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Thread: Adding “depth” to Kingdom of Jerusalem faction (advice needed :)

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  1. #1

    Default Adding “depth” to Kingdom of Jerusalem faction (advice needed :)

    WARNING: PREPARE FOR the WALL OF TEXT

    Just so it is not misunderstood I am not asking any of things I think should be added to KOJ to be actually added to DLV, is is just my PERSONAL opinion that late game KOJ should have a bit more depth and I am asking for helpful advice .

    I have finished DLV 6.1 with Taiji’s BB (hard campaign / normal battle difficulty ) and about 2 weeks ago I started Kingdom of Jerusalem (ELO) campaign (V.HARD/V.HARD). Even before I started it, I noticed that available unit and building rosters, while historically accurate (well mostly ) seem to lack ANY units orbuildings that were invented/were used after about 13th century. Well from historic point this is quite fine ,since KOJ lost most of it’s power after battle of Hatin (1187) and fall of Jerusalem BUT considering the RRG nature of DLV mod and all the goodies you seem to get in later part of campaign (like insanely strong Reiters and Gothic knights on unit side or banks and printing press on building side when you play Germany/HRE).
    I felt that KOJ should definitely get a bit more buildings (btw I would really like to point that I really, REALLY love buildings that DLV adds to vanilla MTW2 and Kingdoms ). On building side I feel they should have banks (well for obvious reasons and regions around Jerusalem seem a bit poor at least in the beginning ). They should also have (at least I think they should ) military academy. My reasoning for this is: if KOJ actually developed into an empire instead of being destroyed, they would have started using professional armies for sure (now I am not quite sure what units they should get from those buildings I gave them same one’s the France’s gets – Mounted Archers and Gendarmes). I would appreciate any input posters can give me on what units they should actually get from Military Academy or should they get that line of building at all ( I control 14 settlements at the moment but I still haven’t built any of the buildings or units I added to KOJ). I also added music (theater and conservatorium) but I am not really sure IF it should be added. Also printing press seems like a building that developed KOJ might have used to a great affect, but considering what development of PP historically did to Catholicism, well just to say KOJ as protestant faction seems weird (but then again Poland and even Lithuania can build it I think ).
    printing_press city requires factions { hre, poland, lit, } and event_counter governor_present 1 and event_counter first_printing_press 1
    This could go on and on, leading to a real clutter of building options (like even adding baths and city plumbing for obvious reasons) so I would appreciate any input posters are willing to give me .
    On unit side I really feel they should get at least some gunpowder units so I added arquebusiers (they have a really nice gunpowder unit in vanilla Kingdoms). Adding Musketeers seems to be pushing it, though they would have almost certainly be used by KOJ empire (yes I am aware of how Kingdom of Jerusalem empire sounds ).
    Considering the still existing problems with crossbows (they seemed far less but still big after Taji fixed angle of shot) they should really have a nice late archer unit . I added an ability to recruit Dismounted French Archers but then again someone could say they would make their own version of Scots guard archers too.
    Also in historic campaign they start with really nice Templar and Hospitaler knights but later they don’t get anything better. Even worse is that KOJ doesn’t have any armor piercing cavalry ( I am referring to secondary weapons and suddenly late game KOJ cavalry units become…well quite stale compared to Turks and Egyptians. But then again someone will say they are meant to be played that way. I could counter those assertions with Kingdoms KOJ roster but then again I am looking for an input not for prolonged arguing . So what cavalry units should late game KOJ get in your opinion (remember we are talking about KOJ that not only survived but expanded around big areas of Middle east). I really think they should get few late game heavy cavalry units. I added already mentioned adding Gendarmes and I also added Lancers since they are so easy to add to KOJ (I never modded Total War game before so I went for units that are easy to mod, my 3D modeling skills would probably make you cry) feel I am transforming ELO in France too much..(

    Also an unrelated question about Lancers. From what I have seen Medieval 2 units use only 2 weapons and in Lancers case those are armor piercing spear with huge bonus (as it should be) and quite deadly sword (with pathetic charge bonus). Problem is those swords, while really nice against lightly armed cavalry, make them fear for their life fighting most far cheaper cavalry units of other factions that posses armor piercing secondary weapons (it is hilarious seeing Lancers get smashed by Scholarii). Considering they are supposed to be very close to bests cavalry unit in a game (and they are quite nice against targets without too much armor) I sort of think they should maybe be buffed versus other Heavy cavalry (Heavy Cavalry has a LOT of armor in Taiji's BB). I am not criticizing here I am just looking for input, and maybe an advice of how to change their secondary weapon without making it unbalanced (I know changing it to Quapukulu mace’s doesn’t change their weapons from sword models to maces model but Quapukulu mace stats seem fitting for an elite heavy cavalry unit that doesn’t use shield). Of course one could go on and on talking about how this needs bigger weapon; or that unit needs more armor upgrades (and where are my female generals wearing those revealing bikini chain armor ), but I am just looking for any input related to making KOJ faction more fun.

    And on the last note is there an easy way to change number of territories KOJ needs to posses in other to win a game. At the moment others need to control 75 territories while KOJ needs to control only. Of course one could counter that they need only 45 territories because they are not really meant for late game development or that you can continue easily to play after you conquer 45th province, if it is easy to change number of required territories for victory I would like to do so.



    All help and advices are appreciated .
    Last edited by Grimblade; June 12, 2009 at 11:22 AM.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Adding “depth” to Kingdom of Jerusalem faction (advice needed :)

    Oh I found descr_win_conditions.txt for Victory conditions. Not sure if it is the right one though (for changing how many territories you need to control to win).
    Just hope that changing victrory conditions want require a campaing restart because if it does then .

    (changed it to)
    elo
    hold_regions Jerusalem_Province Damascus_Province Constantinople_Province Mekka_Province Iconium_Province Baghdad_Province Cairo_Province
    take_regions 75
    Last edited by Grimblade; June 12, 2009 at 08:38 AM.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Adding “depth” to Kingdom of Jerusalem faction (advice needed :)

    If I could, then I would add Kingdoms Crusader intro ( im doing this myself, soon publish it in mini-mod)

    I would also add a Hospitaler house in Antioch and a Templar in Jerusalem. The Hospitaler house don't need to recruite units, because it's outdated. But it would add historical retinue for my generals.(Don't know if it's possible, but...)

    Militia Christie is the faction name, so it is mostly a militia faction. Can't recruite lots of templar down in levant from angry muslims(obvious reasons). So pro-Knights/sergeants must come from Crusades.

    I would however strengthen both the recruitment ability for Egyptian/turks/desert tribe, to make it more of a challenge. I seem to take a strong foothold, too early on when playing in levant.
    KoJ need more starting (knights/sergeants)units, but not good recruitment ability(in the start).
    Thorolf was thus armed. Then Thorolf became so furious that he cast his shield on his back, and, grasping his halberd with both hands, bounded forward dealing cut and thrust on either side. Men sprang away from him both ways, but he slew many. Thus he cleared the way forward to earl Hring's standard, and then nothing could stop him. He slew the man who bore the earl's standard, and cut down the standard-pole. After that he lunged with his halberd at the earl's breast, driving it right through mail and body, so that it came out at the shoulders; and he lifted him up on the halberd over his head, and planted the butt-end in the ground. There on the weapon the earl breathed out his life in sight of all, both friends and foes. [...] 53, Egil's Saga
    I must tell you here of some amusing tricks the Comte d'Eu played on us. I had made a sort of house for myself in which my knights and I used to eat, sitting so as to get the light from the door, which, as it happened, faced the Comte d'Eu's quarters. The count, who was a very ingenious fellow, had rigged up a miniature ballistic machine with which he could throw stones into my tent. He would watch us as we were having our meal, adjust his machine to suit the length of our table, and then let fly at us, breaking our pots and glasses.
    - The pranks played on the knight Jean de Joinville, 1249, 7th crusade.













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  4. #4

    Default Re: Adding “depth” to Kingdom of Jerusalem faction (advice needed :)

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackleaf-Wille View Post
    If I could, then I would add Kingdoms Crusader intro ( im doing this myself, soon publish it in mini-mod)

    I would also add a Hospitaler house in Antioch and a Templar in Jerusalem. The Hospitaler house don't need to recruite units, because it's outdated. But it would add historical retinue for my generals.(Don't know if it's possible, but...)

    Militia Christie is the faction name, so it is mostly a militia faction. Can't recruite lots of templar down in levant from angry muslims(obvious reasons). So pro-Knights/sergeants must come from Crusades.

    I would however strengthen both the recruitment ability for Egyptian/turks/desert tribe, to make it more of a challenge. I seem to take a strong foothold, too early on when playing in levant.
    KoJ need more starting (knights/sergeants)units, but not good recruitment ability(in the start).
    Agreed .

    Do you have any suggestions for adding units and buildings from 13th century and onwards? Maybe I should leave the unit and building roster as they are (I repeat again I really like added buildings in DLV) but it seems so nice to have some useful buildings and units available in late game, at least just for adding alternate build options and combat tactics. Sometimes those units can be overpowered (who said Reiters + Gothic knights ) but even then they are fun .

    I do feel that ALL factions should get Arquebusiers unit or equivalent though, and think KOJ should have a bank building options .

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