New Traits Help Needed

**Pengo** · April 26, 2009, 01:51 AM

Hi

I've added in some new traits and triggers into the export_descr_character_traits.txt file and added descriptions for them in the export_vnvs.txt file. When I try to run M2TW it crashes before getting to the menu.

Any ideas on what needs fixing?

I'll post the changes I have made if somebody can show me how in include a spoiler in a post

*edit* I think I've got it worked out

**Presbiter** · April 26, 2009, 06:36 AM

lets have a look at your .log-file in the log directory in your m2tw-folder. post it pls, this would help

**Pengo** · April 26, 2009, 06:46 AM

I can't get one. I added the:
[log]
to = logs/system.log.txt
level = * trace

to the Stainless_steel_kingdoms.cfg but I don't get log files. I use No CD .exe, changed back to the needing CD .exe and nothing still, so I don't know. I found my problem was too many "levels" under a trait. Deleted some and it worked, I'm so happy.

**Caesar Clivus** · April 26, 2009, 06:43 PM

Originally Posted by Pengo

I can't get one. I added the:
[log]
to = logs/system.log.txt
level = * trace

to the Stainless_steel_kingdoms.cfg but I don't get log files. I use No CD .exe, changed back to the needing CD .exe and nothing still, so I don't know. I found my problem was too many "levels" under a trait. Deleted some and it worked, I'm so happy.

If you're running vista, it can store the log file as a compatibility file elsewhere on your hard disk. Try turning off UAC.

**Pengo** · April 26, 2009, 07:20 PM

I'm using XP. The game didn't even get past the SS6.2 RR1.3 screen to the first screen with loading bar and quote. Maybe it needs to go further to make an error log.

Anyway until the next unexplained error I'm working things out and it works so I'm happy.

**Pengo** · April 27, 2009, 06:21 AM

I've written this to turn the GoodTaxman trait linked to the town_hall buildings with increases based on chance each turn:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:

Sorry don't know how to do spoilers. I have removed any other relevant triggers for GoodTaxman (only marriage proposals/adoptions have a GoodTaxman trigger apart from above).

Issue I'm having is that the chance rate in game is way too high compared with what I set. Within 4 turns my military minded king has reached threshold 1. Then while he is in a city with only a town_hall he gets to threshold 2 in another 4 turns, which shouldn't happen.

I've tried to link the level of advancement with the level of the relevant structure (town_hall line of buildings in this case), but may remove this to save on EndCharacterTurn triggers. Even if I change it the rate of increase is ridiculous, I've done a few tests and while I set an increase on average 25 turns for Military_Inclined types they get lucky in 4-8 turns.

I'm a beginner at this, I don't know any programming languages, but from what I have done it escapes me what I have done wrong.

*edit* thinking about it is the random number generator not so random?

**konny** · April 28, 2009, 05:49 AM

Chances in triggers seem to work cumulative. That is, when you set up a trigger that only fires once, for example OfferForMarriage, with a "chance 25", you would hardly ever see this being fired.

When you use a trigger that fires every turn, for example EndedInSettlement, with chance 25 you will have it fired after two or three turns by guarantee:

=> turn #1 25%
=> turn #2 50%
=> turn #3 75%
=> turn #4 100%

So, when you use "chance 5" the character will usualy latest after the 20th turn sitting in a settlement acquire this trigger, with a more than 50% chance already after the 10th turn. That way, "sitting around" triggers should not have chances above 1 or 2, when they are not intended to fire very fast.

**Pengo** · April 28, 2009, 06:48 AM

Originally Posted by konny

Chances in triggers seem to work cumulative. That is, when you set up a trigger that only fires once, for example OfferForMarriage, with a "chance 25", you would hardly ever see this being fired.

When you use a trigger that fires every turn, for example EndedInSettlement, with chance 25 you will have it fired after two or three turns by guarantee:

=> turn #1 25%
=> turn #2 50%
=> turn #3 75%
=> turn #4 100%

So, when you use "chance 5" the character will usualy latest after the 20th turn sitting in a settlement acquire this trigger, with a more than 50% chance already after the 10th turn. That way, "sitting around" triggers should not have chances above 1 or 2, when they are not intended to fire very fast.

Mate you are a genius!

**Squid** · April 27, 2009, 10:11 AM

Can you post the complete entries for the trait and the export_VnV entries as well I believe that enums files needs to be updated as well as you haven't mentioned changing that file.

**Pengo** · April 27, 2009, 04:09 PM

The trait levels:

;------------------------------------------
Trait GoodTaxman
Characters family
AntiTraits BadTaxman

Level Good_with_Taxes
Description Good_with_Taxes_desc
EffectsDescription Good_with_Taxes_effects_desc
Threshold 1

Effect TaxCollection 7

Level Thorough_Taxman
Description Thorough_Taxman_desc
EffectsDescription Thorough_Taxman_effects_desc
Threshold 2

Effect TaxCollection 15
Effect Unrest 1

Level Cruelly_Exacting_Taxman
Description Cruelly_Exacting_Taxman_desc
EffectsDescription Cruelly_Exacting_Taxman_effects_desc
Threshold 3

Effect TaxCollection 22
Effect Unrest 2
Effect Piety -1

Level Brutally_Savage_Taxman
Description Brutally_Savage_Taxman_desc
EffectsDescription Brutally_Savage_Taxman_effects_desc
Threshold 4

Effect TaxCollection 30
Effect Unrest 3
Effect Piety -2

I updated the export_vnvs file like this:

{Brutally_Savage_Taxman} Brutally Savage Taxman
{Brutally_Savage_Taxman_desc} No transaction is safe from his taxes.
{Brutally_Savage_Taxman_effects_desc} 30% bonus on tax income, -2 to Piety, +3 to unrest

The other levels already existed so I just changed their descriptions if needed.

**Caesar Clivus** · April 27, 2009, 06:57 PM

Cant be certain unless you post the triggers but from what you said here:

I've tried to link the level of advancement with the level of the relevant structure (town_hall line of buildings in this case), but may remove this to save on EndCharacterTurn triggers. Even if I change it the rate of increase is ridiculous, I've done a few tests and while I set an increase on average 25 turns for Military_Inclined types they get lucky in 4-8 turns.

If you have the chance set at 25, that is going to be a 25% chance of getting the trait which would explain why your guy gets it in 4-8 turns. The chance figure is the percentage chance of getting the trait, not the turns it takes to get the trait. Of course this is all speculation until you post the triggers. If you haven't done what I just described, I apologise. Can you post the triggers also Pengo.

**Pengo** · April 27, 2009, 07:02 PM

Triggers are in the "spoilers", in the post above the post with the trait levels list.

**Caesar Clivus** · April 27, 2009, 07:05 PM

Doh! So they are! Serves me right for posting before my morning coffee

Ok not sure if this is the case at all but I'm wondering if even though each trigger specifies a certain level of the town hall building tree, whether the game still "sees" the lower levels as still being there? So say that you have the Mayor's Palace built which sets off the fourth level trigger. But because the Mayor's Palace is the fourth building in that tree, the game is also firing the other 3 triggers as well because you have already built the lower level buildings to get to the Mayor's Palace. Of course I am just speculating here but I cant think what else would be increasing the trigger rates

**Pengo** · April 27, 2009, 07:08 PM

Quick 10cc's of caffeine stat!

**Caesar Clivus** · April 27, 2009, 07:12 PM

Updated my last post

**Pengo** · April 27, 2009, 08:31 PM

This may happen but this is not the case in my testing. In my testing it happens from turn 1, ie at turn 10 the king has gained threshold 2 in Goodtaxman when 1 as a military minded commander he should not have gained stats so quickly, and 2 the town he is in only has a town_tall, so he shouldn't get to threshold 2 as towns with a town_hall should not test for gains if the......

Oops! Actually if the commanders level for GoodTaxman is 1 then the town_hall trigger will still fire as it stipulates "and Trait GoodTaxman <2"!

So I need to change it to "and Trait GoodTaxman <1"

It still doesn't explain the rapid increase in GoodTaxman trait, as for a military minded commander should get an increase every 25 turns on average, given the combo of "and Trait Military_Minded = 1" with "Affects GoodTaxman 1 chance 4".

Cheers for the help CC

**Pnutmaster** · April 27, 2009, 11:36 PM

Triggers have a habit of firing more often than they should. I observed this when writing disease traits for BBB. You can assign a chance of "5" to a trigger and see it go off three times in 20 turns.

For the sake of experimentation, you could use the condition "RandomPercent" as an extra buffer. Written as, say:

Trigger TaxSkillIncrease
WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd

Condition IsGeneral
and RandomPercent = 50
and Trait Military_Minded = 1
and EndedInSettlement
and SettlementBuildingExists = town_hall
and Trait GoodTaxman < 1

Affects GoodTaxman 1 Chance 8

Additionally, I would try removing the condition "IsGeneral". If your King is the only family member in a settlement, he is its Governor and may no longer be recognized as a general. That could somehow be causing you problems.

**Pengo** · April 28, 2009, 01:02 AM

Cheers for the advice. I will experiment with the randomchance bit and see what happens. Its weird but I'm actually enjoying doing the modification more than playing the game. I'm actually not looking forward to testing because I want to mod more stuff!

**Caesar Clivus** · April 28, 2009, 01:26 AM

Originally Posted by Pengo

Cheers for the advice. I will experiment with the randomchance bit and see what happens. Its weird but I'm actually enjoying doing the modification more than playing the game.

Welcome to the dark side!

Remember: modding leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to your computer being thrown out the window

Seriously though modding is very addictive. I cant even remember the last time I actually played a game, rather than mod it