Lisbon Treaty

[Каие]

If you had a referendum on the Lisbon treaty how would you vote?

[Heinz Guderian]

yes.

[Каие]

Crapola I forgot to make it public. Can a moderator make the votes public please?

[VALIS]

I would vote no.

No more integration with the EU- land of the sodomite damned!

[Phalanx300]

No! We don't need Brussels to act as a super state, we'll get to decide on our own what happens in our country.

And besides, EU just needs to be a Economic and Military alliance, nothing more nothing less.

[skag]

No! We don't need Brussels to act as a super state, we'll get to decide on our own what happens in our country.

And besides, EU just needs to be a Economic and Military alliance, nothing more nothing less.

hmmm by the way, we'll not have a superstate with lisbon (1st)
and second, if there's a superstate, it's a state made of state, not a state with one ulgy dictator : brussel. It would be a superstate where your state is part of it ... just like a region is in your country. Well not exactly, but approximately

[Lord de Lyonesse]

No! We don't need Brussels to act as a super state, we'll get to decide on our own what happens in our country.

And besides, EU just needs to be a Economic and Military alliance, nothing more nothing less.

Even though when countries sign the charter into the EU it claims that 'nations will work together to achieve ever greater union' which implies military, economic and political so thats what it is a recipe for a super state.

I would say No because i want Britain to be FOE (Friend of Europe) my own political invention..

[Syron]

NO more loss of sovereignty

[Guilty_Stalker]

Definitely no. Last thing I want the EU to become is some sort of federalised superstate. I'm all for a common market, but that's it. No united military or anything like that. I'd rather member nations retained their sovereignty.

[Treize]

No...

[Каие]

Lisbon doesn't establish either of those.

[Guilty_Stalker]

Lisbon doesn't establish either of those.

It at least sets the path towards a superstate.

For example, the Lisbon Treaty states that, "the Union shall conduct, define and implement a common foreign and security policy, based on the development of mutual political solidarity". Basically, the EU shall more or less require member states to agree to a common foreign policy. If it was fully implemented, there would be no more independent foreign policy. Member states would be required to, "uphold the Union’s positions", in international organisations.

It would then require members to, "make civilian and military capabilities available to the Union for the
implementation of the common security and defence policy". No more independent defence policy.

We would not even be able to decide our own laws anymore, as, "the law adopted by
the Union on the basis of the Treaties have primacy over the law of Member States".

The Lisbon Treaty is basically the EU Constitution reworded, to be more obscure. It mightn't immediately set up a new EU superstate, but it provides the framework for one.

[Каие]

It at least sets the path towards a superstate.

For example, the Lisbon Treaty states that, "the Union shall conduct, define and implement a common foreign and security policy, based on the development of mutual political solidarity". Basically, the EU shall more or less require member states to agree to a common foreign policy. If it was fully implemented, there would be no more independent foreign policy. Member states would be required to, "uphold the Union’s positions", in international organisations.

Foreign policy must be unanimous, therefore states can disagree and be independent if they want.

It would then require members to, "make civilian and military capabilities available to the Union for the
implementation of the common security and defence policy". No more independent defence policy.

Didn't rad this, must have missed it, but the UK has an opt out so it doesn't bother me.

We would not even be able to decide our own laws anymore, as, "the law adopted by
the Union on the basis of the Treaties have primacy over the law of Member States".

This is already the case, but I agree with you.

The Lisbon Treaty is basically the EU Constitution reworded, to be more obscure. It mightn't immediately set up a new EU superstate, be it provides the framework for one.

Yep it's definitley the Constitution alright, and I do believe it was drafted and is driven by those who do want to see a Super state, Sarkozy and Merkel.

[antares24]

Yes, becouse it will make the EU more democratic by giving more powers to his elected body, the parliament.

Yes, becouse it will make the decision making process between the governments of the member states easier, with only the need of a qualified majority in the European council voting.

Yes, becouse it would give to the EU a sort of "foreign affairs minister" and a president, giving to Europe a common voice on important matters.

Yes, becouse it would eliminate a lot of the burocratic mess and reduce the number of commissioners.

Yes, becouse it would make the enlarged EU more manageable, and would also provide a secession procedure for those states that don't like to be in the EU.

To those Europeans that don't have the slightest idea of what the treaty say, read the summary of it on wiky : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lisbon_treaty considering that these days most of the law in the member states come from the EU this will be important for our future.

Oh and Brits, think of my last pro Lisblon point (about the secession procedure), maybe you should vote for it

[Thorn777]

Yes. Must...kill.....Americans.

[Каие]

Oh and Brits, think of my last pro Lisblon point (about the secession procedure), maybe you should vote for it

Well no, because it makes Britain pay a massive fine for what they ''benefited'' from the EU. Despite being a net contributor to the budget and contributing 1/4 of the GDP.

[Yorkshireman]

Definately NO. Maybe you should have split the poll into nationalities ?

[skag]

hmmm, i would vote yes, because i believe it would lighten up (in terms of weight, not light like sun) the bureacratuc processes of the EU, resulting in a diminution of the cost of EU with an increased speed of the processes. And i would vote yes to have a better cohesion for foreing policies.

But anyway, these are 11 years i live in Belgium, i never saw a referendum, so my opinion does not really matter, i vote people for choosing at my place, I believe they know what's better for my country

[Garrigan]

I think this is the official treaty, if anyone wants a read. I must admit I dont really know whats contained in it, so I'll have a quick peruse of it, and get back to you.

EDIT: And yes I did just use a hyperlink!

[Aldgarkalaughskel]

Voted yes, only viable option, except if you're fed with the latest propaganda of right-wing British parties.

Should of been a third option "Abstain", and a fourth option for non-EU citizens.