Divide And Conquer - An Expanded Faction Mod - Beta released! 3.99* series Sept 1st Oct ## NEWS! We have reached 31 faction limit !!! ##

[Brightgalrs]

Add some new cultures(religions). You can go up to 10.

[JonSnow]

Culture max is 6
religion max is 10
6 cultures are used
5 religions are used

[Brightgalrs]

Okay?

[JonSnow]

I was clarifying... I know YOU know but this whole double cultures is confusing

[Renown]

Okay?

Not sure if I'd even need to add more cultures? or religions.



Not really. Rangers are Dunedain (religion) and elves (culture) due to what I suspect they'd be living in (more camps, and less city, even if the change is only on the campaign map)

Unless I add Dunland, then I'd need to add some sort of wild religion, and give them the option of converting to Catholic (followers of melkor).

You can't change the Evil religions because they help organize the invasions (crusades).

The others are what..

Elvish, Northmen, Dunedain, and Dwarves right? so... what good would it do to split them up? I could see maybe for mixing recruiting pools (something I plan to do later... - allowing for certain realms to recruit certain 'good' or 'bad' units but I'm also planning to set up ZOR's like RTR did.)

As for cultures - We've got men, dwarves, orcs, elves, evil men, and gondor. Though I'll point out that i've not done culture editing Jonsnow - there are seven actually in the text files - Mesoamerican is the unused one. Not sure of why Gondor wasn't edited over it, maybe has some inbuilt script issues.. i suspect I'll find out if i decide to try to include another, but thats later... so far I'm sticking with what I've got.

[JonSnow]

Hmm if meso is usablle then I'd love an isengard culture...

[Renown]

Hmm if meso is usablle then I'd love an isengard culture...

I'll check it out. I'll also go rooting around on the forums for info on the hardcoded limits... christ, I swore to myself I'd never make another mod for M2TW its just so damn screwy, but... then these evil people had to make a fantastic mod of the LOTR...

I just can't wait till Empires is fully accessible..

[Renown]

Alright, my current status is pretty good. I've got the factions ingame now and working perfectly. Going to do some basic editing of the edus and add in some units I've appropriated (with permission) from a single mod. (Haven't approached others yet, been heavy into working the strat, and with the maps...text is FUN.. sigh)

Then I've got to do some unit balancing, and edu editing. Fun fun. Might have a barebones (without the graphics 2d/3d really implemented.)

Archaon is allowing me to implement his No Alliance warfare, which stops fighting between allies, and also has them assisting each other more often. Once I've got that inserted, I'll start to edit it with his assistance hopefully to really get factions behaiving like they should.

I'm also inserting family trees into most factions in either Teutonic or Normal modes. Teutonic would be Orcs/Rangers, Normal would be everything else. Princesses in some cases, where applicable. Dwarves ... are not something I even want to think about.

Once that is all done, I'll start editing the campaign script and get those pesky nazgul to spawn properly - though I might go off and ask permission to use one of the many useful nazgul sub-mods out there. I particularly like the respawning nazgul one.

I'm additionally working the ages, and such so they appear ingame as they should really.

My solution will be to up the old age to something ridiculous, as high as I can make it. so that the dunedain, elves, and dwarves don't die within the timeline of the game. I'll approach the situation of the Men of Dale/Bree/gondor/rohan and evil men seperately, and see whether or not i even really need to include death scripts (possible, but not something I look forward to gladly)

Families, and their expansion are something i'm going to be looking into heavily, as with certain factions (elves/dwarves/rangers) too many family members could literally overpower their enemies. (Yay for absolutely bad ass elf-lords and dwarven battlemasters, and sweet ambushing rangers). but... most of this is in the future.

[Beorn]

This looks promising...

[OSDEA7]

I'd suggest first of all asking other mods permission to use their units.. some units despite not being made for the LOTR world would fit in... I was taking a look at The Last Kingdoms units and thought to myself.. "wow, those units would be cool for Dale".. and I was looking at Ruischi and saw a few potential Eriador units (their woodsmen are awesome). So I suggest browsing and pming... interesting idea BTW but I wouldn't suggest making Moria a dwarf faction... they had an extremely small army there... at most make it owned by a small Erebor garrison.

Rusichi modders are giving permission to use there units.Just want credit.

[Turok]

Great idea and the sort of sub mod that I need. Keep going, I'm looking forward to this

[JorisofHolland]

I'd also like to encourage you! This is a really nice idea and I like it. I would offer help if I had time, but if I see what you have done I don't think I'll be very usefull and slow you down.

[Meneldil]

Being an old LotR fan, I'm kind of puzzled by the High Elf/Sylvan Elf/Dwarf factions, given that most of their provinces are indeed independant states.

Good luck with your project, I really look forward to it, if only to make the game harder and more interesting.

May I suggest you to add some neutral, possibly unplayable, factions using the existing models/slots, if there's still slots left ?

[Renown]

Being an old LotR fan, I'm kind of puzzled by the High Elf/Sylvan Elf/Dwarf factions, given that most of their provinces are indeed independant states.

Good luck with your project, I really look forward to it, if only to make the game harder and more interesting.

May I suggest you to add some neutral, possibly unplayable, factions using the existing models/slots, if there's still slots left ?

there is around 10 slots left. Currently the Dark lord is unplayable. I'll test it out, but playing as the "papal" state may make the game buggy.

I'm thinking about adding in some unplayable men/neutral factions (Dorwininion, Tribes of Rhovavion, Anduin Vale peoples *beornings, hobbits*) and maybe the Snow people of Forodwraith, but that one would certainly require new models.

I'm not going to add more evil factions or good (apart from the snow people) to the NW, because I can't fathom what else they would be. Even Angmar is a bit of a stretch.

But I'd add those after the initial release which is, btw, quite soon in coming. I'm just getting the units to their proper places, and then editing the names of the text. Once thats done later today I'll release it. After that, I'll go through and add in the new units, and start the balancing act. The diplomacy, names, and other features I'm adding in will be done one at a time to ensure errors dont creep in.

I've also added in a province which, I think was badly missing in this game - that is Tirith-Below-The-Walls. In this game, castles/citadels do not properly show that cities/castles were not necessarily one and the same, and that for the most powerful of fortifications the cities and castles were either quite seperate, or both quite large together. Minas Tirith and Gondor suffer from the fact that once Osgiliath is gone, Minas Tirith is a forgone conclusion. While this isn't against lore, Minas Tirith doesn't represent how MASSIVE the city/castle were. Thus I figured I'd split the two into two seperate placements, the citadel, and the city. That way the city can be taken but the citadel will remain. I've also added in the port of Edhellond (successful gondorian port - moreso than even Dol Amroth situated right beside it). Other than that, I've added some placements in the Anduin Vale - two are names from elvish construction of Gladden Fields. I do this because I plan to add a faction in there later.

I've also added some areas around Bree to allow for Bree to remain as large/yet disorganized as it was with Combe, Staddle, Archet, Bree, and the various shire/hobbit lands. I've included a "Ranger Camp" in the trollshaws, W of Rivendell, and also given them the arthedain province, amon sul, and evendim.

Later I plan to break up a bit of the Harad provinces (if they need it) as I've given 3 of them to Umber (North, South, and Central).


I will note and update my main post, that I'm after someone to help me with the 2d/3d graphics editing. I can do it, but its not my speciality, and will be put off until I've finished the other editing. (That would mean factions use the same banners, etc from TATW or even Vanilla, not game breaking, but not visually pleasing either)

Culture - I think i'm going to go back into cultures, and check the hardcoded limits for the future. I'd really like to place limitations on growth, that I think will be necessitated by culture checks.

[Hellenikon]

I was wondering how you´ll handle the small factions unit rosters, i mean, will every faction have at least some infantry-archers-cavalry?

For example, as i see Umbar on your list, will you add any sort of cavalry or heavy infantry to their roster? or wil they be composed only by the existing corsairs?

[Skeleton Of The West]

Its a great idea, and I loved some of the new factions, but there are some places where you are dividing too much for my opinion. With almost all good factions are minor, they wont stand much against the evil powers.

Anyway, sounds promising. I would really like to try it when it will be done.

[Renown]

I was wondering how you´ll handle the small factions unit rosters, i mean, will every faction have at least some infantry-archers-cavalry?

For example, as i see Umbar on your list, will you add any sort of cavalry or heavy infantry to their roster? or wil they be composed only by the existing corsairs?

well frankly, the north-western factions were occupied with their own issues, mainly "what to do today... hummm". Lindon, for the first time in all conflicts which involved the elves, did not participate, Rivendell barely helped. Bree did nothing, and the Rangers of the north sent 31 men. The dwarves of belegost were minimal in numbers and renown by this stage, the last they participated in anything was reclaiming erebor, and in that they had sent 3 dwarves alongside thorin, and... well, they were the least impressive three dwarves.

I've added Angmar and the evil men south of bree with a bit of artistic license, its 'possible' that conflict could have existed there.

Rohan/Gondor were really the only powers that stood in the way of Mordor/Isengard. The elves of Mirkwood, and lothlorien were preoccupied by dol guldur, Dale/Esgaroth and Erebor were also preoccupied by the wainriders/rhun.

I'm making the Ranger faction exist of no more than 3 units. I kid ye not. They will however be the three most powerful units in the game. Least numerous, but powerful. (I take this from considerations from the movie Hunt for Gollum, the books, and the other mythology that stated the Rangers fought more than any other faction besides Gondor to protect it's borders from dark evils, and goblins. ) - to win at all with the rangers you are going to need to keep ambushing them FAR away from your cities/camps)

Umbar will exist with corsairs , and small amounts of black numenorians. They will on a one - on -one battle with gondor be decimated, which is why they will focus on naval invasions and blockades etc.. leaving Harad to do the fighting S/SE of Gondor. (or so I hope).


I've removed the cavalry from the elves, because although they did use them in the first and second ages, I do not believe they would have used them to engage in combat in this period other than in ones and twos. Frankly they don't need it.

The Dwarves of Erebor are the only ones who get the 'special' dwarven units that are limited to the iron hills and erebor (unless they lose those provinces and Moria/Belegost happened to reconquer them.)

I'm keeping Mithlond warriors to Lindon, and thanks to permission to use certain new elven units, I'll spread them about appropriately.

I've removed both the Light Elven Archers, and the Elven swordsmen of the high elves. Even though I know they are limited in unit rosters, elven units are going to be appropriately bad ass, and look that way.

Angmar will use limited troops from the OOMM and Mordor's roster. Dol Guldur will use Mordor's roster though I plan to expand that to include certain nasty creatures in the future when I get about to it.

I'll be revising Harad's roster so that Umbar units aren't included.

I'll also be using the neutral/mercs to fill in some gaps in Umber/evil men and potentially bree.

I hope you expect the action to be in one of three areas. Gondor/Rohan, Mirkwood/Lothlorien/Dol Guldur, and Erebor/Dale.

I've no idea how Angmar will turn out yet, but remember as in the books the far NW wasn't touched by war, not really.

[Turok]

My main problem with the full mod is Eriador being a standalone faction capable of expanding and counquering. In reality they could never have been as unified as the mod suggests so I hope thid sub-mod changes that

[Renown]

My main problem with the full mod is Eriador being a standalone faction capable of expanding and counquering. In reality they could never have been as unified as the mod suggests so I hope thid sub-mod changes that

im trying.

[Hellenikon]

Thanks for the detailed answer

It looks like you have everything planned and well going, it would be really interesting to play a faction with a such limited roster as the dunedain of the north, or to try a desperate defense as the dwarves of Moria. You have there a few refreshing and interesting ideas, i´m now excited to give a try to your mod