Trolls to strong....

[bl4ckfox]

450 high elven elite archers shoot on 12 Olog-hai, 3times!!!! an no one go's down...

900 elves loosing 480 elite fighters against 12 Olog-hai and 12 mountain trolls,
thats much to stron (loosing 100-150 sounds "realistic")

(hope its the right forum...)

[Comrade the Colonel]

i agree, i had 3 units of trolls win against 1400 elves. (and thats just the mountain trolls)

[DoktorJ]

How are you guys building Troll Cages? I can't figure it out. I'm playing as Mordor and my castle meets the culture requirements, but they don't show up in the building browser or the building scroll. I can only see them if I click on a city and then go to the building browser then click castle.

[Borluc]

Doktor J you don't get access to the next tier until round 50. Then it takes round 100 for tier 3.

Also, I don't think trolls are overpowered. At least, not by much. I pinned a group of them down with my goblin infantry (4 units) and shot at them with snaga archers (4 units). Also, I had to shoot down 2 units of orc looters first.

The trolls killed around 300 goblins. I lost 100 more infantry from FF. Considering that my goblins are lowly orcs, that isn't so unreasonable when you are talking about 13 trolls. Their skin is impervious to normal weapons because its supposed to be like stone. They seem weak to massed archer fire.

I'm guessing that pike walls would be effective against them as well.

[BlackViper]

You have to pin them down. You've never met trolls before and they are diffirent you need to change tactics run and shoot doesn't work very well.
Engage them with canon fodder pin them down and then shoot the crap out of them. Also siege equipment like catapults are a real killer for them

[Krechet(SiCh)]

Trolls have high resistance to arrows. Just use any infantry to stop them and shot wwhile they are fighting. After first 2 trolls die - other would be killed from a few shots

[Mithrandir]

I agree that trolls are too strong, which is why I nerfed them in my EDU...

[Fev]

I agree that trolls are too strong, which is why I nerfed them in my EDU...

Really looking forward to it

[painter24]

I'm also of the opinion (Cave) Trolls are too strong. I had around 300 High Elven archers and a unit of Elven Spearmen left against 2.5 units of Trolls. The trolls were all that was left of the OoMM army sent against me, but I lost dismally to the trolls. The thing that annoys me is that even after every single Orc has been killed, including generals and unit captains, the trolls still run around with the same sense of purpose as when their masters were still alive. If not nerf the trolls, then maybe allow them to be routed when their unit captain is killed. Surely they would become headless chickens when their masters are dead, and cease to be a coherent part of the battle. Maybe they could "havoc" in the same way the vanilla elephants do?

[G.Seimore]

I disagree, trolls are to be feared and that is really nice in TATW, they are suppose to be a challange! I think stat wise they are perfect and in single player the AI usually does not field more than 3 units in a full stack, at least that's what I observed. ~So the only balance I see useful here would be to make them more expensive to purchase and to upkeep, EDIT: And maybe slow them down a bit, they are awfully fast on the battle field!

Playing as High Elves right now and to be honest I had mayor problems at first as well. My full stack army of mainly archers was slaughterd by a full stack of misty mountain snaga/spearmen with 2 and a half unit of trolls. I concentrated my fire on the trolls which was a big mistake. Slaughter the cheap masses first so you have more moverability and can free up units to pin down the trolls, since Archers alone are simply useless. Arrows don't do much damage to them. You have to pin them down first, then move archers around and use flaming missiles. Yes, you will hit your own troops as well, but the heck you fighting trolls!! This way you take them down! First the masses then the big boys and you win!

[painter24]

I disagree, trolls are to be feared and that is really nice in TATW, they are suppose to be a challange! I think stat wise they are perfect and in single player the AI usually does not field more than 3 units in a full stack, at least that's what I observed. ~So the only balance I see useful here would be to make them more expensive to purchase and to upkeep, EDIT: And maybe slow them down a bit, they are awfully fast on the battle field!

Playing as High Elves right now and to be honest I had mayor problems at first as well. My full stack army of mainly archers was slaughterd by a full stack of misty mountain snaga/spearmen with 2 and a half unit of trolls. I concentrated my fire on the trolls which was a big mistake. Slaughter the cheap masses first so you have more moverability and can free up units to pin down the trolls, since Archers alone are simply useless. Arrows don't do much damage to them. You have to pin them down first, then move archers around and use flaming missiles. Yes, you will hit your own troops as well, but the heck you fighting trolls!! This way you take them down! First the masses then the big boys and you win!

Thanks for the advice, i'll try it out. Just sent in 2 units of generals bodyguard and a unit of spearmen,........they killed one troll .............then I came back to check this thread in sheer desperation

[SmurfDude]

What a load of nonsense this thread is. Trolls are massive powerful beasts, they should be strong; especially when you consider OotMM are the weakest faction. There are ways of killing trolls without nerfing them, just use your bloody brains instead of crying that they are too strong just because they kill all your cavalry

The only change which might be needed is a slight increase in price.

[Krechet(SiCh)]

OooMM would have no chances opposite Silvans if Trolls would be weakned )

[Mithrandir]

I don't agree.

[Krechet(SiCh)]

I could destroy any 3-5x bigger army of OoMM by Silvans if I have enough archers and they don't have trolls

[Mithrandir]

But if they do have trolls, they are too powerful.

[King Kong]

Trolls are not generally overpowered, imo. They may be too strong against archers or cavalry, but send 2 (or 3) units of Gondor infantry against the mountain trolls (battle trolls) and they will fall quickly.

@Mith,
When you are making your "battle map balance" you have to test the units against all classes: cavalry, infantry and archers.
And I'm really wondering why you come up with these things now, you could have recognized that in the beta, but it seems you have stopped your battle map tests very early...

[bl4ckfox]

not really KK,

150 citadel guards doesnt kill 1 Mountn Troll, maybe 1 but not more...
I thik they have too much deff... the attack is ok but they dont fall!!!!!

[Mithrandir]

Trolls are not generally overpowered, imo. They may be too strong against archers or cavalry, but send 2 (or 3) units of Gondor infantry against the mountain trolls (battle trolls) and they will fall quickly.

@Mith,
When you are making your "battle map balance" you have to test the units against all classes: cavalry, infantry and archers.
And I'm really wondering why you come up with these things now, you could have recognized that in the beta, but it seems you have stopped your battle map tests very early...

They last a little too long in my opinion, but I'm pretty sure I told you that.

[King Siegfried]

They last a little too long in my opinion, but I'm pretty sure I told you that.

12 trolls vs 150 Fountain Guard = Troll leg for dinner tonight. I walked away with 135 Guards. I think the trolls are just fine. If anything, the Black Numenoreans are a little OP, considering they just simply outclass other bodyguards.