Suggested Changes to Elven Recruitment

[Theodotos I]

Okay, first I’d like to thank the creators of this fantastic mod, both for giving me many hours of exciting gameplay, and for introducing me to the world of J.R.R. Tolkien.
Yes, before the release of TA:TW, I had never read a Tolkien book or watched any of the LOTR trilogy, though I had heard of his work.
Now, having read the books and watched the movies, I enjoy the mod even more, but after finishing a campaign with the Silvan Elves, I think there’s a few changes which could be made to Elven recruitment to more accurately reflect the time of the Third Age.
I won the campaign(short campaign) by flooding Mordor with thousands of Elven archers, but in the latter years of the Third Age, that would have been impossible. Even in the Elder Days and the predominance of the Firstborn, Elven armies were limited in number, and by the Third Age, their time was passing.
Therefore, I’d like to propose several changes to their recruitment, perhaps for a future release, that would more accurately represent Tolkien’s world.
First off, that their unit size be reduced, from 150(on Large size) to 100. Perhaps their stats could be tweaked to compensate if need be, but still, a smaller unit, fewer Elves.
Secondly, that cultural conversion rates be lessened, and the culture percent needed for Elven units be increased. For instance, before game’s end, I was recruiting Heavy Archers in Barad-Dur, which I don’t think is probable in Tolkien’s world. Perhaps elite Elvish units should require 90-100% cultural support.
Thirdly, that their recruitment pools should be significantly reduced, so that the likelihood of the player fielding multiple full stacks is diminished.
Fourthly, that recruitment pools be reduced further through reforms as the game continues, to represent even more Elves leaving for the Undying Lands.

So, that’s just my thoughts on the subject. You’ve all made a great mod. Thanks, guys.

[Lordinquisitor]

May i suggest the sub-mod RC/RR then? It changes the overall balance to be more lore accurate. Elves for example got very small units with even smaller recruitment pools and large refilling times.

Additionally there is an lore-submod included, which should make it impossible to recruit, lets say, eldar lancers far away from the starting locations.

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=259833

[Theodotos I]

Thanks. I hadn't noticed that submod, surprisingly enough. Still, I would like to see these changes incorporated into the full-game. RR/RC is not one of the submods announced to be included in 1.2.

[Jean=A=Luc]

Thanks. I hadn't noticed that submod, surprisingly enough. Still, I would like to see these changes incorporated into the full-game. RR/RC is not one of the submods announced to be included in 1.2.

As far as I know there are plans to eventually incorporate RC/RR into the official release but only after much more polishing has been done.

[xian]

And I hope it won't.


Playing with just 2 unit (which are recruitable every 7 turns...) just doesn't fit into my definition of fun.

[el Cid]

And I hope it won't.


Playing with just 2 unit (which are recruitable every 7 turns...) just doesn't fit into my definition of fun.

Well spoken!

[hyunkel]

I've been playing Silvan Elves with RR/RC.
During early game, even the basic spearman is indispensable as it refills only every 10 turns. You're hard pressed to keep every single man(elf) alive, which is what playing elves should really be like.

I'd say RR/RC is a different kind of fun, certainly not for everyone, but fun still, and somewhat more immersive, at least for me.

[SigniferOne]

How about: setting Elven pools to huge numbers (e.g. 35 units recruitable instantly), but changing the replenishment rate to zero? That way yes, you have a lot of initial armies, but what's there is all you got, and you will never get additional armies throughout the entire length of the game.

[King Canute]

but, that would mean one loss and your screwed
i like the rc/rr idea. the amount of lore going into this mod cant override gameplay, then it is no longer a game

[gaunty14]

but, that would mean one loss and your screwed
i like the rc/rr idea. the amount of lore going into this mod cant override gameplay, then it is no longer a game

just edit the export_descr buildings

I changed some stats, so the pool refills after 4 turns for many units (except trolls etc) I simply don't recruit units that often.
But I can if the need arises

[STELLover]

How about: setting Elven pools to huge numbers (e.g. 35 units recruitable instantly), but changing the replenishment rate to zero? That way yes, you have a lot of initial armies, but what's there is all you got, and you will never get additional armies throughout the entire length of the game.

You mean something like this?

[Magicana]

Hopefully RC/RR will not be put into the main mod. This is a Total War game, not a Lord of the Rings game. What is the point if you are limited to such an extent that it becomes impossible to win?

[STELLover]

Rather, I agree RC/RR should be kept, but raising all elven stats from 1 hitpoint to 2 hitpoints, and bodyguards to 4 hitpoints

[Gothic Revenge]

I hope I won't see this idea, come into practice. You could limit yourself in only playing with 2 Eldar Archer units through the
whole game. Especially I don't like to see the stats tweaked or the numbers.... It is fine as it is!

[hyunkel]

1 hitpoint for elves makes more sense. They are not exactly a hearty or brawny kind of people. They are more well known for their grace and agility, which is already reflected by their mightily high defense rating.
Elf generals can always try to rack up more hitpoints via retinues and ancillaries.

[Coxy]

Personally I don't see what is wrong with the current system - I know people harp on about lore, but personally I'm happy to have a TW game set in the lord of the rings universe, and am happy with how it is now. I did try the RC/RR sub mod, but I preferred it without so got rid of it, I'm a traditionalist.

[MDT]

I am also happy as it is, perhaps the required cultural level could be adapted from RC/RR but I like the unit sizes and replenishment rates more as they are now.

[bentlemp]

I'd like to see a poll conducted over whether or not the community thinks RR/RC is more lore-centric or whether or not they want it included in future vanilla releases

[MDT]

I'd like to see a poll conducted over whether or not the community thinks RR/RC is more lore-centric or whether or not they want it included in future vanilla releases

I think there is no doubt, that RC/RR is more lore accurate, the interesting question is the second one!
And I personally don't want to sacrifice too much playability for lore accuracy. And up to now

How about: setting Elven pools to huge numbers (e.g. 35 units recruitable instantly), but changing the replenishment rate to zero? That way yes, you have a lot of initial armies, but what's there is all you got, and you will never get additional armies throughout the entire length of the game.

is the most lore accurate proposal, and I don't think it would really be fun to play (you would have to rush and the "economic" part of the game would be lost).

[Mithrandir]

Rather, I agree RC/RR should be kept, but raising all elven stats from 1 hitpoint to 2 hitpoints, and bodyguards to 4 hitpoints

We already went through this in the RC thread... not gonna happen. And even I think RC/RR is better kept as a sub-mob; it's not for everyone.