View Poll Results: Which am I?

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  • Right wing

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  1. #1
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    Default Left and Right

    Want people to tell me their opinion of me based on what I believe, and what I type on here. I've always identified as a Centrist, pretty much. The poll will be a straight Right or Left question. The reason being my arse is hurting from sitting on the fence for too long, the iron is consuming my soul.

    Here's my political profile.
    This is pretty much what I believe.

    "The Third Way is something different and distinct from liberal capitalism with its unswerving belief in the merits of the free market and democratic socialism with its demand management and obsession with the state. The Third Way is in favour of growth, entrepreneurship, enterprise and wealth creation but it is also in favour of greater social justice and it sees the state playing a major role in bringing this about. So in the words of... Anthony Giddens of the LSE the Third Way rejects top down socialism as it rejects traditional neo liberalism."
    Most significantly, Harold Macmillan, British Prime Minister from 1957 to 1963, based his philosophy of government on what he entitled in a book, The Middle Way (1938).
    One Nation Conservatism, or Tory Democracy, is a term used in political debate in the United Kingdom to refer to the left wing of the Conservative Party. The term denotes a political stance aspiring towards unity of the citizenry in the nation, as well as harmony between divergent classes and interest groups, as opposed to the societal polarisation seen in the likes of both militant socialism and Thatcherism.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Way_(centrism)
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Nation_Conservatism

    I am a bit hostile to both socialism/communism and to neo-Liberal/thatcherite/reaganist economics. Both are, and were, epic failures.

    The areas I care about most.


    • Free health/dental care,
    • good public services,
    • social justice,
    • low unemployment,
    • controlled beneficial immigration,
    • very, very hard on crime and criminals,
    • fiscal conservatism and balanced budget, spending restraint,
    • Euroscepticism,

    Also if you can be arsed, tell me what party I should be in as a result.

    Ask me any questions you want, and we'll discuss the whole field of political science if needed.



    PS. Mods don't move this thread, I plan to debate political philosophy.
    Last edited by Каие; December 29, 2010 at 06:15 PM.

  2. #2
    Their Law's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    It's hard to place you as you share both left and right ideologies, but i would say you're on the centre right of UK politics, mainly due to this line:

    • a completely easy, free, enterprising and innovative market


    But then my personal opinion on defining left and right is centered on economic policy so i'm likely to think that. The fact that i'm left as well tends to make me see everything in degrees of rightness so....

    I wouldn't recommend any party from personal beliefs as the notions that political parties actually care about personal belief over populist rhetoric is naive.

    Of course centre right of UK politics is left in the US so it's all relative.....

    Edit: Question, so you believe that economies should be unregulated (i'm sort of extrapolating that from the free market point) even if the welfare of people is not in the interest of the market? I mean i believe in a market that is free to expand and innovate, but i feel they must be controlled, otherwise we can end up with the likes of todays problems.


    Double Edit: Even though i feel you're centre right i've voted left as in the world scheme of politics you probably are.
    Last edited by Their Law; June 09, 2009 at 01:19 PM.
    "You have a decent ear for notes
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Their Law View Post
    It's hard to place you as you share both left and right ideologies, but i would say you're on the centre right of UK politics, mainly due to this line:

    • a completely easy, free, enterprising and innovative market


    But then my personal opinion on defining left and right is centered on economic policy so i'm likely to think that. The fact that i'm left as well tends to make me see everything in degrees of rightness so....

    I wouldn't recommend any party from personal beliefs as the notions that political parties actually care about personal belief over populist rhetoric is naive.

    Of course centre right of UK politics is left in the US so it's all relative.....

    Edit: Question, so you believe that economies should be unregulated (i'm sort of extrapolating that from the free market point) even if the welfare of people is not in the interest of the market? I mean i believe in a market that is free to expand and innovate, but i feel they must be controlled, otherwise we can end up with the likes of todays problems.
    If you're referring to the build up of debt culture, that was not the market creating anything and the people suffering and following, it was the market following the people. The people move markets. People wanted cheap credit with which to buy nice things, it blew up in our faces. People blamed the bankers, but without people and consumers banks are nothing.

    I can't see a situation where an expanding and growing market and businesses will seriously harm people in this day and age. I support minimum wage if that's what you mean, a higher one, and a big voluntary sector for the unemployed and those on welfare as well as workers rights as they are now, such as on safety, health and flexible working. The state should also subsidise infant child care for parents, being a conservative supporting and strengthening the family is one of the most important things.

    Does that answer your question?


    Quote Originally Posted by IrishHitman View Post
    How about killing him so I don't have to help pay €100,000 a year to keep him in prison?
    Or how about we make it so you pay less? I am no fan at all of the luxury that prisons have become. I'm a ''sentenced to 12 years hard labour'' kind of guy. But your precious European Human Rights courts kinda block that kind of thing...

  4. #4
    Their Law's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Яome kb8 View Post
    If you're referring to the build up of debt culture, that was not the market creating anything and the people suffering and following, it was the market following the people. The people move markets. People wanted cheap credit with which to buy nice things, it blew up in our faces. People blamed the bankers, but without people and consumers banks are nothing.

    I can't see a situation where an expanding and growing market and businesses will seriously harm people in this day and age. I support minimum wage if that's what you mean, a higher one, and a big voluntary sector for the unemployed and those on welfare as well as workers rights as they are now, such as on safety, health and flexible working. The state should also subsidise infant child care for parents, being a conservative supporting and strengthening the family is one of the most important things.

    Does that answer your question?
    Yes it does thanks for the quick reply. You're explanation of the crisis is surprisingly similar to my own, though i guess we differ on the solution required. +rep
    "You have a decent ear for notes
    but you can't yet appreciate harmony."

  5. #5

    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Яome kb8 View Post
    Or how about we make it so you pay less? I am no fan at all of the luxury that prisons have become. I'm a ''sentenced to 12 years hard labour'' kind of guy. But your precious European Human Rights courts kinda block that kind of thing...


    I'm very pro-EU, that doesn't mean I'm their lackie.

  6. #6
    Justice and Mercy's Avatar Praefectus
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    Left.

    But I call everyone left, so don't take it too personally.
    The powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the federal government are few and defined. Those which are to remain in the State governments are numerous and indefinite. The former will be exercised principally on external objects, as war, peace, negotiation, and foreign commerce; with which last the power of taxation will, for the most part, be connected. The powers reserved to the several States will extend to all the objects which, in the ordinary course of affairs, concern the lives, liberties, and properties of the people, and the internal order, improvement, and prosperity of the State. - James Madison

  7. #7

    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    You vote Tory, you're right.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    You're right wing I can tell these things.

    You also have that whole...Tory thing going on there
    Last edited by Helm; June 09, 2009 at 01:26 PM.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    Cowardly murder of an unarmed, defenceless and tied down man in the pursuit of petty vengeance and short term fulfilment.
    How about killing him so I don't have to help pay €100,000 a year to keep him in prison?

  10. #10
    ShockBlast's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    From a economical point of view do you want a legislation that will favor economical growth even if the lower and middle classes suffer or a legislation who will favor lowering the distance between the classes?

    When it comes to society it's easy to see that you fit into the center-left(social-democrat) category,social programs and law(no guns for civilians )


    In general, contemporary social democrats support:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy

    With the exception of immigration i see you fit well in the center-left category.
    Last edited by ShockBlast; June 09, 2009 at 01:34 PM.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by ShockBlast View Post
    From a economical point of view do you want a legislation that will favor economical growth even if the lower and middle classes suffer or a legislation who will favor lowering the distance between the classes?
    An example if you would? Like say, minimum wage? I support minimum wage.

    When it comes to society it's easy to see that you fit into the center-left(social-democrat) category,social programs and law(no guns for civilians )

    In general, contemporary social democrats support:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy

    With the exception of immigration i see you fit well in the center-left category.
    I do fit in quite well with that, except for one big factor I forgot to mention. I like low taxes and a balanced budget aimed at paying off debt.

    I have little interest in green taxes, even though I fully support the theories of global warming and what-not, as they are completely ineffective in a scientific sense, although I would leave it all to the free market to sort out, all the greatest innovations in history come from the free market, not governments. I hate the idea of taxing fuel so high, there is such a thing as fuel poverty. Cars are so bloody expensive in every way, from tax to insurance. Not good for the poor.

    I have no interest in spreading democracy, you can't force people to be democratic, they must evolve that way. It is painful and bloody, but all democracies suffered in their path to democracy, it is fanciful to believe otherwise.

    But I am confused now, since I agree with just about all of that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rt. Hon. Gentleman View Post
    Purely on the basis of your support for JCMD, I would call you a definite right winger, Rome! Then again, I don't think my opinion means too much to you these days...
    JCMD?

    edit: Got it. lol
    Last edited by Каие; June 09, 2009 at 02:15 PM.

  12. #12
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    You appear to be a right-leaning centrist, Rome.

  13. #13
    ShockBlast's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Яome kb8 View Post
    An example if you would? Like say, minimum wage? I support minimum wage.
    For example: flat tax or progressive tax?Minimum wage is center-left.
    I do fit in quite well with that, except for one big factor I forgot to mention. I like low taxes and a balanced budget aimed at paying off debt.
    Low taxes for the lower class,beween low and medium for middle class and beween medium and big for upper class,something like this?
    I have little interest in green taxes, even though I fully support the theories of global warming and what-not, as they are completely ineffective in a scientific sense, although I would leave it all to the free market to sort out, all the greatest innovations in history come from the free market, not governments. I hate the idea of taxing fuel so high, there is such a thing as fuel poverty. Cars are so bloody expensive in every way, from tax to insurance. Not good for the poor.
    Well if the people have an altenative,effective green fuel, i'm all for high taxation of focil fuel.Do you share this view?
    I have no interest in spreading democracy, you can't force people to be democratic, they must evolve that way. It is painful and bloody, but all democracies suffered in their path to democracy, it is fanciful to believe otherwise.
    I think they are thinking of promoting it but not impose it.
    But I am confused now, since I agree with just about all of that.
    Center-left when it comes to the society,between center-left and center when it comes to economy.
    You are are a social-democrat not 100% but you are.
    I have a gift for you: wear it with pride my friend because you know what it stands for.

    P.S. You will have to change your membership to Labour party. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labour_Party_(UK) They have both Social democracy and the Third way as doctrins.You will fit well there.

    The history of social democracy:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    The modern social democratic movement came into being through a break within the socialist movement in the early years of the twentieth century. Speaking broadly, this break can be described as a parting of ways between those who insisted upon political revolution as a precondition for the achievement of socialist goals and those who maintained that a gradual or evolutionary path to socialism was both possible and desirable.[1] Many related movements, including pacifism, anarchism, and syndicalism, arose at the same time; these ideologies were often promulgated by individuals who split from the preexisting socialist movement, and held a variety of quite different objections to Marxism. The social democrats, who had created the largest socialist organizations of that era, did not reject Marxism (and in fact claimed to uphold it), but a number of key individuals wanted to reform Marx's arguments in order to promulgate a less hostile criticism of capitalism. They argued that socialism should be achieved through evolution of society rather than revolution. Such views were strongly opposed by the revolutionary socialists, who argued that any attempt to reform capitalism was doomed to fail, for the reformers would be gradually corrupted and eventually turn into capitalists themselves.
    Despite their differences, the reformist and revolutionary branches of socialism remained united through the Second Internationale until the outbreak of World War I. A differing view on the legitimacy of the war proved to be the final straw for this tenuous union. The reformist socialists supported their respective national governments in the war, a fact that was seen by the revolutionary socialists as outright treason against the working class; in other words, the revolutionary socialists believed that this stance betrayed the principle that the workers of all nations should unite in overthrowing capitalism, and decried the fact that usually the lowest classes are the ones sent into the war to fight and die. Bitter arguments ensued within socialist parties, as for example between Eduard Bernstein, the leading reformist socialist, and Rosa Luxemburg, one of the leading revolutionary socialists within the SPD in Germany. Eventually, after the Russian Revolution of 1917, most of the world's socialist parties fractured. The reformist socialists kept the name social democrats, while many revolutionary socialists began calling themselves communists, and they soon formed the modern Communist movement. These communist parties soon formed an exclusive Third Internationale known globally as the Comintern.

    Following the split between social democrats and communists, another split developed within social democracy, between those who still believed it was necessary to abolish capitalism (without revolution) and replace it with a socialist system through democratic parliamentary means, and those who believed that the capitalist system could be retained but needed dramatic reform, such as the nationalization of large businesses, the implementation of social programs (public education, universal health care, and the like) and the partial redistribution of wealth through the permanent establishment of a welfare state based on progressive taxation. Eventually, most social democratic parties have come to be dominated by the latter position and, in the post-World War II era, have abandoned any commitment to abolish capitalism. For instance, in 1959, the Social Democratic Party of Germany adopted the Godesberg Program, which rejected class struggle and Marxism. While "social democrat" and "democratic socialist" continued to be used interchangeably, by the 1990s in the English-speaking world at least, the two terms had generally come to signify respectively the latter and former positions.
    In Italy, the Italian Democratic Socialist Party was founded in 1947, and from 1948 on supported the idea of a centrist alliance. Since the late 1980s, many other social democratic parties have adopted the "Third Way", either formally or in practice. Modern social democrats are generally in favor of a mixed economy, which is in many ways capitalistic, but explicitly defend governmental provision of certain social services. Many social democratic parties have shifted emphasis from their traditional goals of social justice to human rights and environmental issues. In this, they are facing an increasing challenge from Greens, who view ecology as fundamental to peace, require reform of money supply, and promote safe trade measures to ensure ecological integrity. In Germany in particular, Greens, Social Democrats, and other left-wing parties have cooperated in so-called red–green alliances. The present government in Norway is a red-green alliance.
    Last edited by ShockBlast; June 09, 2009 at 03:31 PM.

  14. #14
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Яome kb8
    That's the dilemma, Man. From what people have told me, despite the vote, in other threads looks like I am in fact a rotten Leftie.
    Well, using a far-right American's POV, yes you are And from a far-left American's POV, you don't go nearly far enough

  15. #15
    Lord Tomyris's Avatar Cheshire Cat
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    Looks like I've just tipped you in favour of the right-wing by one vote haha.


    Ex-Quaestor of TWC: Resigned 7th May 2004

  16. #16
    magpie's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    Well I would say, You are so far left of center you have struck the right wing side don't mind me. regards, magpie

    sponsered by the noble Prisca

  17. #17
    Lumina's Avatar Vicarius
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    I took a test once about this. I fell pretty close to a madly insane conservitive dictator we all remember as being insanely evil and murder loving.

    Funny that I never voted once for a Right Wing. Perhaps because they seem like idiots most of the time at least in my country, lesser idiots than the other idiots on the other side at least.

    "Courage is doing what you're afraid to do. There can be no courage unless you're scared."
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  18. #18
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by ShockBlast View Post
    For example: flat tax or progressive tax?Minimum wage is center-left.

    Low taxes for the lower class,beween low and medium for middle class and beween medium and big for upper class,something like this?
    Not quite. I support no income tax at all for the poorest on minimum wage. But no, maximum 40% on any rich people. I think they are taxed too much.

    Well if the people have an altenative,effective green fuel, i'm all for high taxation of focil fuel.Do you share this view?
    No. Fuel poverty is a big problem the poor cannot have such luxuries, my aim is to minimise burdens and lower the cost of living.
    Center-left when it comes to the society,between center-left and center when it comes to economy.
    You are are a social-democrat not 100% but you are.
    I have a gift for you: wear it with pride my friend because you know what it stands for.

    P.S. You will have to change your membership to Labor party. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labour_Party_(UK) They have both Social democracy and the Third way as doctrins.You will fit well there.

    The history of social democracy:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    The modern social democratic movement came into being through a break within the socialist movement in the early years of the twentieth century. Speaking broadly, this break can be described as a parting of ways between those who insisted upon political revolution as a precondition for the achievement of socialist goals and those who maintained that a gradual or evolutionary path to socialism was both possible and desirable.[1] Many related movements, including pacifism, anarchism, and syndicalism, arose at the same time; these ideologies were often promulgated by individuals who split from the preexisting socialist movement, and held a variety of quite different objections to Marxism. The social democrats, who had created the largest socialist organizations of that era, did not reject Marxism (and in fact claimed to uphold it), but a number of key individuals wanted to reform Marx's arguments in order to promulgate a less hostile criticism of capitalism. They argued that socialism should be achieved through evolution of society rather than revolution. Such views were strongly opposed by the revolutionary socialists, who argued that any attempt to reform capitalism was doomed to fail, for the reformers would be gradually corrupted and eventually turn into capitalists themselves.
    Despite their differences, the reformist and revolutionary branches of socialism remained united through the Second Internationale until the outbreak of World War I. A differing view on the legitimacy of the war proved to be the final straw for this tenuous union. The reformist socialists supported their respective national governments in the war, a fact that was seen by the revolutionary socialists as outright treason against the working class; in other words, the revolutionary socialists believed that this stance betrayed the principle that the workers of all nations should unite in overthrowing capitalism, and decried the fact that usually the lowest classes are the ones sent into the war to fight and die. Bitter arguments ensued within socialist parties, as for example between Eduard Bernstein, the leading reformist socialist, and Rosa Luxemburg, one of the leading revolutionary socialists within the SPD in Germany. Eventually, after the Russian Revolution of 1917, most of the world's socialist parties fractured. The reformist socialists kept the name social democrats, while many revolutionary socialists began calling themselves communists, and they soon formed the modern Communist movement. These communist parties soon formed an exclusive Third Internationale known globally as the Comintern.

    Following the split between social democrats and communists, another split developed within social democracy, between those who still believed it was necessary to abolish capitalism (without revolution) and replace it with a socialist system through democratic parliamentary means, and those who believed that the capitalist system could be retained but needed dramatic reform, such as the nationalization of large businesses, the implementation of social programs (public education, universal health care, and the like) and the partial redistribution of wealth through the permanent establishment of a welfare state based on progressive taxation. Eventually, most social democratic parties have come to be dominated by the latter position and, in the post-World War II era, have abandoned any commitment to abolish capitalism. For instance, in 1959, the Social Democratic Party of Germany adopted the Godesberg Program, which rejected class struggle and Marxism. While "social democrat" and "democratic socialist" continued to be used interchangeably, by the 1990s in the English-speaking world at least, the two terms had generally come to signify respectively the latter and former positions.
    In Italy, the Italian Democratic Socialist Party was founded in 1947, and from 1948 on supported the idea of a centrist alliance. Since the late 1980s, many other social democratic parties have adopted the "Third Way", either formally or in practice. Modern social democrats are generally in favor of a mixed economy, which is in many ways capitalistic, but explicitly defend governmental provision of certain social services. Many social democratic parties have shifted emphasis from their traditional goals of social justice to human rights and environmental issues. In this, they are facing an increasing challenge from Greens, who view ecology as fundamental to peace, require reform of money supply, and promote safe trade measures to ensure ecological integrity. In Germany in particular, Greens, Social Democrats, and other left-wing parties have cooperated in so-called red–green alliances. The present government in Norway is a red-green alliance.
    No way, man. I can't join Labour.

  19. #19
    ShockBlast's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Яome kb8 View Post
    Not quite. I support no income tax at all for the poorest on minimum wage. But no, maximum 40% on any rich people. I think they are taxed too much.
    No tax for the poorest?This is very left.Well i see that you ugree with progressive taxing.


    No. Fuel poverty is a big problem the poor cannot have such luxuries, my aim is to minimise burdens and lower the cost of living.
    You have a point there but doing something for a certin group of the society is left.

    No way, man. I can't join Labour.
    Oh come on you said it yourself you are a ''rotten leftie'' what are you doing in a center-right parasitical brainwashed capitalist group?
    Ok the Labour Party isn't exactly your party but you are center-left,what are you doing in a center-right party?
    I want to see the the Social Democrat sig attached to your signature.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Am I left wing or right wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Яome kb8 View Post
    No way, man. I can't join Labour.
    Not Labour Rome, I shouldn't need to remind you that the Liberal Democrats are not merely a continuation of the Liberal party. That is where the Social Democrats ended up, Labour are not Socialist or Social Democrat anymore, and I think you will find yourself agreeing with Lib-Dem policy on pretty much everything apart from Europe.


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