its one thing to talk about how they think it should work, but another thing to live it. Does said intellectual know say the fear and stress of running a small business where failure means total economic ruin for the investor? Empathy only goes so far. If I want economic policy who should I ask, the guy who thinks about economic policy all the time as a theoretical, or the guy who started as a street vendor and now heads a multi-national corporation?

Shows like MTV cribs and the celebrity cultism I believe is our version of respecting elites. I see this as our failure, culturally the European aristocracy had a sense of responsibility and intellectualism was a respectable way to use their priviledged leisure.

I think you overestimate the importance of this sort of thing. While I think there isn't enough promoting of science and the like in the mainstream these days, for most Americans some rich douche on TV isn't his role model either, at least not those who matter.

[bushbush]

My father told me years ago something that stuck with me. The problem with people who read all the time is they never DO anything. Many "intellectuals" fall into this.

if yuo wanna do the right things these days for people you care, u gotta do A LOT of readings first....


i ing hate schools.

[Jabberwock]

America doesn't revere intellectuals individually. We revere the institutions and organizations that contain them like universities and think-tanks.

I'm saying that in America at least, there is no reverence for thought in itself, speculative or intuitive thought or reasoning, philosophizing, and if anything there is hatred for any kind of thought, ideas, actions, that seem to fly in the face of utilitarianism. Things must have uses. "Real-world" applications. Assembly-line strategies.

America has always been a pragmatic country. We thrive on pragmatism. Many would say that is the reason for our current status in the world.

[Ummon]

Anyways, I think you misinterpretation a bit of the concept of being anti-intellectual. Americans love smart people, but smart people who DO things.

My father told me years ago something that stuck with me. The problem with people who read all the time is they never DO anything. Many "intellectuals" fall into this.

I find this rather strange. Ideas for publications are produced more easily by those having an extensive culture, for example. That is, if they are creative.

But if you mean the kind of intellectual who looks like I'm so chic and trendy in the general opinion, of course, that's not really off the mark.

[removeduser_487563287433]

A few comments and posts at twcenter made me consider starting a discussion on this topic. To be honest, so did the 4 Budweisers I just drank.

Je suis American so I'm going to stick with my naive American perceptions of how this phenomenon works in the world. Forgive me my arrogant provincialisms.

It seems to me that the French have a very lively public intellectual tradition, possibly spanning back to the salon days but I'm not certain. At any rate, it seems that intellectuals on the continent and especially in France are in the public eye more often and are able to get platforms for their ideas. It also seems they aren't immediately met with mistrust, hatred and envy, but again, I'm inherently a bigoted American I suppose by virtue of my limited cultural radar this could be absolutely wrong. (Foucalt comes to mind though, or the tabloids stalking Sartre)

In Britain, it seems to me that great men and women of science and education are placed next to war heroes as national heroes, assets, and so on. Take Isaac Newton for example or Francis Bacon. Britain has a great university tradition at least, both theological and otherwise. So to me it seems that in part this kind of valuing of intellectual activity isn't limited to continental Europe but extends to England and the British Isles as well. Same goes for fine art.

But, a few thousand miles over the ocean and we hate intellectuals. Hate them. I suppose I should define my terms here first.

By "intellectual" I don't mean someone who is intelligent, well-spoken or even inventive. I've encountered just as many intelligent farmers, stone-masons, and construction workers as I have professors, academics and so-called "professionals" like lawyers, architects and CEO's.

I'm saying that in America at least, there is no reverence for thought in itself, speculative or intuitive thought or reasoning, philosophizing, and if anything there is hatred for any kind of thought, ideas, actions, that seem to fly in the face of utilitarianism. Things must have uses. "Real-world" applications. Assembly-line strategies.

We hate intellectualism and we hate intellectuals even more. Stephen Hawking interests us only because he appears to be some kind of P.T. Barnum-esque curiosity, not for his ideas.

I think our credo in terms of science, philosophy or thinking is intimately tied in with turning these things towards making a buck in the end or a product, perhaps. Everything else is superfluous. Hence the hatred of refinement, whether in philosophy or the arts.

I guess a few of my questions for posters would be, does this mentality seem to be gaining ground elsewhere? Is it truly an American phenomenon? Is it tied in with religiosity?

Also, in America we have special euphemisms to discourage thinking. We say things like "it's common sense" or in the case of George Bush II we learned that he "goes from the gut." If anything, we have a great tradition of misquoting Thomas Paine pamphlets (an Englishmen, the irony never ends) in regards to common sense especially.

Are there other cultural equivalents of American "common sense?"

Cheers,

Very interesting post, I agree entirely. There's certainly nothing like the anti-intellectualism that's found in the USA in any other place I have been to.

[Phier]

Very interesting post, I agree entirely. There's certainly nothing like the anti-intellectualism that's found in the USA in any other place I have been to.

And what did you do in the US to get this experience?

[removeduser_487563287433]

And what did you do in the US to get this experience?

Texas.

[Rich86]

In Britain, it seems to me that great men and women of science and education are placed next to war heroes as national heroes, assets, and so on.

That won't be the case soon....the average British person on the street can probably tell you what happened on Big Brother last night - but more than likely would be unable to name one currently living person who is greatly contributing to science and/or education.


Perhaps the problem is people no longer see the point in being intellectual? Kids growing up are told through TV programes and advertising that money is good, sex is good, fame is good. They then see talentless morons who've contributed pretty much nothing to the world on the front pages of 'Hello' magazine and read about how these talentless oxygen thieves live in huge mansions and basically make money from 'being famous' - and these kids think that could be me....

[removeduser_487563287433]

Yes but the average British person doesn't build statues. Remember, this country is run by Radio 4 listeners, not the plebs.

[Marie Louise von Preussen]

No to offend anyone but the Americans are indeed intellectually crude and a bit of unimaginative, especially in more abstract fields like speculative philosophy and the likes. They bear an uncanny resemblance with Rome in that aspect, where they merely copy as much as they can in fields of "non-interest", like those pesky things that are as relevant and deep but cannot make you a functional engine or building, and trot the Globe without understanding much of it besides superficial things.

That's also why intellectuals have a penchant for calling them barbaric, after all. But then, it's not that the intellectual world of Paris, with its love of postmodernist criticism and skepsis, stands much beyond. What the average Joe never knows is that the world of ideas can be as rich as the world of things, but that needs you to take out the Utilitarian facade first. WHICH alas, they never will - The American mind, being a product of first the Enlightenment and then the XIX century, which was comparatively poor in metaphysical ideas, is wholly practical and mechanical.

That allows them to be a world power in economic ideas, but in philosophical depth they are as much "productive" as their closer kin were, which means not better than your average Thai monk or new age guru holding half-baked spiritualism and philosophical conceptions. Back to Rome, they are a good analogy to the Roman world, its businessmen and lawyers as Europe was with the Greek one, with its philosophers, idealists and to a lesser extent explorers.

[Marie Louise von Preussen]

Where I fail to see is what place such a person has or how they can be under appreciated. Smart people can be amazingly stupid when it comes to humanity as a whole and that tends to be where some elements of society lament the lack of intellectualism, in other words politics.

That really depends. Leibniz, which is Odo's avatar, was a visionary - He devised for Louis XIV an "Egypt first" strategy in 1672 which was still being read by Napoleon, and which considered the ownership of Egypt vital for world Imperial domination - As the Suez venture would later prove to Britain. Leibniz was trying to get Louis' hands off the German states, and that was by far his best argument.

Today, of course, it might be a different matter... That's why I partly agree with you.

[seal]

I believe the European advantages in intellectual fields are a tad bit overstated. Great thinkers can be found just about anywhere if one looks for them. With the exception of the OP's French examples of Foucalt and Sartre, the rest of the given examples were gentlemen who lived and died some three hundred years ago. Has the United States been completely devoid of philosophers?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...n_philosophers

Many of these scholars are certainly not well known outside of their own circles, but I would contend that if I randomly walked up to someone on the streets of Paris, and asked them of their opinions Jean-Paul Sartre's novel La Nausée, I imagine I woud get a similar blank stare to one in the US if I asked about Ralph Waldo Emerson's views on rugged individualism and self-dependance.

Can one deny the formidable intellects of Thomas Edison, Milton Friedman, and Albert Einstein (whom I will claim as American)? Whereas many European intellectuals focus on abstract ideas, American intellectuals focus on practical ideas and innovations, perhaps as a by-product of our colonial and frontier history.

I recall one night in Germany in 2000 when every single TV channel was focused on a band called No Angels, a horrible studio-produced teeny pop girl band. Pop culture and mass media have been the death of intellectualism, not just in the United Staes, but in Europe as well.

[Desperado †]

Pop culture and mass media have been the death of intellectualism, not just in the United Staes, but in Europe as well.

No, it's just that we don't remember all the non-intellectuals and illiterates who used to live at the time of these great scholars, and forget to look at the many great minds we have today.

The difference is that today the majority of Europe and America has access to massive amounts information, but when faced with so much so easily (most of which isn't of use in day to day life) the enthusiasm is easily killed - not to mention that there is so much biased and incorrect information to be had.

[seal]

No, it's just that we don't remember all the non-intellectuals and illiterates who used to live at the time of these great scholars, and forget to look at the many great minds we have today.

The difference is that today the majority of Europe and America has access to massive amounts information, but when faced with so much so easily (most of which isn't of use in day to day life) the enthusiasm is easily killed - not to mention that there is so much biased and incorrect information to be had.

Fair enough, I would buy that line of thinking.

Average Americans tend to be suspicious of those more intelligent than they.

I have honestly never seen an example of that.

[nopasties]

I have honestly never seen an example of that.

You need to go in areas considered redneck....